Jamming own flush draws when not short?

quick

quick

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Is it ever generally correct to jam your own flush draws in a cash game full ring? For example I'm seeing players with Ax and sometimes any two suited shoving on a 3 to the flush board regardless of what's out there. I'll be holding something like a flopped straight, a set, or 2P and they happily shove all in with air hoping to catch a flush.

This is a trend I've noticed more in online poker than live (specifically in the micros as I work on my various BR challenges) in the past few months.

But to me it doesn't seem to be a long term winning move since we can expect to hit our flush roughly 1 out of 3 times. I can see perhaps when short it being worth it or when facing a larger pot with more than 2 other players in the hand, but against a single opponent it seems like a losing play.
 
naruto_miu

naruto_miu

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Is it ever generally correct to jam your own flush draws in a cash game full ring? For example I'm seeing players with Ax and sometimes any two suited shoving on a 3 to the flush board regardless of what's out there. I'll be holding something like a flopped straight, a set, or 2P and they happily shove all in with air hoping to catch a flush.

This is a trend I've noticed more in online poker than live (specifically in the micros as I work on my various BR challenges) in the past few months.

But to me it doesn't seem to be a long term winning move since we can expect to hit our flush roughly 1 out of 3 times. I can see perhaps when short it being worth it or when facing a larger pot with more than 2 other players in the hand, but against a single opponent it seems like a losing play.

I guess It really depends on different factors to give you an accurate answer, but to me, I don't like open jamming/donk jamming flush draws In general but more so prefer to C/Jam flush draws (If I'm planning on jamming flush draws In the first place). I feel that "Donk Jamming and/or open jamming a flush draw" just screams "I have a flush draw", while the C/Jam A.I play could be seen as 2 pair+ and gives you more added credibility, again this varies depending on player+how much you have left, and as you stated If you're short or not. Now If you were like 100BBs deep or even say 50BB's deep, I wouldn't be C/Jamming a flush draw nor would I open Jam the flush draw, but would take a different line with It. Now If I were say 30<BB's with It, than It would really depend on, how I find the villain to be playing vs me and/or In general (that would dictate my course of action)
 
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BanOne28

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I generally wouldn't jam my draws unless short, I'd prefer to build a sizeable pot and then take it down when I hit and mostly give up when I miss, throwing in bluffs as well to balance my range
 
Aces2w1n

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Is it ever generally correct to jam your own flush draws in a cash game full ring? For example I'm seeing players with Ax and sometimes any two suited shoving on a 3 to the flush board regardless of what's out there. I'll be holding something like a flopped straight, a set, or 2P and they happily shove all in with air hoping to catch a flush.

This is a trend I've noticed more in online poker than live (specifically in the micros as I work on my various BR challenges) in the past few months.

But to me it doesn't seem to be a long term winning move since we can expect to hit our flush roughly 1 out of 3 times. I can see perhaps when short it being worth it or when facing a larger pot with more than 2 other players in the hand, but against a single opponent it seems like a losing play.



When you have Axsuited hearts hand and the flop goes 2d8h7h

When you bet and he overshoves.... think about whats calling him.

Worst case scenario a straight and a set. He's flipping against overpairs and top pairs.

And people who make mistakes by chasing flushes with lower flush draws which have reverse implied odds.

Also 9T will come along for the ride. and 2paired hands...

lets say you all have $10.... between 9 players 10NL

UTG raises 30c ... Hijack and CO call and you follow on the button and ofc SB and BB joins the part. No one squeezes for this example, we could easily but this time nope.

flop goes 2d8h7h
POT roughly $1.50

UTG raises to $1. Hijack calls CO calls...
Now if we raise to say $2.50 or $3.... and we miss our draw on the turn... what now??? We get in a sticky situation especially when UTG bets into us again now or shoves on turn.... We feel sick.

Our flush draw only gets its full equity from seeing the turn and river, if we get denied the river then we have made a very terrible play and wasted money

So sometimes to avoid they will shove on flop with these draws. It's all situational and through experience and messing around you can find out what works best for you.

This is just a very rough example.


So in summary,
You like to give yourself the best opportunity to see turn/river
And realise that flop play or shoving is often high variance line. So expect a lot of ups and downs.
 
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