Extracting value

I'm playing 10 NL

I think my flopped sets are not being payed enough.I'm thinking i should put myself in a process of putting my opponent on a hand range and depending on the board ocassionally slowplaying the flop,to give them the oppportunity to catch something.

Is that the right way to be thinking or should i continue betting the flop right away?

Also,i'm thinking my AA and KK are not being payed enough when i'm 3 bet IP.What i usually do it 4bet-shove when i'm 3 bet.Is that the right thing to do or should 1 4 bet 2,5 X 3bet to get payed more?

Should i ever call the 3bet IP instead?


I know they are generall questions and that ''it depends''.I'd just like a better idea of what your thought process is at those situations.

At 10NL just bet, bet, bet with sets otherwise you will miss value

Flatting 3bets with AA and KK is fine sometimes, especially if you think they are likely to fold to a 4bet, for example because you suspect they are 3betting light. Generally I prefer 4betting to ~2.5X rather than shoving when I have AA or KK

micromachine said:

At 10NL just bet, bet, bet with sets otherwise you will miss value

Flatting 3bets with AA and KK is fine sometimes, especially if you think they are likely to fold to a 4bet, for example because you suspect they are 3betting light. Generally I prefer 4betting to ~2.5X rather than shoving when I have AA or KK

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Can you give me reasons why 2,5 is better than shove?

Sometimes a shove looks stronger, sometimes a 2.5x 4ebt looks stronger, it depends on who you are up against and the history between you.

2 cases where it might be better:

If you think there is any chance that they might perceive the 2.5x as a re-steal and 5bet.

If they are a calling station fish who is capable of flatting a 2.5x 4bet with stuff like AQo or AJs (which they might fold to a shove).

bet, bet, bet
pot, pot, pot
There's no need to get tricky at micro stakes, the bad players will pay you
I think you might as well donk bet out even if you are first to act and weren't the initial raiser, because if you check-raise it looks like you are really strong and could scare people off. If you donk bet out it looks like you might be bad or just trying to steal the pot. Like if the guy has AK and raises pre, you call from BB with 44. Flop is 24J rainbow. If you donk bet, he probably calls. If you check-raise, he probably folds. Just my opinion.

Like you said, it really depends on the player. Use a HUD and make individualized decisions based on how people play.

Reptar7 said:

bet, bet, bet
pot, pot, pot
There's no need to get tricky at micro stakes, the bad players will pay you
I think you might as well donk bet out even if you are first to act and weren't the initial raiser, because if you check-raise it looks like you are really strong and could scare people off. If you donk bet out it looks like you might be bad or just trying to steal the pot. Like if the guy has AK and raises pre, you call from BB with 44. Flop is 24J rainbow. If you donk bet, he probably calls. If you check-raise, he probably folds. Just my opinion.

Like you said, it really depends on the player. Use a HUD and make individualized decisions based on how people play.

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Of course i will donk bet.I never understood why you have to follow initiative and not bet with something like top pair when you are OOP and don't have initiative on flop.

Is there a reason not to bet in that situation?

billatx said:

Of course i will donk bet.I never understood why you have to follow initiative and not bet with something like top pair when you are OOP and don't have initiative on flop.

Is there a reason not to bet in that situation?

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Oh, it wasn't clear from your initial post. You asked if you should slow play and let people catch up, which I think is just a ridiculous thing to do at like 10NL and below.

I suppose that in that situation I gave there could be a reason not to bet based on someones stats. Like if they are a 8/8 tag who bets every street when they bet but they fold to reraises 95% or something. So basically that person has AA-TT and they will bet the whole way and you can call down and then rr at the end. That would be risky but maybe the optimal play against someone like that if you knew that is how they played.

Again, way too complicated to ever apply at 10NL or below.

Reptar7 said:

Oh, it wasn't clear from your initial post. You asked if you should slow play and let people catch up, which I think is just a ridiculous thing to do at like 10NL and below.

I suppose that in that situation I gave there could be a reason not to bet based on someones stats. Like if they are a 8/8 tag who bets every street when they bet but they fold to reraises 95% or something. So basically that person has AA-TT and they will bet the whole way and you can call down and then rr at the end. That would be risky but maybe the optimal play against someone like that if you knew that is how they played.

Again, way too complicated to ever apply at 10NL or below.

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Yes,bad why is donk bet considered bad by many people?

It is considered bad because quite often the people that do it haven't the slightest clue what they are doing.

Donk betting isn't bad. A mis-used donk bet (which is what most of them are) is bad. The same as triple barreling with air isn't bad but a lot of the time triple barreling at the micros is bad. A donk bet is not often optimal and the spots most people choose to use them certainly isn't optimal.