9K vs JCgrind HU: River w/ Mid 2P

OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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just wanted a check up on my thought process + other opinions. (maybe i'm a massive nitball)

JCgrind's been 3betting to these weird big sizes all game, folded to 1 4bet out of 4 3b's.

one hand before this he 3b QJs bet bet x/c river on J9xddd x x

my river thinking was basically this:

Choopski thinks I'm a nit in this spot so I basically only ever bet sets, straights, flushes and maybe AJ in this spot. I 4bet most of my hands that make sets (AA/JJ/TT) or raise earlier in the hand so he can discount those, but really my river betting range here is pretty polarised between air/weak hands i'm turning into bluffs and flushes.. mostly leaning towards flushes because most of the hands I get to the river with have a lot of SDV.

he never checks any of his strong value range to check/jam for value because he expects me to check back a lot of my range in this spot that isn't flushes/straights.

we can assume that his range is capped here, but I dont think that he knows that I know this.. so me betting this river is essentially me turning my hand into a bluff. he has some slightly better hands/slightly worse hands/ and air that's giving up anyway that I crush.

that ok?

PokerStars - $0.10 Ante $0.02 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 2 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: $22.02 (VPIP: 43.40, PFR: 41.51, 3Bet Preflop: 30.43, Hands: 55)
Hero (SB): $16.44

Hero posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10, 2 players post ante of $0.02

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.19) Hero has J:spade: T:diamond:

Hero raises to $0.20, BB raises to $1.10, Hero calls $0.90

Flop: ($2.24, 2 players) A:spade: 3:heart: T:spade:
BB bets $1.17, Hero calls $1.17

Turn: ($4.58, 2 players) J:club:
BB bets $2.79, Hero calls $2.79

River: ($10.16, 2 players) 5:spade:
BB checks, Hero checks
 
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hackmeplz

hackmeplz

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River's probably fine but I really dislike pre.
 
JCgrind

JCgrind

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one hand before this he 3b QJs bet bet x/c river on J9xddd x x

i believe i bet, bet, x/snapcalled, then lolled at you for bluff shoving in such an obv spot. :)

Choopski thinks I'm a nit in this spot so I basically only ever bet sets, straights, flushes and maybe AJ in this spot. I 4bet most of my hands that make sets (AA/JJ/TT) or raise earlier in the hand so he can discount those, but really my river betting range here is pretty polarised between air/weak hands i'm turning into bluffs and flushes.. mostly leaning towards flushes because most of the hands I get to the river with have a lot of SDV.

this isnt what i thoguht at all. yeah i think youre a nit, but you think im a station fish, so i definitely expect you to stick a bet in with ace paint. knowing the frequency that i double barrel, and my own 3b range, i honestly think not putting in a small bet OTR with like, A6+ is probably losing value

also, wtf is your 'air/weak hands' on this river? what hands are you turning into a bluff?theres literally like zero combos?

he never checks any of his strong value range to check/jam for value because he expects me to check back a lot of my range in this spot that isn't flushes/straights.

not the exact opposite of my thought process, but still not at all it.

PokerStars - $0.10 Ante $0.02 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 2 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: $22.02 (VPIP: 43.40, PFR: 41.51, 3Bet Preflop: 30.43, Hands: 55)
Hero (SB): $16.44

Hero posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10, 2 players post ante of $0.02

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.19) Hero has J<font color='black'>♠</font> T<font color='red'>♦</font>

Hero raises to $0.20, BB raises to $1.10, Hero calls $0.90

Flop: ($2.24, 2 players) A<font color='black'>♠</font> 3<font color='red'>♥</font> T<font color='black'>♠</font>
BB bets $1.17, Hero calls $1.17

Turn: ($4.58, 2 players) J<font color='black'>♣</font>
BB bets $2.79, Hero calls $2.79

River: ($10.16, 2 players) 5<font color='black'>♠</font>
BB checks, Hero checks[/QUOTE]

ps, i changed my cc sn for a reason you dweeb. stop posting stars sn
 
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OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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misclick, sorry dude

this isnt what i thoguht at all. yeah i think youre a nit, but you think im a station fish, so i definitely expect you to stick a bet in with ace paint. knowing the frequency that i double barrel, and my own 3b range, i honestly think not putting in a small bet OTR with like, A6+ is probably losing value

also, wtf is your 'air/weak hands' on this river? what hands are you turning into a bluff? theres literally like zero combos?

yeah there is like zero combos, when I wrote this I was tired and not thinking too well..

I dunno how often you bet bet x/c that river w/ like A5s though especially since you think my range is so strong right? AK/AQ are like the only hands I get value from if you x/c them.

I guess you could expect me to value bet kinda thinish here given your rep as a station but I still figured you thinking me a nit > you thinking me thinking you're a station :albertein
 
JCgrind

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i cant believe theres been no action on this post at all, i thought every man and his dog would have an opinion as to whether or not you should bet or check back OTR and itd be a huge trollfest by now. WHY DOES NOBODY CARE :'(

tbh not sure how often i b, b, x/c either, but it still has to be relatively frequent to account for the times you bluff the river w a 'hand w SD val thats probs behind'
 
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LD1977

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Wait, why are you playing 10NL now, didn't you play like 50NL before?

Also, why ante table?

P.S. I play FR and there is dynamic going on here so I can't really contribute.
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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p.s. stop playing FR

I play HU Sngs for anyone that didnt know about the switch, moneys pretty good
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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nope

talk about the hand! I thought it was an interesting spot..

I think its a check back for reasons specified but JC thinks its a value bet because he x/c's AQ/AK/Axs? there.. I dont think he should be and probably gave him more credit for folding there than maybe he deserved because he's an australian station

also anyone got any ideas on how to combat JC's 5x 3betting strategy?
 
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swingro

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nope

talk about the hand! I thought it was an interesting spot..

I think its a check back for reasons specified but JC thinks its a value bet because he x/c's AQ/AK/Axs? there.. I dont think he should be and probably gave him more credit for folding there than maybe he deserved because he's an australian station

also anyone got any ideas on how to combat JC's 5x 3betting strategy?
Easy. Shove:)
 
duggs

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its a bet for me, 4bet him wider, and flat the top of your range when you dont think he is going to spazz pre.

why switch to HU sng btw?
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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people are saying ship river as a bluff to get folds a ****load, it is stationchoop but given our reads he should fold here a lot to a jam?

others are saying its a check and JC thinks its a value ship

and call a pretty tight range which we (I) think he bets on rivers anyway because it balances his bluff lines better.

thoughts?
 
duggs

duggs

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what better hands are folding to a jam?
 
JCgrind

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JC thinks its a value ship

dafuq? i think its a bet/fold. me x/shoving that river as a bluff is total spew

oh and how solid is my 3b skillz. no getting 4b by nits with anything short of le nutz ;)

i soooooo wanna spill results

what better hands are folding to a jam?

against him, maybe my better 2p, but its so impossibly narrow that i dont see the point either.
 
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duggs

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dafuq? i think its a bet/fold. me x/shoving that river as a bluff is total spew

oh and how solid is my 3b skillz. no getting 4b by nits with anything short of le nutz ;)

i soooooo wanna spill results

but SPR is 1.1, b/f seems redic
 
JCgrind

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but SPR is 1.1, b/f seems redic

ikr, but that should mean im never bluffing if i x/shove either right?

if i was 9k, i bet like 1/3pot OTR. if he does that, then i think calling a shove is fine.
 
duggs

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yea if it was me i would either bet small/call or shove river, but i think you may lose your mind v me more than him
 
JCgrind

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yea if it was me i would either bet small/call or shove river, but i think you may lose your mind v me more than him

i consider myself really anti-tilt. like, ive lost something like $600 in the past 4 days playing 10NL/16NL (yeah ikr) and its fine.

to this date, youre the only cc member that has tilted me. and i remember the exact fkn hand. thumped my desk

poker stars $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em $0.05 Ante - 6 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

CO: $25.00
BTN: $62.50
Hero (SB): $62.94
BB: $85.01
UTG: $110.35
MP: $92.80

Pre Flop: ($0.65) Hero is SB with Q
diamond.gif
Q
heart.gif

2 folds, CO checks, 1 fold, Hero raises to $1, BB calls $0.75, 1 fold

Flop: ($2.30) 2
spade.gif
3
club.gif
8
heart.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $1.72, BB calls $1.72

Turn: ($5.74) Q
club.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $3.60, BB calls $3.60

River: ($12.94) 4
club.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $8.62, BB raises to $19.50, Hero says: "OMFG", Hero calls $10.88

Final Pot: $51.94
Hero mucks Q
diamond.gif
Q
heart.gif

BB shows 6
diamond.gif
5
diamond.gif
(a straight, Deuce to Six)
BB wins $50.29
(Rake: $1.65)

the worst part was, i tanked bc i thoguht you had backdoored a flush. when i called and the cards rolled i saw 65 and was like 'HA! sick bluff, but bad choice of spo...****!"

*grumble grumble* hahaha
 
hackmeplz

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His turn call seems mighty optimistic.
 
D

DunningKruger

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Help I can't bet my hand because only monsters are ever gonna look me up.

Sorry for not taking a look at this topic yesterday like I said I would. I've been pretty busy lately, but I did send you a good length PM today about the hand. I don't really want to send flowers and chocolates if I don't need to so hopefully that atones for it.
 
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gunburger

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I think check on river is actually fine. Let look at what range he ends up with on the river linearly by equity. He has quite a few flushes. He has KQ. He has set of threes and possibly set of TTs. He has All Ax two pairs. He has all JT then Ax 1 pair hands.

So JT is fairly close to the bottom of your range here. If you are betting JT then you are probably betting a bit too wide.

The three bet size is silly though which makes 4 betting with a wider polarized range an awesome option.
 
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