Adjusting your game

U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
I have been thinking a lot recently about adjusting to our opponents play. It's discussed on a fairly regular basis, but not really to an in depth level. But it is, I believe, the most critical skill that a good poker play can develop.

When you notice that an opponent has certain tendencies (tight, loose, aggressive, passive, etc.) it is important that you conform you play to take advantage of that kind of play.

This sounds pretty simple. Someone plays too tight, you loosen up. Someone plays too loose, you tighten up and value bet. Straight forward, right? Wrong.

Adjusting is not that simple. You must first be able to accurately assess what the deficiency of the player you are against is. You must do this quickly. The faster you can adjust your play, the more hands you have to take advantage of the adjustment you made. Perhaps more important than speed is accuracy of your adjustment.

I think this is where most of the worse players really make their mistakes. They adjust wrong. They over adjust or under adjust. Typically people over adjust. They see someone playing too tight and they WAAAAAAY loosen up. Wrong call. Loosen up a little, percentage points in the low single digits.

The worse player does two things wrong. They over adjust and they do it with too little information, or too quickly. They get 3bet from the blinds once when they steal and then never steal again.

If you want to improve your game, first focus on making the right adjustment. Really focus on the manner in which you should adjust your game.

Look at your default game and make a conscious decision as to what the adjustment you make is going to be. Define that hand range. If you know, to a certainty, what your actual hand range will be when you adjust then you will be able to adjust more accurately when you do it.

I have personally written out my hand ranges. They deviate from the normal hand ranges a little based off my experience, what hands I play profitably, and how I feel they play postflop. But I know my default. I know what hands I throw out when the play is too loose and I need to tighten up my game. I know what hands I add in when I think its time to widen up.

I have made all of these decisions before I sit down to play. The hands are pre-determined and I can now focus on the decisions in the game, not whether or not I will play this hand this time. My adjustments are already decided too.

Now that I know what to adjust to, I need to get better at doing it more quickly. that part is more hard, and I don't have good answers on it.

Play tight, learn how to adjust, but don't go overboard.

Anyone else's thoughts on adjusting to your opponents and how you adjust to them would be interesting to hear.

EDIT - I wrote "hear," should be read. I only hear what you type when I read it out loud because I'm learning impaired.
 
suby_rafael

suby_rafael

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 24, 2014
Total posts
1,039
Chips
0
My thoughts about adjusting are close to what you have summed up. I try to adjust similarly. The only thing i don't do is have written hand ranges as i don't think that's necessary. I try to go by my instincts and what i feel like is the right thing to do in that situation. Obviously i make mistakes every now and then but i know it and try to be better next time in similar spot.

Well written though.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 3, 2013
Total posts
5,781
Chips
0
Players playing loose could mean you can open your range slightly as well.

Instead of 4betting just AK+ we are now doing AQo ... Heh very marginal tweak :)

We can treat JJ and 10s as prems.
 
Figaroo2

Figaroo2

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Total posts
7,363
Awards
16
Chips
13
Have you checked out John Anhalt's latest training video based on his hitman hud?. The link is posted in the polished poker cash games thread. Its an excellent overview of using hud stats to quickly assess a players tendencies and how to adjust your play to exploit them. I am a great believer in this, this is how to significantly improve your profit margins.
I remember posting a hand earlier in the year when I copped a lot of flak for calling a 3 bet oop with JT suited. I had done this as an adjustment to the 3 bettor who was showing a hud stat of 100% 3 bet when coming into a hand with zero agg on turn or river. I would never call in such circumstances normally but no one would listen to the adjustment argument. By the way I always enjoy reading your excellent postings on the forums. Dont think people arent listening to your wise words.
 
U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
Figaroo2: I have not looked at that video, but probably will. I dont use a HUD. Part of the reason is that my opponents are reacting to the situation they ARE in, not the one they once WERE in. I dont think HUDs are bad, I justthink you ca get better at poker more quickly without them. I do usePokertracker to track myself, though. And thanks for the compliment.

Suby_Rafael:why dont you write down your hand range? Is there any advantage to not having a set hand range? And doesnt having that set range decrease the number ofdecisions you have to make so you can worry about more important things?

Aces2win: Loosening up like that requires a very specific opponent. They need to be aggressive as well as loose. Then you can modify your value range, but your not "loosening" up exactly. Yournotstealing and raising more, you are just treating your mediocre holdings as a more valuable holding.


thanks for the comments guys.
 
S

Sneaky Feet

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 2, 2014
Total posts
583
Chips
0
Great thread topic that I'm looking forward to following.

I recently finished reading a number articles specific to this topic that I found very helpful. I don't use a HUD either and find that adding notes about tendencies has greatly increased my win rate.

To paraphrase from the articles the basic read on villian can be if they're tight or loose. Once that has been decided one can adjust hands played. As a sub topic for each each villain, one can decide if they tend toward passive or aggressive play. For a passive player I've found that by adding a note such as "need strong betting range" vs. an aggressive opponent where a note like "need strong calling range" would be more effective.

As one plays against each villain and gains more information notes for more specific tendencies can be added. 3bets often, likes to see the turn, bets hard on scare cards, folds to 4bets. All of these I have found add to an already nuanced game.
 
B

bradwilk

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Apr 17, 2008
Total posts
8
Chips
0
Have you checked out John Anhalt's latest training video based on his hitman hud?. The link is posted in the polished poker cash games thread. Its an excellent overview of using hud stats to quickly assess a players tendencies and how to adjust your play to exploit them. I am a great believer in this, this is how to significantly improve your profit margins.
I remember posting a hand earlier in the year when I copped a lot of flak for calling a 3 bet oop with JT suited. I had done this as an adjustment to the 3 bettor who was showing a hud stat of 100% 3 bet when coming into a hand with zero agg on turn or river. I would never call in such circumstances normally but no one would listen to the adjustment argument. By the way I always enjoy reading your excellent postings on the forums. Dont think people arent listening to your wise words.

Figaroo, can you post or send me the link, please? Can't find it...
 
B

bradwilk

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Apr 17, 2008
Total posts
8
Chips
0
I have personally written out my hand ranges. They deviate from the normal hand ranges a little based off my experience, what hands I play profitably, and how I feel they play postflop. But I know my default. I know what hands I throw out when the play is too loose and I need to tighten up my game. I know what hands I add in when I think its time to widen up.

I have made all of these decisions before I sit down to play. The hands are pre-determined and I can now focus on the decisions in the game, not whether or not I will play this hand this time. My adjustments are already decided too.

Now that I know what to adjust to, I need to get better at doing it more quickly. that part is more hard, and I don't have good answers on it.

So have you made a chart? May i ask how did you did it?
 
U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
So have you made a chart? May i ask how did you did it?

I basically pulled it from my own hand histories. I looked at what hands made me money in different positions and how I had played them.

I then looked at what some of the outliers were and what happened in those hands. I took that and then made some decisions on some hands where the sample size wasn't large enough to make a good decision and weighed how well I thought the hand would play post flop. Then I took a pen and paper and literally wrote it down.

It took some time, but I think that kind of analysis is needed to really improve your game.
 
Figaroo2

Figaroo2

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Total posts
7,363
Awards
16
Chips
13
"Now that I know what to adjust to, I need to get better at doing it more quickly. that part is more hard, and I don't have good answers on it."

I would suggest to you it is use of a stats/notes on your opponents that allows you to profile them immediately and adjust your play immediately, having a HUD allows you to do this.
It depends of course on what stakes you are playing as I think the whole HUD stats idea works better at low stakes. As players move up they will be varying their play more.
People are lazy, they do what works for them and don't change without good reason; this is why collating their stats works. We can learn from their history to predict their future behaviour.
Knowledge is power at the poker table why not have that extra knowledge to help you make better informed decisions?
I thinks John's training outlines all this perfectly, the second video is much more in depth.
http://acepokersolutions.com/Free_Poker_HUDs.php
 
D

DunningKruger

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 7, 2013
Total posts
1,030
Chips
0
Tailoring your play to your opponent(s) is critical ofc and it's nice to see a topic emphasizing this because players don't understand or at least do this nearly enough. They tend to group "regish" players all together, think about poker in terms of should I 3bet tens pre when EP opens, or whatever. The whole loosen up vs tight players and tighten up vs loose players is ridiculous though. I'd be pretty surprised if anyone still thought like that. This is definitely not how to approach a poker game.

Regarding HUDs, they are always useful and moreso in tougher games than in easier ones. You generally want as much information as you can gather when you're making decisions, provided you know how to properly use that information. There are players who actually do play better without an HUD simply because they misuse the stats that are available to them.
 
U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
The whole loosen up vs tight players and tighten up vs loose players is ridiculous though. I'd be pretty surprised if anyone still thought like that. This is definitely not how to approach a poker game.

I'm not 100% certain I take your meaning. As a general concept this is definitely true. If you have tight players in the blinds you loosen up your steal range. If you have loose players in the blind you tighten it up.

If you have a tight player UTG who leads you can loosen your call range and steal postflop. If someone calls loose to your preflop raise then you need to tighten up your cbet range be more value based - unless of course they are tight when they call your cbet, in which case you can cbet more loosely. I feel like there are a number of examples of "if they are tight then you should play loose, if they are loose you should play tight."

Of course, like anything in poker, this is not an exact thing. However, as a broad principle in adjusting to peoples play... yeah this is the way to approach a poker game.

EDIT- I would except, "this is not always how to approach a poker game." "[D]efinitely not..." is definitely wrong.
 
D

DunningKruger

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 7, 2013
Total posts
1,030
Chips
0
No. This is patently absurd. Throw out everything you're saying here and reevaluate the concept from the ground up imo. When a loose player and a tight player play each other, who has the advantage? The loose player or the tight player? By playing tight against a loose player they are then playing loose against a tight player and vice versa. It's entirely symmetrical, and absolutely the wrong line of thinking in terms of exploiting players for the hands they are (or aren't) playing/betting.

The real adjustments you ought to be making should be intuitive to most players by the time they get to around ssnl or probably beforehand, and depend on the scenario not to mention things like aggression etc. In terms of general theory, I recall a discussion with Tri (SlowHabit) about this very topic. He mentioned in one of his books that against someone playing exceptionally loose you should loosen up but not play quite as loose as they are. Likewise against someone playing exceptionally tight you should tighten up but still play a little looser than them so that you're always closer to the theoretical equilibrium than your opponent. He made a number of good points iirc about why to do this. I have my own thoughts on the matter ofc (and my work is a little more quantitative in nature) but to be perfectly frank I'm not inclined to share them right now. I've been known to suggest however during poker discussions with players seeking advice to loosen up against people that are playing either too loose or too tight for their own good and tighten up against tougher players that actually know what they're doing and who possibly have an edge on you. This is over generalizing obv.

If you have a tight player UTG who leads you can loosen your call range and steal postflop. If someone calls loose to your preflop raise then you need to tighten up your cbet range be more value based

This isn't true. The wider they're calling the wider you can bet for value... which is pretty much the opposite of tightening up. Against someone playing too many hands and weakening their overall range you can suddenly play a lot more hands against them profitably than you would otherwise be able to. As a simplistic example of what I'm getting at, suppose someone is shoving all in pre about 40% of the time they're dealt a hand. 40 vpip is very loose even for 6max and if you call with a hand like ATs you'll be at the minimum a 3:2 favourite or thereabouts. AT isn't really a hand you'll want to call shoves with from much tighter players obv, but here it's practically a monster. Suppose they double the number of hands they're playing and now jam around 80% of the time. Are you then going to tighten up and wait around for QQ+? No. You can now profitably call even wider than before in fact QTo is a clear favourite against such a range.
 
U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
This isn't true. The wider they're calling the wider you can bet for value... which is pretty much the opposite of tightening up. Against someone playing too many hands and weakening their overall range you can suddenly play a lot more hands against them profitably than you would otherwise be able to. As a simplistic example of what I'm getting at, suppose someone is shoving all in pre about 40% of the time they're dealt a hand. 40 vpip is very loose even for 6max and if you call with a hand like ATs you'll be at the minimum a 3:2 favourite or thereabouts. AT isn't really a hand you'll want to call shoves with from much tighter players obv, but here it's practically a monster. Suppose they double the number of hands they're playing and now jam around 80% of the time. Are you then going to tighten up and wait around for QQ+? No. You can now profitably call even wider than before in fact QTo is a clear favourite against such a range.

It's not too far off from what I was saying actually.

If you have a loose player who calls, then you should "tighten" to value cbets. You don't need to cbet 100%, or even 80% because you can rely on your value. You don't steal as often, because you have value and don't need to steal.

You even said that against a tight player you should play tight, but looser than them. Its relative. Since most people should be playing tight by default, tight but still loose... probably looser than your standard line.

Tight and loose is relative to the player you are against. Again, the fundamental principle of tight v. loose and making those adjustments is still correct.

I think you are more nitpicking than anything else. Maybe you disagree with the terminology, but the only credible argument you offered was that you can bet for value wider against a loose preflop caller. I agree with that - you should be stealing less (play tighter). If someone is tight you can steal more broadly (play looser).

Obviously you expand your value range if someone is playing like a maniac (shoving 40% of their hands). But do you play tight to them (relatively) or loose? tight. Against the tight player do you play tight (relatively) or loose. Exactly like you said, you play loose.
 
D

DunningKruger

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 7, 2013
Total posts
1,030
Chips
0
To be honest your reply warrants a more thorough response than what I'm about to give, but all I really want to add is that I'm really not being nitpicky at all. I made a number of pertinent points that are important for anyone who might happen to read this topic to be aware of (in particular that playing loose against a tight opponent simply makes them play tight against a loose opponent and vice versa). Even if things are spun to suggest that loose and tight are now relative only to the play of your opponent, you still aren't tightening up against a loose player unless your default is some kind of uber drooler who thinks the fold button pertains to doing laundry or w/e and thus never uses it. Since you're actually doing the direct opposite it's a critical distinction to make here imo. You're also confusing loose/tight with bluffing frequency otf.
 
R

rapidfire1269

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Dec 22, 2013
Total posts
14
Chips
0
Tight and Loose Tables

Adjusting your play to your opponent is Poker 201. How many of us adjust our play to the level of aggression at the table? A maniac forces all at the table to play looser and take risk that they would otherwise not take. Recognizing this effect on a table can be profitable.

I have been making mental notes about specific instances that occur at my tables while playing. I develop a strategy for countering this action and then I execute the strategy and, with pen and paper, keep a record of how it performs. It has been eye opening. I now have a hard copy of actual statistics telling me if my new strategy is working. I am not relying on my memory or prejudices, real hard facts. It eliminates frustration and builds my confidence at the poker table. I now know what works and the kind of results to expect.

Great topic and thanks for all the intelligent perspective.
 
newbie in training

newbie in training

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Total posts
1,043
Chips
0
i adjust sometimes on 9 man sng(the only thing you can adjust to on bovada on the regular basis) and normally when it gets down to 4 or 5 people i try a few steals and see who folds and who fights back

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk 2
 
U

Ubercroz

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Total posts
653
Chips
0
i adjust sometimes on 9 man sng(the only thing you can adjust to on bovada on the regular basis) and normally when it gets down to 4 or 5 people i try a few steals and see who folds and who fights back

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk 2

I play on Bovada and am often adjusting to my opponents in 6max cash games. you take notes, you pay attention to how they react, and you adjust as is appropriate. You have to be patient to find the spot to exploit them, but you can still adjust on bovada.
 
torbush77

torbush77

Rising Star
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 4, 2014
Total posts
19
Chips
0
I am a beginner player. should I use in the game of poker calculator
 
R

rapidfire1269

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Dec 22, 2013
Total posts
14
Chips
0
Yes. Use your poker calculator. It is surprising how strong some pocket cards are and how weak others.
 
Faust

Faust

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Total posts
94
Chips
0
I think the same as you do. I do a general report about the table im about to play and for each player i have a different strategy depending on the levels of tightness and looseness. This general report of course it's not accurate, but i stick to it from the beginning. After the game develops i keep reporting and if i have to change my strategy i do it in a blink of an eye, because i know that other players may adjust to my game too. This is also very risky, specially when you are playing with good players that change their game style quickly, but once you catch up it's very efficient.
 
Top 10 Games
Top