There goes the Gap Concept

Before I begin, does everyone know the basics of the Gap Concept? You know, needing to hold a better hand to call a raise with than it takes to make a raise with (basically). Well I've noticed, especially in the past year or so, that this seems to be forgotten.

I've been paying alot of attention recently to the hands of players who call raise then proceed to showdown. It's been very noticeable that a good deal, if not almost the majority of these hands have been "inferior". And I'm not just talking about calling out of the blinds with 8h 9h. I'm seeing limping with K 4 off, 7-10, 3-5, then calling a raise, usually OOP. These players are obviously hoping to hit the "invisible" two pair or hidden draw.

Now I understand there's mixing up your play, and early when you're deep, sometimes playing these hands can pay off. But there's an eerie trend towards calling raises with these hands for the same reason you'd want to get in cheep. I'm sure some of these players are fairly skilled at playing these situations, but most seem to either lucksack, or bust.

So anyone know of any reasons for this? Some trend that I am unaware of? Or is there just an influx of new players with more money than skill? I dunno, what do you guys and gals think?

TheKAAHK said:

I'm seeing limping with K 4 off, 7-10, 3-5, then calling a raise, usually OOP...

I'm sure some of these players are fairly skilled at playing these situations...

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I'm sure none of these players are fairly skilled.

I think there are two reasons for this:

1.) People do not study poker, and thus are very bad players. There is a world of poker knowledge out there to be acquired. Some people just "play", and usually do it poorly.

2.) drrrrr. Open your wallet. Look at your ID. Does it say Tom Dwan? If it doesnt then stop trying to play like him.

Happens a lot in lower limits. So many live player on the internet especially. I would continue to stick to the gap concept, but a lot comes down to knowing and observing your opponent, that will allow you to call the jackle live players down with less than optimal hands.

There is a simple explanation: We are all evolved from monkeys, but some are less evolved than others.

The 'Gap Concept' was originally formulated playing LIMIT hold'em-- in NL the implied odds are often great enough that far more "marginal" hands can be played. I think there was a CTs/Tenbob thread where they figured at 400xbb (HU) you should be playing ATC (wish I could find it...).

That being said, calling oop, or cold calling w dominated hands and being unable to get off one/top pair continue to be mistakes that poor players make.

^^^I agree with ag.

Someone else made the point about lower limits, I agree to an extent about that. I see this at mid stakes as well and the only high stakes I play is the PS Sunday Million (when I win a seat).

You also have to consider if the people aren't just playing the players instead of the cards.

My bankroll took a big hit in August and Sept so I've lowered my limits and I find myself playing the people a lot more than I ever did before in mid stakes.

aliengenius said:

The 'Gap Concept' was originally formulated playing LIMIT hold'em-- in NL the implied odds are often great enough that far more "marginal" hands can be played. I think there was a CTs/Tenbob thread where they figured at 400xbb (HU) you should be playing ATC (wish I could find it...).

That being said, calling oop, or cold calling w dominated hands and being unable to get off one/top pair continue to be mistakes that poor players make.

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Completely agree, in fact after reading the OP, that was exactly what I was going to say.

I would add, that I feel that in NL, the gap concept applies more on the flop than it does preflop unlike in limit where it is most preverlent pre-flop.

A lot of earlier NL literature was rehashed limit literature, and so gap theory appears in older NL books but tends to be mentioned less in newer books because it simply is dwarfed PF by implied odds and post flop its easier to talk in terms of equity than gap.

That said it is still very preverlent in limit poker (which was the form of poker it originated from).

..ive noticewd this myself...not just in small games..but in live tourneys like 100Euro buy ins...i remember once, i raised pre flop AQ, and player in mid position called k5suited..and it was like 4times bb raise late on near bubble...i won the hand thankfully, but it was showndown... i asked why he called the raise preflop with such a marginal hand... he replied "its one of my fav hands, plus its suited so theres loads of out"...i was very surprised, my fav hand is AA, preferably suited