Advanced Ranging of Opponents

Hi all,

Something that came up in my hand history reviews this month. When responding to Villain actions Pre-flop (e.g 3Bets,4Bets, Squeeze etc) I look at the stats first. For example with a 3Bet of 7% I'd be assigning a base range of (88+,AQo+,KQo,AJs+,KQs,QJs - 88 Combos) plus whatever else I've observed in their depolarised range. However, it seems to me that most Villains would be ditching many of these hands (Even if the stat reads 7%). It seems more likely that the actual range is tighter in reality (Let's say the top half, 3.5 .... just as a benchmark)

Does anybody have any methods they'd like to share about how they more accurately pin point 3bet/4bet ranges and also O and C ranges IP? I'd be interested in hearing about how your techniques are working for you.

Thank you

Grinderella

Not too sure if this is what you are asking but the 3b% is basically elastic depending on position vs position.

7% is the base of their 3 bet range. As you change positions of you and villain that range is different. If the SB is 3 betting your UTG open you can imagine their 3b range is around 3%. If they are 3 betting from the SB vs your button open, their 3b range is around 12%.

Cheers

Thank you, sorry if the post was confusing:

I am asking:

"When a particular Vilain has a stat of x% for whatever behaviour it is (3Betting, 4Betting etc), is there a smart way to revise x% up or down and narrow the suspected range?"




In response to your answer:

1. Am I correct in assuming that the SBs 3Bet range is wider in response to the BTN, as BTN is likely to be opening the full length of their range?

2. How did you arrive at 3% and 12%?

3. Do we effectively use their position as a slider to adjust the range of their action?

E.g.

3Bet happens from BTN >> Best position >> Assign full range.
3Bet Happens from SB >> Worst Position >> Use top end of range (But how much of the top?)


Example1

Hero opens UTG 3bb w JJ
Villain MP2 3Bet (3x) with a 3Bet range of 7%
Villain is IP for the remainder of the hand, so what would you assign as his 3Bet%?

Example2

Hero opens UTG 3bb w JJ
Villain SB 3Bet (3x) with a 3Bet range of 7%
Villain is OOP for the remainder of the hand, so what would you assign as his 3Bet%?


I realise that there are many factors to consider but this purely a toy game example to see how others would handle it.

Thanks

Grinderella

I feel that what @IPlay says is very much so in 6max, but surely 9max has a bit different values?

1. Yes you are, also that SB you play out of position, so playing from there is harder and you are mostly just happy to win the pot right there without seeing the flop. Also if SB just calls, BB gets very good price in and if he calls, SB needs to play OOP against two players.

2. He probably just looked the stats of good tags, they mostly look just like that (in 6max). Now these are behavior of good player and especially in 2NL not that common. However when player starts to understand the game, more and more it shifts to this. It’s usually starts however by 3betting KK+,AK etc every position every time, in inelastic manner (position has no meaning).

3. We do use mainly our position to adjust, secondary theirs.

Because of 3. Example1 the key factor is your position UTG. The villain is going to be the nittiest of all in his strength (if he is thinking player) and we can assume (for example) his range is 3% {KK+,AK, and few bluffs). CO can call in micros quite wide here, because UTG open is so strong hardly anyone is ready to squeeze, also he has the position. 6max, I have a feeling 9 max is different.

Example 2, again your position UTG is main factor. Your question is actually advanced stuff and I don’t know the answer. So going to read it from the book fast: Value range about same tight {KK+,AK} some bluffs but only like on blue moon, tighter calling range than from CO.

Yes I am talking about 6max but the same concepts apply to full ring, they will just be tighter.

1. Yes, The wider your opening range is from a certain position, the wider villains 3b range will typically be. Now don't let this fool you because some players are not positionally aware and don't adjust well. My post is mainly vs other decent regs.

2. Pretty much what Brave said, it is from my own stats and the stats of other good regs in my player pool. Which mainly have 6-8% 3 bet ranges.

3. Yes, just like with opening ranges, We fold AJo from SB vs UTG open, but folding AJo vs BTN open is criminal. You should apply these same concepts to 3 bet ranges. As opens get closer to button we can 3 bet wider for value so we also need to 3 bet wider as a bluff also so that is how some players end up with ~12% 3b from SB(I'm one of them)

In your E.G. examply SB is actually going to be the widest 3b position and most good regs play 3b or fold from the SB vs BTN & CO opens.

Example 1.

Assuming this is 6m MP is probably going to 3b ~4% MP vs UTG so we can probably give him a range of something like JJ+ AK, A5s, KQo

Once again assuming 6m, this one is a bit more tricky and play is probably going to vary quite a bit. Some will still 3b or fold vs UTG and will have a range like 99+ AJs+, AQo+, JTs, T9s. Some will flat and 3 bet super premiums with some bluffs. Really villain dependent.

Thank You

Thanks very much guys for these fantastic answers. This advice instantly improved my game over a very short sample. The point about 3bet ranges widening OOP as the raiser approaches BTN was one of those "DUH" moments where somebody else just needs to say it and then it clicks ... also I found the tagline "Bum Hunting at 25NL" very funny. Keep it up ... before they close your table!

Cheers

G