Originally Posted by tenbob
I think that youve just made a huge over-generalisation of the whole concept of MTT play Storm. Of course every time someone sits down to play a tournament they are not saying, "oh 19th would be nice here", we are playing to win. However, there are lots and lots of situations where we find ourselves with a medium stack in the mid-stages where looking to take a race will be more favourable in 5 hands time when the bubble bursts rather than now when we face elimination with nothing.
There is also lots of ways, to accumutate chips in the latter states of MTT's whilst holding a solid image as well, stop and go's, check-raise bluffs, positional steals, re-steals from the blinds etc etc.
There are table considerations to take into account, where the big stack is sitting in relation to you, will the BB call you button steal because his stack size dictates it ? Are the medium stacks allowing you to pick on them or are they regulary fighting back ? What is the buy in ? Is it a satelleite ? Did you sat into a big event or is it a $2MTT ? What is the size of the field ? How deep are the average stack ? What is your M and Q in relation to the average ? I could go on.
We get into lots of situations in MTTs where playing to place in the money can be very correct, and lots of times (most) where its incorrect, but playing for a "win" is an over-simplification of an advanced concept, and something that cannot simply be discussed in one post, there is full books on this stuff.
I think the conceopt of "always play to win" should certainly apply up to a point, but you will find yourself it many situations where it's just not the correct play. And, a lot of factors help determine this I don't for a minute believe that open shoving with ATC is justified just because you fall below 10bb, or evew 5bb. Not if applying the brakes is to your advantage. Partly, as Jay touched on, and TB above, there are BR issues for many to consider., and if sitting on a marginal hand instead of going for broke, and going broke is an important comsideration, I see no disgrace in doing just that.
Of course, we all play to win. And every time you sit down, if you don't consider yourself a serious threat to win, you're sitting in the wrong place. But at some point, reality is gonna bite, And how you react to that impacts your stats, your BR, your imahe, both table image and SELF image. Of course, it's a purely personal decision how you handle these situations.
As for the small ball concept, I see good and bad points to consistently playing this style. I've adapted elements of it to my game, with nixed success, and I'm of the opinion (strictly my own) that it doesn't necessarily adapt well to online play.- There are times it's effective, but it relys too much on factors that are beyond me in a MTT settne. It's impossible to read unknown opponents well enough to really be effective, particularly at stages in a tourney when you might be moving every few hands.
It's not a simple black/white issue, and we're obv. not going to convert one another no matter how much or long we discuss it; it's a basic tenent of each person's poker philosophy.