Calling min raises from the BB.

Do you call with anything reasonable getting over 3:1? Obviously fold the garbage hands but if you have a hand that you believe is only a 2:1 or 2.5:1 dog (for all 5 cards) should you call even being out of position? I've been experimenting lately and I've been calling more with hands in the BB, hands like 8 5 suited or 10 9 or king 6. I've had mixed results, most of the time I'm check folding but sometimes I hit a flop hard or flop something playable.

Here's an idea. Put a piece of paper and a pen next to the computer. Write down everytime you call a min raise from the BB. Then write down how much more you lost for calling and how much more you won for calling. I would say you loose more than you win over the long haul if you're calling with 8 5, 9 10, or K 6. I make the call from time to time, but it really depends on many factors. My cards, the amount of people in the hand, the style of play of the opponents in the hand, etc...

Bentheman87 said:

I've been experimenting lately and I've been calling more with hands in the BB, hands like 8 5 suited or 10 9 or king 6. I've had mixed results, most of the time I'm check folding but sometimes I hit a flop hard or flop something playable.

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Playing a hand like 85s out of position is much harder than playing it in position. If you're going to check-fold every time you don't hit you probably shouldn't make these calls.

Consider a few of your options:
a) 3-bet the min-raiser and follow up with a c-bet in case he calls
b) flat call, but lead out on the flop
c) flat call, and check-raise
d) fold (a hand like K6 is certainly a fold)

Also make sure to not automatically read a min-raise for weakness. Tons of people will min-raise with AA because they want to encourage action.

The mini raise with AA may want to encourage action but more then likely those whom have limped allready just normally call. Which then gives the AA's more of a chance to get cracked because they tried something fancy with them. Like the saying goes, one would rather win a small pot with AA's then lose a big pot, all because they tried to get fancy with the mini raise. I personally only use the mini-raise for 2 reasons, times it works and times it don't. Reason one, while holding suited connectors, and in early position when I have flopped something especially against 1-2 opponents. Most of the time they will then raise my mini-raise which now initially gives me the opportunity to re-raise.

Now I don't always use the mini-raise, yet it is nice to have it in one's aresenal of tools.

like snr said, keep track of how much you win and lose when you do this. i used to do this, but realized that it slowly chips away at your stack, and before you know it, your down 100-200 chips. yes, occasionally you will win a hand and get paid off big, but overall, you will lose more than you win.

"like snr said, keep track of how much you win and lose when you do this. i used to do this, but realized that it slowly chips away at your stack, and before you know it, your down 100-200 chips. yes, occasionally you will win a hand and get paid off big, but overall, you will lose more than you win."

But the fact is that it's mathematically correct to call. For example, if a player min raises with an AK offsuit and it's folded to you in the small blind and you have 7 4 offsuit, and he flipped over his hand and showed you AK, then you would still call since you're not even a 2:1 underdog and you're getting over 3:1. But I'm asking does being out of position negate the good pot odds?

decisions will be pretty difficult after the flop unless you hit two pair or nothing, depending on the table. the way i play is that i like to have easy decisions after the flop because i do not trust myself enough to make the tough calls, and i do not trust myself to lay down a hand that could be best. its all based on how you play, if you can let hands go or not. to answer your question though, i believe that being out of position does negate the good pot odds, but i have no data or information to prove this, it is just how i play, and my opinion.

Bentheman87 said:

For example, if a player min raises with an AK offsuit and it's folded to you in the small blind and you have 7 4 offsuit, and he flipped over his hand and showed you AK, then you would still call since you're not even a 2:1 underdog and you're getting over 3:1. But I'm asking does being out of position negate the good pot odds?

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You're just under a 2:1 dog if you see five cards. If you see only the flop, things are looking worse.
But that's not nearly as important as the fact that you don't have position.

Let's give you a decent flop against AK, say 7 high rainbow. You lead out, he raises you, knowing that his representing a small overpair will probably make you fold. Now what? A good player will use his position, and there's very little you can do unless you have a strong hand, i.e. at least two pair.

Again,

Tourney? Ring?
Stage of tourney?
Stack sizes?
Reads?
Antes?

Again as a general answer to your very general question, in rings I'm often seeing flops with a very wide range since our effective odds are great, as are our implied odds. In a tournament however, I'm often folding for strategic/metagame reasons.

Be more specific and you'll get much better answers.