Folding set on river

F

Frozrbyte

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 9, 2015
Total posts
101
Chips
0
I had a hand where I folded a set on the river.

888 Poker - $0.04 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

MP+2: 111 BB (VPIP: 43.59, PFR: 10.26, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, hands: 40)
CO: 206 BB (VPIP: 13.19, PFR: 7.45, 3Bet Preflop: 2.05, Hands: 856)
BTN: 92.5 BB (VPIP: 20.42, PFR: 4.36, 3Bet Preflop: 1.53, Hands: 673)
SB: 77.25 BB (VPIP: 39.47, PFR: 5.26, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 39)
Hero (BB): 121 BB
UTG: 103 BB (VPIP: 14.86, PFR: 4.57, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 178)
UTG+1: 133.5 BB (VPIP: 23.93, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 118)
MP: 30 BB (VPIP: 19.18, PFR: 13.70, 3Bet Preflop: 6.82, Hands: 146)
MP+1: 140.75 BB (VPIP: 15.38, PFR: 11.54, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 157)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 6c 6d
fold, UTG+1 calls 1 BB, fold, fold, MP+2 raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, SB calls 2.5 BB, Hero calls 2 BB, UTG+1 calls 2 BB

Flop : (12 BB, 4 players) 8d 3d 9c
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, MP+2 checks

Turn : (12 BB, 4 players) 6h
SB checks, Hero bets 9 BB, fold, fold, SB calls 9 BB

River : (30 BB, 2 players) Ad
SB bets 30 BB, fold

SB wins 28.25 BB

Would you guys have called? I tanked and almost timed out. i just don't think he will be betting that big with top pair. I don't think he has a straight on the turn and slow played it. I think they rarely bluff here. I was so tempted to call though. I didn't have enough hands on the villain and probably levelled myself
 
Ozzzzy

Ozzzzy

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Total posts
60
Chips
0
If he had flush he'd semi-bluffed on flop I guess, also he could have A3, AJ, AQ, AT. Easy call for me.
 
F

Frozrbyte

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 9, 2015
Total posts
101
Chips
0
If he had flush he'd semi-bluffed on flop I guess, also he could have A3, AJ, AQ, AT. Easy call for me.

That did cross my mind. It was probably a bad fold. i had just lost a couple pots A7s vs AA on A75 rainbow flop and 99 vs 77 pre flop all in where the villain turn a set. I guess that affected my decision making.
 
Karozi615

Karozi615

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 20, 2012
Total posts
517
Chips
0
I don't think this is a terrible fold at all? Why would the small blind "semi-bluff diamonds on the flop" when that player is first to act with players in front? That sort of play would only work in position, furthermore it would be extremely -ev against 3+ players.

SB would always check diamonds, perhaps with the intention to check raise (which would still be a bad play). Once the turn bricks, the SB pretty much goes from 35-40% equity (if they have an A they are considering is good) to 18-23% equity (the +3 aces are conceivable outs).

At this point the small blind is incapable of winning a big hand. The draw is undisguised, and the villain is OOP which is exactly why a "semi bluff" is virtually impossible.

When SB leads the river it is extremely polarizing and most likely diamonds. However, you have a vastly underrepped hand and therefore SB could be value betting an Ace +pair peel that turned into two pair.

The fold seems totally fine and standard, I would even make this fold at 25nl but playing microstake's it can be really hard to find the fold button in these spots. You should be proud of this fold it shows development as a player, even if your thought process wasn't as in depth as it will be.
 
C

colacho

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 28, 2013
Total posts
64
Awards
1
Chips
3
I had come , as surely completed two pair with A, but had chances straight and flush ..
 
G

gklcap

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 9, 2015
Total posts
159
Awards
1
Chips
0
SB is a calling station based on your stats. If he is the kind of guy who would call a substantial bet on the turn with say something like A9 or even 2 overcards on a wet board, then I think you should've called the pot bet on the river. I think it's more likely that his pair improved to 2 pair or he hit top pair with the ace. However, folding a set on a board with straight and flush possibilities is definitely not a bad fold.
 
L

leorulex

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 10, 2015
Total posts
71
Chips
0
i think he have two par because dont semi-bleff in the flop for a flush draw, just call it
 
Marcwantstowin

Marcwantstowin

Member of the T.S.T
Moderator
Joined
Feb 23, 2013
Total posts
16,458
Awards
18
GB
Chips
380
Hiya Frozbyte. I think he probably hit two pair on the river. He may have had a small pair on the flop, then hit two on the river. To me that would explain his betting sequence? I would think A8, in his hand. I probably would have called on the river, not fold, but in any case I don't think it was a bad fold.

At the end of the day, you did not have much info on him, but then again how do you get alot of the info is by making those sort of calls. As long as you are using good BR management, then you won't go bust and it will help in the future.

Gl in the future. Marc :D:D:D
 
S

somersetlad9

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Total posts
190
Chips
0
Seems that he hit 2 pair on the river. I would generally snap call with any set on that type of board as there is very little beating you. At 4NL you should just play the hands. The fact you levelled yourself means your overthinking your spots. All experience nonetheless
 
M

Mug

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Total posts
55
Chips
0
At the micros, that is a call in my opinion but only by a slim margin. I can't put it any better than those who have posted already. The small sample of stats that you have support the idea that he is a poor player, a calling station, and chances are good that he hit 2 pair on the river. If the river was anything something other than an Ace I might think differently. Calling stations love them some ace/rag. You are you going to be wrong and lose the hand occasionally. But I think this situation will pay more often than not. Against a player that you have a lot more information on, I think it is easier to lay down without too much second guessing.
 
F

Frozrbyte

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 9, 2015
Total posts
101
Chips
0
However, you have a vastly underrepped hand and therefore SB could be value betting an Ace +pair peel that turned into two pair.

Knowing that my hand was underrepped was what made me so tempted to call but villain did not seem to the type of player who thinks that far ahead in terms of opponents range. I was really torn between calling and folding. It's never a good feeling to fold a set. His bet was actually slightly more than pot(32-33BB) even though poker tracker states it at 30BB which means he just clicked the pot button since that's how pot size bets work in 888. That and him not being aggressive in previous hands just gave me suspicions that hit a flush and clicked pot. I think I probably would've called a 1/2 pot bet because I don't really have to be right as much to breakeven.

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I really appreciate it. I'm really trying to improve my game as much as I can.
 
F

Frozrbyte

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 9, 2015
Total posts
101
Chips
0
I did feel that he might be a calling station from the way he played so far but i had only 39 hands on him so I don't think it's quite right for me to label him as 1 yet. My overall stats are about 24-25/ 18/9 over huge sample of hands but I've had instances where I sat at a table and I didn't get a lot of hands or spots to raise/bluff /steal for 40-50 hands.

I did also feel that he might have 2 pair but like I replied to Karozi615, since villain clicked the pot button which gave me suspicions that his hand may actually be better than 2 pair. I think it was really a tough spot spot me then.

It's a worst feeling to fold a set compared to AA or KK at the river. LOL
 
Folding in Poker
Top