I suppose its all over for me.

My attempt at trying to make money from online poker has always been a rocky one. Time and time again I tilted and had to lower the stakes due to reduced bankroll. However I have reached the absolute lowest point of my poker venture and just looking at this makes me depressed at just how much profit I have blown away. This was money that actually mattered.



I destroyed 4NL from the get go. Took quite some time but eventually crushed 10NL, there was nothing particularly difficult about 10NL but some of my insane tilting sessions meant that my winrate was far from ideal. Anyways 20NL was surprisingly easy and only required a little change of play against the good lag players which are almost non existent on the lower levels. The level of fish at 20NL was possibly worse than even 4NL.

Now I was all set for 50NL and this is what has turned out to be an utter disaster. I admit to getting owned by the lag players at 50NL, they often made me lose my cool with their persistent betting. However it really wouldn't have been this bad had it not been for those tilting sessions. No I didn't blow away a grand in tilt but a lot of it is attributed to it.



I still have around 250 profit left which is good enough for me to play 20NL but I am really disheartened at myself. Going back to 20NL after having a bankroll of over 1200 at one point is just going to feel so sad. So I am thinking of just cashing out something while I can. And really 20NL is never going to give a satisfactory hourly rate for me since I just cannot play more than 4 tables.

I still feel very confident about my live game but maybe online multitabling isn't for me. I suppose I should give MTT's a shot.

I know I am running way below EV but that's really not an excuse. I was once running way above it and I know that I haven't experienced an unusually bad run or something as EV doesn't really tell the whole story.

I would just give one advise to everyone if you think I am worthy of giving one lol. Never make river bluffs in online poker upto 50NL as its never ever going to be worth it.

If I had the money I would still dearly love to play 50NL as I haven't given up on battling the regs there its just that I don't have the bankroll anymore and don't currently have personal money to afford those stakes. So maybe I'll be back one day.

Hey man, I read this post as I know exactly what it feels like to want to give up, and to be susceptible to tilt also.

But don't give it up, I used to have a sticky note on my desktop for when I was tilting or on a downswing that said "You made all that money before, you can make it again!" and "Don't go looking for other games" two things I would suggest for you now.

MTT variance is so much worse than cash, I came from MTT to STT to Cash recently and I can't see myself going back now, although it isn't going great at all so far!

Also as I do tilt I bought the tilt breaker App for HEM2 - worth every penny mate you need to get it! stops me playing once I've lost 3 buy ins so that's as bad as my night can get. It's essential for me.

If you want to add me on Skype and discuss strategies, hands etc as I'm trying to work my way up the micro limits too feel free to add me.

I can go along with EchoEllis. Don't give up. And for me it was not easy going back down. But I love to play poker and I like buying into real money tournys and ring games. So to do that I had to go down if I want to keep some money to play. But because of the advice I got here, I backed off from playing so much where I do have money and play some freerolls for awhile and it has worked. I'm still not playing there much but when I do, I win a few $ and I quit for awhile again. And I'm going to keep doing that until I build my bankroll back up. All this took place because I had a 3 week bad run. Hang in there.

I think having a downturn like that is a major milestone in poker. It is probably better to hit that milestone early rather than late in your career....just keep doing what you are doing and hopefully it will be all up from here. Oftentimes you have to hit rock bottom before you can reach the summit.

maybe you're just not ready for 50NL yet? Downswings are inevitable mate, if you're confident in your game there's no reason to give up, with every massive downswing there's going to be a massive upswing. If it's not down to bad play and tilting I wouldn't worry too much about it, if you can't afford to lose the money then you shouldn't be playing at all.

thatgreekdude said:

maybe you're just not ready for 50NL yet? Downswings are inevitable mate, if you're confident in your game there's no reason to give up, with every massive downswing there's going to be a massive upswing. If it's not down to bad play and tilting I wouldn't worry too much about it, if you can't afford to lose the money then you shouldn't be playing at all.

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Ya I am not quite sure if I am good enough for 50NL. I did make a pretty spectacular start though was up 1000 BB before the epic downfall.

It IS down to bad play and tilt and that's why I am depressed. If majority of my big losses were down to coolers then I wouldn't even think about quitting. Most of my bad plays have been barreling entire stacks with air after running out of patience of hitting big hands.

I think I would be sitting at break even if I had played well, I definitely ran bad in the sense that I would still be on a downswing if I played sensibly but it wouldn't be this bad.

I am very conflicted as to what sort of a player I want to be at 50NL. I tried to change the ABC tag game but then when I see the sort of hands that call me with my well thought out bluffs I really wonder if ultra patience tight poker is the way to go even at this level. Just that the win rate won't be the same.

Its definitely a very difficult level. The amount of 3 betting and C betting is just insane. The ultra spewy fish is far and few. It just feels like "gambling".

Thinker_145 said:

Ya I am not quite sure if I am good enough for 50NL. I did make a pretty spectacular start though was up 1000 BB before the epic downfall.

It IS down to bad play and tilt and that's why I am depressed. If majority of my big losses were down to coolers then I wouldn't even think about quitting. Most of my bad plays have been barreling entire stacks with air after running out of patience of hitting big hands.

I think I would be sitting at break even if I had played well, I definitely ran bad in the sense that I would still be on a downswing if I played sensibly but it wouldn't be this bad.

I am very conflicted as to what sort of a player I want to be at 50NL. I tried to change the ABC tag game but then when I see the sort of hands that call me with my well thought out bluffs I really wonder if ultra patience tight poker is the way to go even at this level. Just that the win rate won't be the same.

Its definitely a very difficult level. The amount of 3 betting and C betting is just insane. The ultra spewy fish is far and few. It just feels like "gambling".

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you are right in saying it's essentially gambling at 50NL, the higher up you go the harder it is going to be to find an edge and make money. If you're tilting and playing bad just don't even bother you're not doing yourself any favors if you continue playing through it, I guess that's just something you're going to have to work on. I don't think ABC is going to cut it at this level, you need to add new weapons to your arsenal if you're planning on becoming a consistent winner at 50NL. Wish you all the best in the future and I know you will make the right decision in regards to what level you'll be playing at for now. Good luck.

When you say crushed $4nl and $10nl, is that prior to these 115k hands?

All I see in that graph is breakeven play for 86k hands then an up and downwing

I just had a session of 10NL after a very long time and I destroyed it haha. The level of play is just so bad it seems unreal coming from 50NL.

I know I am really good at destroying fish so at least I have something going for me.

Thanks everyone for the cheerful responses. I suppose I could grind 20NL again, get some of my confidence and bankroll back and then see how to proceed.

BTW can someone tell me how does online 50NL compare to casino 200NL? I have never played at a casino only live games with friends. I pretty much never tilt when playing live as there is so much time to gather myself in and after a hand.

Do you suppose its possible to make it big in poker without being a big online player?

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Bro, $10nl online is equivalent to $200nl live. Except $200nl live is way more limping family pots preflop. Average villain's going to be something like 40/5/0.8

Hi again Thinker 145. I just wanted to post here again to see how you are doing now. I keep thinking about how you put it in the subject "I suppose it's all over for me" That sounds so bad. I really hope you are doing better. Just put your pride aside and go back down. I had to do it and my funds are a lot lower than yours. But really it has put the fun back into the game for me. Don't give up!

Thinker_145 said:

BTW can someone tell me how does online 50NL compare to casino 200NL? I have never played at a casino only live games with friends. I pretty much never tilt when playing live as there is so much time to gather myself in and after a hand.

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Don't worry about that yet. Get your game back and worry about it when your time to progress there comes.

Stay patient and work on progressing your game.

PapaC said:

Hi again Thinker 145. I just wanted to post here again to see how you are doing now. I keep thinking about how you put it in the subject "I suppose it's all over for me" That sounds so bad. I really hope you are doing better. Just put your pride aside and go back down. I had to do it and my funds are a lot lower than yours. But really it has put the fun back into the game for me. Don't give up!

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Thanks a lot mate this forum has always been very helpful to me it made me a player that at least wins the micro stakes comfortably. It wasn't actually an easy journey to transform myself from a zynga player to owning real micro stakes. So I suppose it was never supposed to be easy to own the upper stakes.

I have decided to play 4 tables of 10NL for now when I have my discipline and confidence back I'll get back to 20NL.

I think the big mistake I made in 50NL was playing 4 tables, definitely should not be playing more than 2 tables on a level that one is not entirely comfortable with regardless of bankroll. So that's what I plan to do whenever I get back to 50NL, strictly just 2 tables paying full attention and see if I can figure out things to get an edge on the level.

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Ok I hardly ever play more than 2 tables at a time because I'll be staring at one and miss another. But I did play 3 tables yesterday on 3 different sites. Take your time man. And if it makes you feel any better you are not alone. And I know how it feels when you move up a level with the bigger bets and bigger pots