Is this true?

Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...violating-US-anti-internet-gambling-laws.html

So you mean pokerstars and fulltilt have been found by the united states government to be doing illegal activity ? I thought everyone supported these sites here on cardschat>

Everyone here even the respected members here that I respect and have learned allot from said these sites are to be trusted and they would have to much to loose from doing something illegal. I can't believe this. It's like a slap in the face to all of us.
 
Poker Orifice

Poker Orifice

Fully Tilted
Platinum Level
Joined
Jan 19, 2008
Total posts
25,599
Awards
6
CA
Chips
968
maybe search around a bit more on internet & you'll see why they were doing what they were doing?? (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time).

How would this reflect on CC members saying these sites are to be trusted? (pretty sure people have known for a long time that US has been trying to shutdown online pokerzz for quite some time)
 
Egon Towst

Egon Towst

Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Total posts
6,794
Chips
0
They found ways around a dumbass law that no thinking person supports anyway. Illegal ? Not in the countries where they are based, nor in any place where common sense still holds sway.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
They found ways around a dumbass law that no thinking person supports anyway. Illegal ? Not in the countries where they are based, nor in any place where common sense still holds sway.

I understand what your saying . So they where money laundering because why ? Money laundering is suspicious illegal activity to me. I will keep reading more to understand this money laundering . Thanks for your reply.
 
Charade You Are

Charade You Are

you can call me Frost
Silver Level
Joined
May 9, 2008
Total posts
2,446
Chips
0
I'm surprised at all the players that are looking at those charges and not understanding the story behind them.

Did they break the law-allegedly, and a hypocritical, exemption-ridden, passed in the middle of the night as a rider to the Safe Port Act law at that. But if they didn't, no US players would have been able to deposit or withdraw.

Calling it fraud and money-laundering just makes it sound awful. As does saying illegal internet gambling.

I don't consider playing poker, gambling, it's a risk, no different than investing. I do consider those grannies on social security legally buying lottery tickets online "internet gambling" tho.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
I'm surprised at all the players that are looking at those charges and not understanding the story behind them.

Did they break the law-allegedly, and a hypocritical, exemption-ridden, passed in the middle of the night as a rider to the Safe Port Act law at that. But if they didn't, no US players would have been able to deposit or withdraw.

Calling it fraud and money-laundering just makes it sound awful. As does saying illegal internet gambling.

I don't consider playing poker, gambling, it's a risk, no different than investing. I do consider those grannies on social security legally buying lottery tickets online "internet gambling" tho.

Give me time to understand . I am reading still and posting this up so i can understand. I am not hot nor cold on this. So I am luke warm which gives me patience and a open mind. Thanks for your one sided post. keep them coming.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
maybe search around a bit more on internet & you'll see why they were doing what they were doing?? (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time).

How would this reflect on CC members saying these sites are to be trusted? (pretty sure people have known for a long time that US has been trying to shutdown online pokerzz for quite some time)

This statement you made, " (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time)." has nothing to do about the article I posted. nothing at all
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
Wow it is going to be so interesting to hear what Chad Elie , John Campos and others will tell about more details of these sites and how they are operating.

We might get some real juicy inside stuff !!!!


maybe search around a bit more on internet & you'll see why they were doing what they were doing?? (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time).

How would this reflect on CC members saying these sites are to be trusted? (pretty sure people have known for a long time that US has been trying to shutdown online pokerzz for quite some time)

They found ways around a dumbass law that no thinking person supports anyway. Illegal ? Not in the countries where they are based, nor in any place where common sense still holds sway.

I'm surprised at all the players that are looking at those charges and not understanding the story behind them.

Did they break the law-allegedly, and a hypocritical, exemption-ridden, passed in the middle of the night as a rider to the Safe Port Act law at that. But if they didn't, no US players would have been able to deposit or withdraw.

Calling it fraud and money-laundering just makes it sound awful. As does saying illegal internet gambling.

I don't consider playing poker, gambling, it's a risk, no different than investing. I do consider those grannies on social security legally buying lottery tickets online "internet gambling" tho.
 
Charade You Are

Charade You Are

you can call me Frost
Silver Level
Joined
May 9, 2008
Total posts
2,446
Chips
0
Give me time to understand . I am reading still and posting this up so i can understand. I am not hot nor cold on this. So I am luke warm which gives me patience and a open mind. Thanks for your one sided post. keep them coming.

What's one-sided about it? The UIGEA made it illegal for U.S. Financial Institutions to transfer money to and from "illegal internet gambling sites". Because the poker sites used 3rd party payment processors for deposits and withdrawals, they are saying that was "fraud" and "money-laundering" because the banks didn't know they were originating with poker sites.

While there allegedly were also issues with unscrupulous payment processors, that is a separate issue and not why the U.S. Government is going after the major sites.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
What's one-sided about it? The UIGEA made it illegal for U.S. Financial Institutions to transfer money to and from "illegal internet gambling sites". Because the poker sites used 3rd party payment processors for deposits and withdrawals, they are saying that was "fraud" and "money-laundering" because the banks didn't know they were originating with poker sites.

While there allegedly were also issues with unscrupulous payment processors, that is a separate issue and not why the U.S. Government is going after the major sites.

Take a breather geez. Your all over everyone on this site calm down please.
 
tbdbitl

tbdbitl

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 7, 2008
Total posts
1,048
Awards
1
Chips
0
This statement you made, " (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time)." has nothing to do about the article I posted. nothing at all


I think PO was dead on relevant on what you posted. And, BTW it is all very relevant to the article you posted. Take PO's advice use Google and read a little.

I guess being clueless does allow one to be neutral.
 
Stu_Ungar

Stu_Ungar

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
May 14, 2008
Total posts
6,236
Chips
0
I understand what your saying . So they where money laundering because why ? Money laundering is suspicious illegal activity to me. I will keep reading more to understand this money laundering . Thanks for your reply.

Since UIGEA its been illegal to handle any payments for poker in the US. So in order for US players to play, someone had to be breaking the law because UIGEA is the law preventing the anyone for handling these payments.

Money laundering, fraud etc etc.. but not even one customer has been defrauded.

The money laundering and fraud all centres around how they got US money from US banks onto the the pokersite.

Usually for a fraud to take place, someone has to lose out. However in this case everyone involved got exactly what they expected.

Had UIGEA not been passed, there would have been no need to commit fraud.

The timing of this whole thing is ridiculous. They have decided to crack down on the sites just as states are beginning the process of legalising online poker. The second it became legal, all of the fraud would have stopped!
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
I think PO was dead on relevant on what you posted. And, BTW it is all very relevant to the article you posted. Take PO's advice use Google and read a little.

I guess being clueless does allow one to be neutral.

This is my thread and I wanted peoples opinions on my link I posted . Thanks for your time.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
Since UIGEA its been illegal to handle any payments for poker in the US. So in order for US players to play, someone had to be breaking the law because UIGEA is the law preventing the anyone for handling these payments.

Money laundering, fraud etc etc.. but not even one customer has been defrauded.

The money laundering and fraud all centres around how they got US money from US banks onto the the pokersite.

Usually for a fraud to take place, someone has to lose out. However in this case everyone involved got exactly what they expected.

Had UIGEA not been passed, there would have been no need to commit fraud.

The timing of this whole thing is ridiculous. They have decided to crack down on the sites just as states are beginning the process of legalising online poker. The second it became legal, all of the fraud would have stopped!

Thanks for your time and input on my thread. So what is your speculation of this ill timed aggression on the sites ? I agree that would be stupid to do that at this time ! Maybe their is another reason for doing this ? maybe the goverment knows something we don't . Could you consider that?
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
I think PO was dead on relevant on what you posted. And, BTW it is all very relevant to the article you posted. Take PO's advice use Google and read a little.

I guess being clueless does allow one to be neutral.

He was right to tell me to read a little . But I was not talking about that statement. Also i told you please when replying to my thread or anyones it's respectful to talk about what the OP is asking. In this case its your thoughts on the article . Thanks
 
Stu_Ungar

Stu_Ungar

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
May 14, 2008
Total posts
6,236
Chips
0
I dont really know.

There are a few theories floating around.

All Ill say is that outside the US its business as normal. I was on FT earlier this evening, its like nothing has happened.
 
KerouacsDog

KerouacsDog

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 26, 2006
Total posts
9,410
Chips
0
I dont really know.

There are a few theories floating around.

All Ill say is that outside the US its business as normal. I was on FT earlier this evening, its like nothing has happened.

yeah, sorry US guys, but as Stu said, its business as usual at FT/PS and UB for the rest of the world. been playing all evening on all three, everything's fine for me. traffic is down, 52000 players currently at FT, thats way low, right, for this time of week? PS has 172000, are all the US on the play money tables?
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
yeah, sorry US guys, but as Stu said, its business as usual at FT/PS and UB for the rest of the world. been playing all evening on all three, everything's fine for me. traffic is down, 52000 players currently at FT, thats way low, right, for this time of week? PS has 172000, are all the US on the play money tables?

Are all the players on play money ahahahaha. Thanks for the laugh. I actually sell about 90 bucks a week from play money chips . Now i guess I have to do it through paypal. Maybe I should shut down completely.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
I dont really know.

There are a few theories floating around.

All Ill say is that outside the US its business as normal. I was on FT earlier this evening, its like nothing has happened.

I can't wait to see some good media stories after the arrested get interviewed . Man its going to be so interesting .
 
neil1603

neil1603

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 4, 2007
Total posts
133
Chips
0
My understanding of it so far is that, because US banks wouldn't accept cheques or transfers from online gambling sites the payouts had to be made through a third party. These third parties were set up to make sure players could get their funds. The players were receiving there funds, if they weren't there would have been all sorts of posts across the internet. So while not sticking to the letter of the law PS and FT were not defrauding their players.

The bit I have trouble understanding was this bit.

Prosecutors also filed civil money laundering charges seeking to recover at least $3bn (£1.8bn) from the companies, which are all based overseas, court documents stated.

The only thing I can put this down to is that the US government think they are owed this amount in unpaid tax.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
My understanding of it so far is that, because US banks wouldn't accept cheques or transfers from online gambling sites the payouts had to be made through a third party. These third parties were set up to make sure players could get their funds. The players were receiving there funds, if they weren't there would have been all sorts of posts across the internet. So while not sticking to the letter of the law PS and FT were not defrauding their players.

The bit I have trouble understanding was this bit.



The only thing I can put this down to is that the US government think they are owed this amount in unpaid tax.

Thanks for your input
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
Nevada Gov. Brian Sandoval said the allegations made by federal prosecutors against the three companies were of "grave concern." But he added that he remained committed to the possibility that federal legislation will eventually permit Internet gambling in a way that matches the same rigorous standards that apply to traditional gaming institutions.

ohhh the sites would be regulated by the US ... That would be very good for us players .




I dont really know.

There are a few theories floating around.

All Ill say is that outside the US its business as normal. I was on FT earlier this evening, its like nothing has happened.

yeah, sorry US guys, but as Stu said, its business as usual at FT/PS and UB for the rest of the world. been playing all evening on all three, everything's fine for me. traffic is down, 52000 players currently at FT, thats way low, right, for this time of week? PS has 172000, are all the US on the play money tables?

They found ways around a dumbass law that no thinking person supports anyway. Illegal ? Not in the countries where they are based, nor in any place where common sense still holds sway.

maybe search around a bit more on internet & you'll see why they were doing what they were doing?? (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time).

How would this reflect on CC members saying these sites are to be trusted? (pretty sure people have known for a long time that US has been trying to shutdown online pokerzz for quite some time)
 
Egon Towst

Egon Towst

Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 26, 2006
Total posts
6,794
Chips
0
ohhh the sites would be regulated by the US ... That would be very good for us players .


Only if you like paying US taxes.

Very many of the world`s poker sites are based in the UK or UK dependant territories and therefore already operate in a regulated environment. One suspects that the only reason that doesn`t suit the US is because they don`t make money from it.
 
Nexus6

Nexus6

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Total posts
441
Chips
0
Only if you like paying US taxes.

Very many of the world`s poker sites are based in the UK or UK dependant territories and therefore already operate in a regulated environment. One suspects that the only reason that doesn`t suit the US is because they don`t make money from it.

So pokerstars is working from in the UK Dependant territories? Cool I all ways thought it was from some island far from laws lol.. Thanks for your info. So they get regulated to! Like Las vegas casino's get regulated. Thats awesome ! Thanks man for this. I all ways thought that strict regulations didn't exist like that.

So because pokerstars gets regulated so well , you think the people who regulate pokerstars had something to do with The United states gov finding these illegal activities.

Thanks again.
 
Last edited:
tbdbitl

tbdbitl

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 7, 2008
Total posts
1,048
Awards
1
Chips
0
He was right to tell me to read a little . But I was not talking about that statement. Also i told you please when replying to my thread or anyones it's respectful to talk about what the OP is asking. In this case its your thoughts on the article . Thanks

A Thread is is a stream of conversation that is driven by an original poster's post. Interaction and conversation between members of a forum. Not everything posted in a thread has to directly be about the original post.

But. thanks for telling me how I may respond to a thread Scarecrow.
 
Top