Are 3Bets GTO?

Ragequit

Ragequit

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Obviously I know the answer to that question. But.... when I 3Bet during cash games, I frequently see players leave the table after they fold. Some are regs who i'm 3Betting for value, or attacking their high f3bet%, and some are recreational players who I am isolating in position. Either way it seems to be bad for the table and drives certain players away. I 3Bet for 3 very good reasons:


1. To thin the field and get heads up going into the flop.
2. To get more money in the pot.
3. To maintain an aggressive image at the table.


These are good reasons, and yet I constantly see players leave the table after getting 3Bet as if I had committed an offence against them. Have you guys seen this happening a lot too? This is frustrating because … GTO (Game Theory Optimal) practice... encourages us not to do anything during games which drives away weak opposition. And yet, we know that 3Betting is solid Poker and part of a winning Tight Aggressive strategy.


So, here's my question. How do you balance good Aggressive play with keeping players who hate 3Bets in the game?
 
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quant1986

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I think the term GTO is generally not used in this context so I would rephrase your question to is 3bet preflop more profitable than calling against weak opponents who may quit when facing preflop aggression.

For online, I don't think you should deviate your basic game and just leave when there is no fish in the table.

Live game, perhaps you can just call IP to keep weak passive recreational players happy , and use your edge in postflop to exploit them. But make sure you can fold non nuts hands when facing sudden aggression from those players.
 
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Smokewood

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Ragequit said:
Obviously I know the answer to that question. But.... when I 3Bet during cash games, I frequently see players leave the table after they fold. Some are regs who i'm 3Betting for value, or attacking their high f3bet%, and some are recreational players who I am isolating in position. Either way it seems to be bad for the table and drives certain players away. I 3Bet for 3 very good reasons:


1. To thin the field and get heads up going into the flop.
2. To get more money in the pot.
3. To maintain an aggressive image at the table.


These are good reasons, and yet I constantly see players leave the table after getting 3Bet as if I had committed an offence against them. Have you guys seen this happening a lot too? This is frustrating because … GTO (Game Theory Optimal) practice... encourages us not to do anything during games which drives away weak opposition. And yet, we know that 3Betting is solid Poker and part of a winning Tight Aggressive strategy.


So, here's my question. How do you balance good Aggressive play with keeping players who hate 3Bets in the game?
Click to expand...

**** them, it's a war!
:jd4:
 
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cs_rlewis

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I'd keep doing it. 3 betting is way better than calling
 
smknginmaine

smknginmaine

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3bets are good. Unless it's against me. Then FU I'm outta here:)
 
Poker_Mike

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Ragequit said:
Obviously I know the answer to that question. But.... when I 3Bet during cash games, I frequently see players leave the table after they fold. Some are regs who i'm 3Betting for value, or attacking their high f3bet%, and some are recreational players who I am isolating in position. Either way it seems to be bad for the table and drives certain players away. I 3Bet for 3 very good reasons:


1. To thin the field and get heads up going into the flop.
2. To get more money in the pot.
3. To maintain an aggressive image at the table.


These are good reasons, and yet I constantly see players leave the table after getting 3Bet as if I had committed an offence against them. Have you guys seen this happening a lot too? This is frustrating because … GTO (Game Theory Optimal) practice... encourages us not to do anything during games which drives away weak opposition. And yet, we know that 3Betting is solid Poker and part of a winning Tight Aggressive strategy.


So, here's my question. How do you balance good Aggressive play with keeping players who hate 3Bets in the game?
Click to expand...


Keep up your profitable 3-betting tendencies.

But if it is driving fish away from your table - eventually you will only be left with players that CAN adjust to your 3-bets. Which is generally not what you want. So, when this happens change tables and follow the fish around the pond.

Good luck !
 
MikeCarasone

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I think your reasoning for 3betting is fine. If players are leaving the table it’s because they must not like to be challenged or know the game is going to be harder on the style they are playing. If you are 3betting them when they are light and they fold it’s obv you picked up on something and they know it. I wouldn’t change a thing, no need in making it easier for them.
 
Ragequit

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Yeah completely. And thanks RE the GTO terminology. Cooperative Game Theory talks a lot about keeping weak players in games by optimising aggressive actions (using them more sparingly etc). So that is why I used the term GTO but I definitely see your point. Yes I will be continuing my same strategy but it just sometimes feels like using a steamroller to kill a fly. You're right about players leaving as the 3Bets are disrupting their strategy. I shall carry on with my TAG hammerlock.

R
 
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