3-betting strategy on cash games.

IamVALHALLA

IamVALHALLA

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3-betting is something I normally only do when I have AK, JJ, QQ, KK, AA but should I expand that range?

I can't help thinking that cash games would be more profitable if I were to 3-bet any hand I would ordinarily open-raise with, but maybe that is stupid thinking that will get me into trouble?


I'm tired of the sheer number of 4-way (plus) pots I end up involved in after flat calling 3BB with a reasonable/marginal hand that ends up completely dominated by a hand that, perhaps, wouldn't have called a 3-bet to begin with.


I realise I'm kind of answering my own question, but since I admit I'm relatively inexperienced I'd rather throw it out there for you ladies and gents to tell me what your thoughts are.


Will players get frustrated if someone keeps 3-betting them? Would this in turn be a good or bad thing?
3-betting is something I'm quite keen to expand on.
 
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CrashMcCarran

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Without writing my own article about the topic, I'll help you the best I can.

I play mostly 6max so I have a wider range of hands that I'll three bet since the three tightest positions are gone.


First, think of who is raising, is she tight or loose, passive or aggressive? What position did she raise from and what is her range from that position? Once you have those questions answered let's move on.


When you first get into three betting, most people have a pretty tight range like you. Let's make a range for you from the cutoff or button that you can start with.


99-AA
A10s-AKs
AJo-AKo
KQs, KQo (sometimes, be careful though you don't want to start playing too many off suit Broadway connectors)
Let's add a few more hands that can crush flops or give you range advantage against OOP opponents. I would start with a few suited connectors, 67s-j10s.


If you're uncomfortable with those ranges, eliminate a couple of the suited aces like aj, a10 and AJo, AQo and J10s, 67s. You really don't have to 3 bet any of the small suited connectors if you aren't comfortable.


Just start incorporating some more hands into your 3 bet range as you play.


Three betting from the blinds is also important but your post flop strategy is going to change. Check raising your really strong hands instead of leading out does three things. You get to maximize your value and you get to put your opponent in a very tough spot while protecting your checking range.


Start with small additions to your 3b range then expand upon them add you get comfortable. Hope that helps!
 
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IamVALHALLA

IamVALHALLA

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Great post and great advice, thank you!
 
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danielcai

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I have seen good players 3-betting with playable hands such as suited connecters and Ax suited. And i tried to use that strategy as well, but i find players at small stake does not fold to 3-bets, and it makes me in tough positions with these hands.
 
Ragequit

Ragequit

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The choice of hands which you can 3Bet is entirely dependant on your opponent's Range. If they will only continue with monsters, then you can 3Bet wider as they will fold a lot. If they call 3Bets and 4Bet light then you can use a value heavy range.
 
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Smokewood

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So If I open from middle position, you are going to 3bet me with a pair of 9s?
 
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Ofarah

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It really depends a lot on table dynamics. If you’re playing at a tight table loose 3betting can be great but if youre at a loose table 3 betting can get dangerous
 
PaxMundi

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You need to build two sets of ranges a linear range vs the fish for value and a polerized range vs villains with high fold to 3bet .And vs the Tags/Lags/unknowns use a mixed strategy that combine both sets of ranges.and then just do that vs each position in and out of position.
 
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Sorin Iliescu

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i 3bet hands like 77+ and AQ+ and sometimes ATs as a bluff
 
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Daithi

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You need to build two sets of ranges a linear range vs the fish for value and a polerized range vs villains with high fold to 3bet .And vs the Tags/Lags/unknowns use a mixed strategy that combine both sets of ranges.and then just do that vs each position in and out of position.


This answer makes the most sense. I noticed that Upswing Poker propagate this strategy a lot. I wonder have you peeked in there:D
 
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Daithi

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A basic example of a range lets say ip vs utg

Linear/value vs fish
JJ+,AQs+,AKo

polerized/high fold equity
KK+,A5s-A2s,KTs,QTs

Mixed strategy vs regs/unknowns
JJ+,AQs+,A5s-A2s,KTs,QTs,AKo

If you want to know how to build a polerized range just multiply your value combos by 1.5 to get your bluff combos.


I could be wrong but I dont think thats polarised 3bet range. Your polarised range still resembles linear more because linear range would contain some middling hands. Polarised range needs to have total garbage with almost no showdown value, ex. 52, 62, etc.
 
Ragequit

Ragequit

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A polarised range is one which is biased to either 'Pole' of the Poker hand Grid. A polarised 3Bet range might look like {TT+ AK}. A de-polarised range means exactly what it says. "Not biased to a certain pole". So an example of that might be {TT+, 87s-65s, AK+, A3s-A5s}. Depolarised ranges are different for different players. Some regs include mid suited connectors while others use lower connectors and baby pairs. Some even use junk hands if their target is folding enough.

R
 
PaxMundi

PaxMundi

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I could be wrong but I dont think thats polarised 3bet range. Your polarised range still resembles linear more because linear range would contain some middling hands. Polarised range needs to have total garbage with almost no showdown value, ex. 52, 62, etc.


You don't 3bet 72o just because it's the worst we can 3bet.The bluffs are the best equity hands we don't call with preflop.KTs QT could even be in a mixed strategy as they might be in a'lot of peoples calls pre, i should of gave a more basic tighter example.Polar is just opposite ends of the scale so pure value and pure bluff.But even as a pure bluff we want to use the best of the hands we fold.

linear/vs fish
QQ+,AKs,AKo

polerized/high fold equity
KK+,A5s-A2s,97s,86s

mixed/vs regs and unknowns
QQ+,AKs,A5s-A2s,97s,86s,AKo
 
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Ragequit

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A5s-A2s,KTs,QTs would be bluffs vs utg in the example i gave.You still want high equity hands in position you dont 3bet 72o just because it's the worst we can 3bet.

Yep agreed! I forgot to mention bluffs in my reply. Most bluffs still make the range depolarised as they tend to be junky hands at the weak end of the hand table.
 
PaxMundi

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Yep agreed! I forgot to mention bluffs in my reply. Most bluffs still make the range depolarised as they tend to be junky hands at the weak end of the hand table.

depolarized or linear is wider value range and polarized is opposite ends meaning pure bluff or value.But other wise yes your correct.
 
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Daithi

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You don't 3bet 72o just because it's the worst we can 3bet.The bluffs are the best equity hands we don't call with preflop.KTs QT could even be in a mixed strategy as they might be in a'lot of peoples calls pre, i should of gave a more basic tighter example.Polar is just opposite ends of the scale so pure value and pure bluff.But even as a pure bluff we want to use the best of the hands we fold.


I am aware what "polarized" means and that's why I was saying. Polar represents opposites of a scale, axis or duality for example. And yes, the lower end of the scale are hands you don't call with, what exactly are those would vary among poker blog or forums. But his particular depolarised range had hands I would call with in certain situations, that's why I was saying it didn't seem polarised to me.

Let's quote some sources for a bit here..
"Suppose you're on the button in a 6-max game
and the action is folded to the player in the cutoff seat who raises
to three big blinds. From observation, you're pretty sure he'll raise
in this situation with about 20 percent of his hands. You're also
pretty sure that if you 3-bet, he'll call or 4-bet with only about 4
percent of his starting hands (roughly AA through TT, and AK
and AQ, suited or not.) You can 3-bet him with any two cards!
He'll fold 75 percent of the time, and even if you lose every hand
where he doesn't fold, you'll make a profit. (We're assuming the
blinds will fold behind you, which is mostly true.) Assuming your
3-bet is to nine big blinds, the calculation looks like this:
· You win 4.5 big blinds 75 percent of the time, for a profit of
3.375 big blinds.
3.375 = (0.75)(45)
· You lose your 3-bet 25 percent of the time, for a loss of 2.25
big blinds.
2.25 = (0.25)(- 9)
On average, you win 1.125 big blinds every time you make this
move.
1.125 = 3.375 - 2.25 "
Dan Harrington on Online Cash Games

Three-betting a polarized range means you still three-bet your good hands for value but your "light" three-bet hands have no value in seeing the flop.
The basic idea is you want to take a hand you'd normally fold and three-bet it as a bluff to try and get your opponent to fold.
What those hands are vary by opponent, position, prior history, etc. It's a sliding scale. The unchanging aspect is it's a hand that's not profitable to call in that very situation.
You want to three-bet light with a hand that you would normally fold because it adds value to a hand that would otherwise have none. For example you don't want to three-bet T 9 on the button because there's far too much value in seeing a flop.


The best hands to three-bet light with are at the very top of your folding range.
Pokerlistings.com




I don't claim I am right, but I am presenting to you sources that led me to my position.

 
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Smokewood

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Polarizing means I am holding a monster or I have total air trash!
 
PaxMundi

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I am aware what "polarized" means and that's why I was saying. Polar represents opposites of a scale, axis or duality for example. And yes, the lower end of the scale are hands you don't call with, what exactly are those would vary among poker blog or forums. But his particular depolarised range had hands I would call with in certain situations, that's why I was saying it didn't seem polarised to me.

Let's quote some sources for a bit here..








I don't claim I am right, but I am presenting to you sources that led me to my position.

That's why i switched those combos out for 97s 86s.And a polar range vs utg wont contain junk like J4s 94s where as say a bb vs btn or bvb range can include those.
 
Amnesia OG

Amnesia OG

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Personnally, I have 3 spots for 3-betting in cash game. The first one being monster hands obvisouly. The second one is hands that don't play very good post-flop and against an agressive open-raise( I'd rather take the pot right away, if not I'd still have good equity against this kind of player's range) . The last one is when I have position over the initial raise with hands that play great post-flop, it can be profitable to play big pots in these spots.
 
godblessiraq

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OP, read a book called “The Raisers Edge.” There is some really great info in that book about 3 betting. It has helped my game tremendously.
 
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