.02/05 - What did the villian have?

CRStals

CRStals

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I don't have the text hand history but I'd like feedback on how I played this:

pokerstars - .02/.05 NL
ME: SB - $4.12
Villian: CO - $34.50

Villian had been catching cards the entire time I was there but hadn't won any huge pots. Neither had I, had been running dry up to this hand:

ME: AJo

Villian is first into the hand, min-raises
I call, BB folds.

Flop: A58 rainbow
I bet $0.20 - Villian calls.

Turn: 8h
I bet $0.40 - Villian calls.

River is the Qc
I check - he puts me all in.

Questions:
- What do you put him on?
- Do you call the river?
- Do you bet on the turn or check and hope to see the river for free? If he bets, what do you do?
 
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jsh169

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B/b/B/fold to raise. Your missing out on tons of value if your checking back a good top pair vs a fish.
 
CRStals

CRStals

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In hindsight betting the river would of made sense, however curiosity got the better of me on the river & I stupidly called. Part of me wanted to see what he had, part of me felt like the massive overbet felt like a cold bluff.

He rivered a full house with QQ.

Lesson learned.
 
starting_at_the_bottom

starting_at_the_bottom

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Doesnt really matter his exact 2 cards.

If we think he beats AJ we fold, if not we call.

Easy fold most of the time.
 
6

6bet me

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Why are you donking the flop? It makes much more sense to check-call the flop and check-call the turn. Only lead out (bet yourself) on the turn if the flop goes check-check.

And on the river, when he overbet shoves like this, he almost always has a boat or quads. I guarantee he's not overbetting like this with just a naked trips hand like 87s. Those hands would bet somewhere between 50% and 100% pot, but they wouldn't overbet the pot.

If he was bluffing with a hand like 76s, he would bet somewhere between 50% and 100% pot. He wouldn't overbet shove like this. Only boats/quads would do this.
 
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danvu

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Villain probably has you beat here, I would guess he has some kind of big ace AK, AQ, AA or maybe queens. Your biggest mistake here is probably donking the flop, I think you should just station him to the river and then make a decision.
 
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Sneaky Feet

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CO range is pretty wide and considering he called the flop he could have anything from mid pocket pairs to suited aces to single or double gapped suited connectors. He could have even shoved a missed wheel draw. That all depends on your read. As played you should have shoved the river.

You would have been better check/calling the flop as it's pretty dry then making your decision on the turn. Remember even an Ace is just 1 pair.
 
CRStals

CRStals

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This is what I was really looking for when I joined Cardschat so thank you to those who responded!

Matthew - given his hot streak and wider than normal range, I think leading out is the right call in this case. I do disagree that I donk'd the flop. Yes I'm not holding AK, but when he calls the flop after raising pre, it tells me he's crediting me for the ace and that's better than what he had. After all, given his huge stack and wild play, if he felt he could beat an ace, I'd expect a raise and then could of let it go.

I do agree that I got blinded by the massive all-in and should of realized the Q hit him square in the face. Part of me wanted to see...dumb move.

Does check/calling the flop not put me at risk of maximizing my value long term, especially knowing he needed a two outer to beat me? If he checks the flop, do you bet then?
 
TimovieMan

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I do disagree that I donk'd the flop.
You did not have the initiative, yet you lead out on the flop. That's the very definition of a donk bet.

Yes I'm not holding AK, but when he calls the flop after raising pre, it tells me he's crediting me for the ace and that's better than what he had. After all, given his huge stack and wild play, if he felt he could beat an ace, I'd expect a raise and then could of let it go.
Not necessarily. He may still have an ace or better and decide to trap you by letting you barrel.

I do agree that I got blinded by the massive all-in and should of realized the Q hit him square in the face. Part of me wanted to see...dumb move.
"Wanting to see" is fine if it's like 7bb or something, not if it's for stacks.

Does check/calling the flop not put me at risk of maximizing my value long term, especially knowing he needed a two outer to beat me? If he checks the flop, do you bet then?
If you only have TPGK, then you can't really expect three streets of value, or you'll get stacked by better hands a lot.
Frankly, I have let go of second pairs on an Axx flop when facing a donk on several occasions, so how are you maximizing value then?
Remember: when OOP, it's always going to be hard to maximize value, because the one IP gets to decide everything.

If the flop checks through, THEN you can bet.


As for your questions:
- What do you put him on?
With a bet of that size?
A very polarized range: AA/QQ/88/55/A8 or air. With less A8 because he didn't raise the flop, and less air because of the shove (bluffs don't usually overbet the flop at these stakes).

- Do you call the river?
Not for that amount, no. But for a half-pot bet? Sure. But I won't like it since we turned our hand face-side up by betting out on the flop.
- Do you bet on the turn or check and hope to see the river for free? If he bets, what do you do?
I don't donk the flop. Basically, I c/c all three streets, or bet if the previous street got checked through.


Edit:
Let me repeat an old poker saying: "Small hand, small pot. Big hand, big pot."
Top pair is a small hand. ;)
 
TimovieMan

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Forgot to add this:
For maximum EV, you should consider setting the buy-in options to automatically reload to the table maximum. That ensures that you're always at least 100bb deep.
You don't want to be shortstacked when holding a big hand.
 
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