Software cost me big time in ACR Venom

#1 December 6th, 2019, 9:23 PM

So...
I am playing the ACR Venom $2500=$150 $6000,000 Guaranteed!

I had watched Michael Loncar play using Table Tamer software and I love the way the software will display your chip stack and allow you to bet in BB's instead of actual number of chips. So I installed it and noticed it had "HotKeys" as well which I sat up on my keyboard and labeled so I could just press a key and my opening bet would be made. I set up Z key as 3.1 BB's, X key 2.9 BB's, C key 2.7 BB's, V key 2.5 BB's, B key 2.4 BB's, N key 2.1 BB's
and the 2 keys above those keys I made for an increase of 1 BB for 1 limper and a increase of 2 BB for 2 limper's. example My Z key bets 3.1 BB the key above it is the A key which would be for 1 limper and would bet 4.1 BB's when pressed. The key above that is the Q key and would be for 2 limper's and would bet 5.1 BB's when pressed.
I will include a post of the keyboard with my labels so you can see what I am describing.
I tested all the keys out in freerolls and everything worked perfectly and I liked the setup.

I am in the Venom Venom Day 1C $2500=$150 $6000,000 Guaranteed Blinds level 1600/3200
I am in 13th place of 141! I have about 513,600 chips (160.6 BB's) Average is 326,725 chips.
So I am doing great right!?

I am dealt pocket 8's UTG+2. My plan is to raise 2.5 BB's and take it down or fold to any raise depending on size and calls before me.

I had left the room to see what a noise was and just came back the hand before and was standing behind my chair which has the mouse pad attached to the right arm and my keyboard was on my desk. I leaned over and was going to just use the ACR slider to make my bet but it was way to sensitive to use and it jumped around so I slid around and sat down real quick as I just put the slider back to the left and then I pressed the 2.5X hotkey
which should have put 2.5 BB's bet into the pot.
I was stunned to see 66.3 BB's go into the pot that is about 212,000 of my 13th place 513,000 chip stack. I cursed a few curse words at the HotKeys
The player directly to my left insta-shoved and had me covered.
I was in shock looked down and just folded after seeing I had 94BB's left in my stack.
If I had not been caught so off guard by a software malfunction like this I would have taken more time to think and probably just called it off but I had a plan of beting 2.5BB's and folding to a raise and that was my mindset and instinct reaction was fold.

I was recording the tournament for myself to review afterwards and have included a clip of what happened.
If you don't want to hear me cussing turn the sound off.
At the end of clip you can hear me talking what I am typing in the chat box.
I was putting in the chat box that the software Table Tamer HotKeys was responsible for the 66 blind raise, because I did not want the other players at the table to just think I was some nut and make my situation at the table even worse than it already was.
After that I scrambled to get the software shut down the table closed and reopened to make sure the software was still not engaged.
I was so tilted with what had happened I played terrible after that thinking about the chips I had lost and was it the Table Tamer software was it was it ACR software, did someone hack my desktop, was it going to happen again and all these things running through my head. every bet I made every call I made I cringed waiting for a huge chunk or all my chips to go in when I only made a small bet or call. I was totally paranoid and could not concentrate at all on anything for at least an hour. needless to say I did not fair well the rest of the tourney and busted jamming AJ into AK
Note: By memory I thought it was a 2.4BB bet which is a 7,680 that I was making and may have said that when talking to some people after tournament, But after reviewing the video I hear myself say 2.5BB which is 8000 chips. Not that it makes any real difference it was 2.4 or 2.5. But wanted to clarify that in this post.
I talked to Phil Nagy the ACR CEO on twitter. He said "I do have to say that is a really sick beat. I will see if I can find a contact at table tamer and see if that can be prevented in the future."
Poker is hard enough without actions happening that you did not do

SCREEN CAPTURE VIDEO of table when it happened.
TURN SOUND OFF if you don't want to hear me cuss.

You Tube

Keyboard with labels I was using.

#2 December 6th, 2019, 9:34 PM

Yeah dude, that really sucks to have that happen in such a big tournament. You have great ICM value even though it's only day one and you were in great striking position. I was also considering getting that software, but I think I'll wait on that now. I don't necessarily need the BB bet option anyway so F it.

#3 December 6th, 2019, 9:38 PM

Wow if you called the reraise you would have won huge sidepot V AK,
Would of been tempted to call. Software cost me big time in ACR Venom

Thats sick think better to play normally with mouse and slider in future.
Congrats on playing the venom event and gaining experience at it even if a bad experience this time around you will get there next time. Software cost me big time in ACR Venom

#4 December 7th, 2019, 12:50 AM

I should say I wasn't tilted for an hour, it is days later now and I am still tilted lol

#5 December 7th, 2019, 12:59 AM

Bad situation but you put 40% of your stack in preflop, you were getting the correct odds to put in the rest.

#6 December 7th, 2019, 1:05 AM

Yes understand pressure of the moment easy in hindsight but would have to call the all in not liking it hoping opponent on left AK,AQ or 77,Not too concerned by shortstack on right.
Would not be able to fold 88 after putting 40% of stack in,
But like I said sorry easy in hindsight.
What on earth was K10 doing in the hand the eventual winner would be tempted to fold it rough game smallfrie. Software cost me big time in ACR Venom

#7 December 7th, 2019, 1:23 AM

Originally Posted by tomk7788

Bad situation but you put 40% of your stack in preflop, you were getting the correct odds to put in the rest.

I think you can argue either way but 94 BB's stack left after a software malfunction is a lot of stack to play if you are not tilted out of your mind, but win or lose I think I would have called off if it had not freaked me out so bad.

#8 December 7th, 2019, 3:27 AM

You probably would have turned or rivered a set. I see underpairs beat overpairs quite regularly on ACR with sets or runner runner flushes and straights.

#9 December 7th, 2019, 3:53 AM

Originally Posted by tomk7788

You probably would have turned or rivered a set. I see underpairs beat overpairs quite regularly on ACR with sets or runner runner flushes and straights.

Watch the video the 88 would have held against the big stack. I would have won a massive side pot. I would have had about 768,000 if I had called. But in the moment when the software malfunctioned I folded. Normally the 94 blinds is deep enough stack for me to thrive with but not after that whole situation.

#10 December 7th, 2019, 3:56 AM

You might want to check this but I think the cards continue to shuffle so If you would have called the distribution would have been different.

#11 December 7th, 2019, 4:56 AM

Originally Posted by tomk7788

You might want to check this but I think the cards continue to shuffle so If you would have called the distribution would have been different.

That is an interesting comment.. I do believe that you are right in that the deck is not set before the hand is dealt. The RNG is constantly "randomizing" the cards, I think. So does that mean if I take 10 seconds to call a bet on the turn that the RNG will produce a different card than if I took 5 seconds to make the call?

#12 December 7th, 2019, 5:22 AM

Originally Posted by rmcmullen2003

That is an interesting comment.. I do believe that you are right in that the deck is not set before the hand is dealt. The RNG is constantly "randomizing" the cards, I think. So does that mean if I take 10 seconds to call a bet on the turn that the RNG will produce a different card than if I took 5 seconds to make the call?

You will never know.

#13 December 7th, 2019, 6:01 AM

Originally Posted by rmcmullen2003

That is an interesting comment.. I do believe that you are right in that the deck is not set before the hand is dealt. The RNG is constantly "randomizing" the cards, I think. So does that mean if I take 10 seconds to call a bet on the turn that the RNG will produce a different card than if I took 5 seconds to make the call?

This explains why on Bovada, someone goes all in with 3,8 off suit vs. A.A and wins with a Full House vs. 3 of a kind Aces on flop.

#14 December 7th, 2019, 6:31 AM

Originally Posted by smallfrie

I should say I wasn't tilted for an hour, it is days later now and I am still tilted lol

So this was interesting on many levels.

Of course this error really sucks for you.

I'm not familiar with that software but I like the idea of it and I like your keyboard setup even more.

But beware that from a systems point-of-view you are introducing another system (software program in this case) that can introduce error.

Like you said - I don't know where the error occurred.

But imagine you created a machine that pushed the keyboard buttons for you. Then there would be additional potential mechanical error introduced in your game.

The less potential error the less likely any error can occur.

You are a good enough player to get another shot at a big money tournament.

Good luck !

#15 December 7th, 2019, 7:59 AM

Originally Posted by Poker_Mike

So this was interesting on many levels.

Of course this error really sucks for you.

I'm not familiar with that software but I like the idea of it and I like your keyboard setup even more.

But beware that from a systems point-of-view you are introducing another system (software program in this case) that can introduce error.

Like you said - I don't know where the error occurred.

But imagine you created a machine that pushed the keyboard buttons for you. Then there would be additional potential mechanical error introduced in your game.

The less potential error the less likely any error can occur.

You are a good enough player to get another shot at a big money tournament.

Good luck !

Yeah I really like the idea of it as well. Maybe one day ACR will build it into the software and no one will have to suffer this third party software again. Poker Stars has both these features built into their software as you can see in this screen shot of a play money table I loaded up which I am playing using the Big Blinds displayed and the settings for programmable hotkeys is also available all built in. I can only play play money on stars but I hope ACR catches up with these features soon.
https://postimg.cc/FYM4pc3z

#16 December 7th, 2019, 9:53 AM

Wanted to correct chip counts and blind level when malfunction happened. The blinds were not 1600/3200 I based what I said in post on the video replay and that blind level at the left was the upcoming blind level so it actually happened at blind level 1400/2800 which made my chip count at the start of the hand 449,293 and the 66.3 BB it dumped in the middle was 185,653... I was over 500k in chips at some point 550k or so but had 449,293 when this happened. I double checked with the ACR hand history for this hand and this info is correct. All the other info on average stack 13th place is correct just the blind level was upcoming which made my calculation on total chips at the time the malfunction wrong in original post. When you are playing with BB's displayed you kinda lose track of chip counts unless you are toggling back and forth but that is what I like about the BB display the amount of BB's is what is important not knowing total chips. Before this happened I had planned on only playing with BB display from now on and never looking at my chip count again lol. It is a shame I won't be able to do that now.

#17 December 7th, 2019, 2:07 PM

Technology makes life easier but over relying on it makes one an idiot.
When NASA astronaut realized that a pen don't work in space without gravity, they spent millions to invent anti-gravity pen....Russian use something called a Pencil that cost only a few pennies.

This is why online poker is no more poker, it's all about external help to win the game.
Sorry dude, nothing personal on you, just stating my opinion.

#18 December 7th, 2019, 3:46 PM

Originally Posted by rmcmullen2003

That is an interesting comment.. I do believe that you are right in that the deck is not set before the hand is dealt. The RNG is constantly "randomizing" the cards, I think. So does that mean if I take 10 seconds to call a bet on the turn that the RNG will produce a different card than if I took 5 seconds to make the call?

Pretty much.

#19 December 10th, 2019, 8:25 AM

Originally Posted by YKCaiTLH1314

Technology makes life easier but over relying on it makes one an idiot.
When NASA astronaut realized that a pen don't work in space without gravity, they spent millions to invent anti-gravity pen....Russian use something called a Pencil that cost only a few pennies.

This is why online poker is no more poker, it's all about external help to win the game.
Sorry dude, nothing personal on you, just stating my opinion.

Actually the problem with using a pencil in space is that when it is used it creates graphite particles when it scratches the paper.

These microparticles get into instrumentation and eventually gum things up. I mean getting a device to work in outer space is difficult enough. Now add random carbon / graphite particles flying around with no gravity.....I can't even imagine.

And probably even using a pen would create some distribution of ink particles but maybe a lot less?

Good luck !

#20 December 16th, 2019, 9:05 PM

I've watched the video - that really sucks! Thank god, that's nothing life depends on.
Excellent: Your comment coming from the off showing this is tragedy for you and not a fake.

May your stack 1000times comeback...

#21 December 16th, 2019, 9:17 PM

Is there a press enter to confirm bet or similar fail safe that can be used? Maybe ACR can implement one or has it in the settings. I know other sites have a confirm bet option. Its an extra step but might be good idea if you continue to use the software.

#22 December 17th, 2019, 5:08 AM

Originally Posted by ChickenArise

Is there a press enter to confirm bet or similar fail safe that can be used? Maybe ACR can implement one or has it in the settings. I know other sites have a confirm bet option. Its an extra step but might be good idea if you continue to use the software.

Once you press the button on the keyboard the chips go in.
I talked to the Table Tamer through email and he said he was looking into changing something in the software. I hope this does not happen to anyone else and I hope ACR puts these features into their client in the future.

#23 July 9th, 2020, 8:36 AM

sorry but this thread is just way too funny & tbh it explains A LOT.

typically programs are to make it easier to play more tables. Not sure why you'd have keys for 2.9, 3.0, 2.7 ... when the change in sizing there makes next to no difference.

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Software cost me big time in ACR Venom

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