LAG questions

ph_il · Jul 9, 2007

Im really trying to make the transition from TAG to LAG. Especially while playing SNGs and MTTs. I have a few questions:

1. What range of hands do should I raising with? Re-raising with? And in what position?
2. I know position plays a big part. I tend to raise a lot in late position and in mid position if no one has entered, but what about in EP? I dont want to become to predictable.
3. During the early rounds, when blinds are small and if my table allows it, should I try limping into a lot of pots and hoping to flop something decent?
4. Should I be more aggressive PF than on the flop?
5. If I raise PF, how often should I C-bet?
6. I understand aggressive play, but what exactly is the meaning of 'loose'?
7. What should I be raising PF if Im holding a less than great hand? Im thinking 2.5x - 3x the BB, so if I get re-raised I can fold if I need to. On the flop, how much should I C-bet if I hit it? If I miss it?

8. On bodog, I usually play the $3+.30 - $10+$1 SNGs. If Im trying to get into a more LAG playing style, would it be wise for me to continue playing at these levels? Or should I drop to the lowest level ($2+.20 Beginner SNG) so I can get a feel for the LAG style while minimizing losses?
Thanks for all the help.

bob_tiger · Jul 9, 2007

well i will give u my opinion on this....yup ur right position is what it all about but its not only yr position its who ur playing against...like for example if ur a tight table u wanna be the boss of the table and rather take down bunch of small pots than play bingo and take a chance of losing yr stack. but then if u have bunch of lose players thats when u might not wanna raise before that player to act unless u have a strong hand and if ur trying to steal blidns against loose players it doesnt work very well. also u might wanna change up the raising and the best ur making the betting patterns to confuse other players. also on yr 3rd one....i would say yes definitely like lets say u have 45h and blinds r low and u limp in...and flop comes 2c 3s 6d just an example...and if ur up against a tight player and lets say he/she is trying to slow play u with AA and a lot of times tight players will push all in thinking they r safe not expecting u to have that 4 5 and since there is no flush draw they r not 2 worried....and then if ur up against a loose player that will play hands like A6 and crap like that he is gonna think he is good and goign to try to push u out of the pot on the flop with a big bet....always let the loose players bet in to u but dont ever let them have a free river unless u know u got the hand and they r drawing dead. personally i play lag during the first hour of the tourney and then tighten up. gl and i hope this helps ( im not very good at explaining stuff but i tried) lol

Ronaldadio · Jul 9, 2007

Before I try to answer the question I have one question for you - Why do you want to change from TAG to LAG???

ph_il · Jul 9, 2007

bob_tiger said:
well i will give u my opinion on this....yup ur right position is what it all about but its not only yr position its who ur playing against...like for example if ur a tight table u wanna be the boss of the table and rather take down bunch of small pots than play bingo and take a chance of losing yr stack. but then if u have bunch of lose players thats when u might not wanna raise before that player to act unless u have a strong hand and if ur trying to steal blidns against loose players it doesnt work very well. also u might wanna change up the raising and the best ur making the betting patterns to confuse other players. also on yr 3rd one....i would say yes definitely like lets say u have 45h and blinds r low and u limp in...and flop comes 2c 3s 6d just an example...and if ur up against a tight player and lets say he/she is trying to slow play u with AA and a lot of times tight players will push all in thinking they r safe not expecting u to have that 4 5 and since there is no flush draw they r not 2 worried....and then if ur up against a loose player that will play hands like A6 and crap like that he is gonna think he is good and goign to try to push u out of the pot on the flop with a big bet....always let the loose players bet in to u but dont ever let them have a free river unless u know u got the hand and they r drawing dead. personally i play lag during the first hour of the tourney and then tighten up. gl and i hope this helps ( im not very good at explaining stuff but i tried) lol

Not to be an ass or anything, but WHAT?

stormswa · Jul 9, 2007

philthy said:
Not to be an ass or anything, but WHAT?

I got through two sentenses, then I had to go get my son so he could explain to me what half the abriviations meant. After taking 10 minutes to read the 1st two sentences and seeing how incorrect they are I gave up.

going to go through his post now to try to figure it out, one second let me quote it. I will also get to your origional post in second.

bob_tiger said:
well i will give u my opinion on this....yup ur right position is what it all about but its not only yr position its who ur playing against

ok let me stop you right here, now you are talking about 2 different things in same sentence. At 1st you are right it is all about position and if you are in position that means they are out of position, get it?

...like for example if ur a tight table u wanna be the boss of the table and rather take down bunch of small pots than play bingo and take a chance of losing yr stack.

ok this statment is the most confusing thing I have ever read in my life, if you are at a tight table you want to be the boss of your table, so actully you should play loose at a tight table but you are saying play small pots?

but then if u have bunch of lose players thats when u might not wanna raise before that player to act unless u have a strong hand and if ur trying to steal blidns against loose players it doesnt work very well.

this is actully correct here, you always play the opposite way your opponents are playing if they are tight you are loose, if they are loose you are tight.

also u might wanna change up the raising and the best ur making the betting patterns to confuse other players. also on yr 3rd one....i would say yes definitely like lets say u have 45h and blinds r low and u limp in...and flop comes 2c 3s 6d just an example...and if ur up against a tight player and lets say he/she is trying to slow play u with AA and a lot of times tight players will push all in thinking they r safe not expecting u to have that 4 5 and since there is no flush draw they r not 2 worried

ok 1st of all tight players dont limp with AA, usually lag players are the ones that limp with AA trying for a limp re-raise because of their image.

....and then if ur up against a loose player that will play hands like A6 and crap like that he is gonna think he is good and goign to try to push u out of the pot on the flop with a big bet....always let the loose players bet in to u but dont ever let them have a free river unless u know u got the hand and they r drawing dead. personally i play lag during the first hour of the tourney and then tighten up. gl and i hope this helps ( im not very good at explaining stuff but i tried) lol

no kidding

ph_il · Jul 9, 2007

Ronaldadio said:
Before I try to answer the question I have one question for you - Why do you want to change from TAG to LAG???

I dont want to change my style completely. I want to have a better understanding of it. Especially for when I play MTTs. I can make it deep playing TAG, but not deep enough. And if I do manage to make it really deep, Im usually short stack. I have a hard time mixing up my game sometimes and I really think If I have an understanding of how LAG play works, I might be able to do better.

So, all in all, I just want to get a better understanding of a LAG playing style and hopefully, mixed with a TAG style, I might be able to do better/place better in MTTs, MTSNGs, etc.

shinedown.45 · Jul 9, 2007

Ronaldadio said:
Before I try to answer the question I have one question for you - Why do you want to change from TAG to LAG???

I think she may mean she wants to expand from TAG to LAG, not to completely change her playing style but to implement LAG play into her strategy.

bob_tiger · Jul 9, 2007

philthy said:
Not to be an ass or anything, but WHAT?

lol sry im not very organized...but basically i will put this into steps for ya...this is how i would play in a tourney

1- 1st hour start of by playing lag and looking at a lot of flops if yr table lets u....a lot of times u might hit str8 and even a flush with small suited connectors which will get u a nice big pot.

2- i honestly hate how a lot of ppl try to just grind it to make it in to the money....i think if u can win one big one it will make up for the other ones so that means sometimes u have to take risks if u want to be a looose player like for example daniel negreanu i think he is a loose player but he knows when to fold

3-if u want a nice chip stack and want to ft the tourney u have to be aggresive during first hour and get a nice stack to take the tourney down and if u just sit tight and have about a medium stack then at some point ur going to have to bingo and u cant always win coin flips and crap like that.

4-u got to get used to the table ur at...if ur a tight player....raise when u can to make yr hand look strong ( also know when to fold and watch out for traps) but if ur at a loose table with a lot of ppl raising and goign all in every hand just wait for a very strong hand and bust one of them since a lot of loose players like to play A rag...A7 and crap like that.

5-2 be honest phil ivey could come in here and give u tips....but actually its all up to u...u have to be able to adjust to the players ur playing against. and i dont know if u watch poker on tv or not but for example daniel negreanu will raise u from sb or the button with a hand like 89 suited and a lot of times he will take it down on the flop ( he wins a lot of small pots but thats live) so i would suggest not to get all tricky and crap like that on here especially on stars cuz u know u some of the bad beats

6-and one last thing...make sure when ur chasing u know u have a lot of odds...u wont always hit but if the other player is betting small and letting u chase then do it...but i really hate putting my stack in on a draw i like to have the best hand when im all in....also sometimes u just have to say f it and take risks to build up a nice stack. it just depends if u think ur lucky enough to hit or if u think ur not 2 lucky and ur not hitting 2 many cards. this one is up to ya.

ph_il · Jul 9, 2007

shinedown.45 said:
I think she may mean she wants to expand from TAG to LAG, not to completely change her playing style but to implement LAG play into her strategy.

Im a guy.

The girl in my avatar is 'Annette_15'.

stormswa · Jul 9, 2007

philthy said:
Im really trying to make the transition from TAG to LAG. Especially while playing SNGs and MTTs. I have a few questions:

1. What range of hands do should I raising with? Re-raising with? And in what position?

in order to raise you have to either be in position on origional raiser or be in a position where it looks like you have monster like the blinds. Try not to do this with total garbage but more like hands that could hit big.
2. I know position plays a big part. I tend to raise a lot in late position and in mid position if no one has entered, but what about in EP? I dont want to become to predictable.

even LAG players do not play that many hands in EP because you really do need position on the players in order to outplay them postflop. Play tight from EP.

3. During the early rounds, when blinds are small and if my table allows it, should I try limping into a lot of pots and hoping to flop something decent?

thats fine as long as you are strong enough to fold it on flop

4. Should I be more aggressive PF than on the flop?

no your aggression level should not change throughout hand

5. If I raise PF, how often should I C-bet?

you c-bet when the flop texture is dry, bottom line.

6. I understand aggressive play, but what exactly is the meaning of 'loose'?

loose pretty much refears to starting hand requirements.

7. What should I be raising PF if Im holding a less than great hand? Im thinking 2.5x - 3x the BB, so if I get re-raised I can fold if I need to. On the flop, how much should I C-bet if I hit it? If I miss it?

the same amount

8. On Bodog, I usually play the $3+.30 - $10+$1 SNGs. If Im trying to get into a more LAG playing style, would it be wise for me to continue playing at these levels? Or should I drop to the lowest level ($2+.20 Beginner SNG) so I can get a feel for the LAG style while minimizing losses?
Thanks for all the help.

thats up to you, do what you feel comfortable doing, but be careful expect to lose some money before you are real comfortable playing this way.

hope this helps.

ph_il · Jul 9, 2007

That helps a lot. Thanks, Storm.

bob_tiger · Jul 9, 2007

stormswa said:
hope this helps.

im gonna have to dissagree with #4 when u said yr aggresion level shouldnt change....i personally think if u see that yr opponent is on a str8 draw or some kind of a draw u want to bet strong and be more aggresive to push him/her out and not let him/her hit the str8 or w/e that person is chasing..but thats my opinion and it usually works for me

stormswa · Jul 9, 2007

bob_tiger said:
im gonna have to dissagree with #4 when u said yr aggresion level shouldnt change....i personally think if u see that yr opponent is on a str8 draw or some kind of a draw u want to bet strong and be more aggresive to push him/her out and not let him/her hit the str8 or w/e that person is chasing..but thats my opinion and it usually works for me

your giving incorrect odds all the way down so it shouldnt matter. what is LAG? loose aggressive right? so you are being aggressive anyway so how are you going to change that?

are you going to push all in to avoid someone chasing a flush? of course not you want them to chase that flush. Its a 33.3% chance of hitting so if you bet 3/4 pot guess what the odds are incorrect but he might still call which is what we want. Why the hell would you want to chase a draw out is beyond me?

Like you said if you know he is on a draw then the hand is sooo simple to play. You'r betting patterns should not change during the hand or you are going to be sooo readable. Flop comes down 2 spades and you bet 3/4 pot he calls, turn no spade 3/4 pot and he calls river spade he check and you check behind, he catchs flush. Now replay that hand 10 times and see what your profit is since we will win 7 of those hands? we are folding the river no matter what so we win a lot more then we lose in this hand. You shove all in on flop because you are scared of the flush draw then you are losing so much value in your hands.

stormswa · Jul 9, 2007

not trying to pick on you but some of these are really really way off.

bob_tiger said:
lol sry im not very organized...but basically i will put this into steps for ya...this is how i would play in a tourney

1- 1st hour start of by playing lag and looking at a lot of flops if yr table lets u....a lot of times u might hit str8 and even a flush with small suited connectors which will get u a nice big pot.

agreed

2- i honestly hate how a lot of ppl try to just grind it to make it in to the money....i think if u can win one big one it will make up for the other ones so that means sometimes u have to take risks if u want to be a looose player like for example daniel negreanu i think he is a loose player but he knows when to fold

agreed

3-if u want a nice chip stack and want to ft the tourney u have to be aggresive during first hour and get a nice stack to take the tourney down and if u just sit tight and have about a medium stack then at some point ur going to have to bingo and u cant always win coin flips and crap like that.

STOP: this is incorrect in soooooo many ways. ok so you are saying we need a big stack in the 1st three levels right? ok so lets pull up a tourney on pokerstars right now....

3rd level is 50/100 which means if we folded for 1st hour we would still have id say about 1200-1300 in chips which is still 12-13 big blinds and we would have a great table image. If you can manage to double your stack just 1 time in 1st hour we would have 30 big blinds and that is beyond good at this point. If we could add 50% to our stack we would have 22 big blinds which is again fine. Anything over 20 big blinds here is fine so there is no reason to go nuts in 1st hour and try to get massive stack.

now im not saying playing that way is wrong but I dont think anyone should say you have to build a giant stack in 1st hour.

4-u got to get used to the table ur at...if ur a tight player....raise when u can to make yr hand look strong ( also know when to fold and watch out for traps) but if ur at a loose table with a lot of ppl raising and goign all in every hand just wait for a very strong hand and bust one of them since a lot of loose players like to play A rag...A7 and crap like that.

ok fine

5-2 be honest phil ivey could come in here and give u tips....but actually its all up to u...u have to be able to adjust to the players ur playing against. and i dont know if u watch poker on tv or not but for example daniel negreanu will raise u from sb or the button with a hand like 89 suited and a lot of times he will take it down on the flop ( he wins a lot of small pots but thats live) so i would suggest not to get all tricky and crap like that on here especially on stars cuz u know u some of the bad beats

he is raising those hands on the button because he has position and he dosent C-bet unless the flop texture is good. His had is favored over a random blind hand, he dosent do it just for heck of it there is a reason.

6-and one last thing...make sure when ur chasing u know u have a lot of odds...u wont always hit but if the other player is betting small and letting u chase then do it...but i really hate putting my stack in on a draw i like to have the best hand when im all in....also sometimes u just have to say f it and take risks to build up a nice stack. it just depends if u think ur lucky enough to hit or if u think ur not 2 lucky and ur not hitting 2 many cards. this one is up to ya.

the 1st sentence makes me smile. Shoving on draws is not about if you feel lucky or not its about your fold equity. It depends on a lot. A lot of time it is the correct play to shove on that draw on the flop.

the biggest problem I have is with #3, I think this could not be more incorrect.

Ronaldadio · Jul 9, 2007

A couple of point if I may

Playing TAG does not mean you won`t build up a decent stack. I play a TAG game and About 30% of the time I make the $$$. Early in MTT, small stakes, ppl will push with a wide range of hands, so waiting for AQ+/ JJ+ is worth it.
Has anyone mentioned chip stack? If you have a healthy chip stack by playing TAG you can then loosen up against the shorter stacks, obviously if they seem to be playing TAG also.

Search

LAG questions

ph_il

...

bob_tiger

Legend

Ronaldadio

Legend

ph_il

...

stormswa

Legend

ph_il

...

shinedown.45

Legend

bob_tiger

Legend

ph_il

...

stormswa

Legend

ph_il

...

bob_tiger

Legend

stormswa

Legend

stormswa

Legend

Ronaldadio

Legend

About CardsChat

Our Community

Our Site

Follow us

Language