Pop Quiz: Pocket rockets

this is a quiz? if you dont know the answer to this one please never play poker again.

and was the prized real cash or play chips? if it was real cash..you call..play chips..you call....and if this was real $ what was the buyin and how many started because to be at a final with so few total chips im guessing it started with 140-150..so the buy in musta been like huge

bigfreelife said:

Question:

You are the last 3 in a tournament, and you are the short stack with 40,000. Player1 has 100,000; player2 has 90,000 in chips.

Blinds and antes have already been posted, and come to 9,000 (5,000/2,500 blinds, 500 ante).

You are the BB. Player1 is under the gun, and goes all in; player2 calls.

1st place pays 17,000, 2nd place pays 6,000 and 3rd place pays 2,000.

You have pocket Aces.

What is the best play?

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You have nothing to lose by calling. You have to play to win. Call.

mysticanime said:

You have nothing to lose by calling. You have to play to win. Call.

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Actually you have $4000 to potentially lose by calling. Remember, AA loses value against more players. You are still only the favorite by a little at this point in the scenario, so there is more to consider than just %.

The play here is to Fold. The final 3 at the table is already in the money, so now you are jockeying for position.

One of two things happens. Player 2 wins leaving Player 1 with only 10K in chips and barely enough to stand the upcoming blinds. OR Player 1 wins and busts Player 2 out. This moves you into guaranteed 2nd place money at the minimum.

If the latter happens, remember you have $35000 in chips left and would be facing about a 5 to 1 chip deficit against the new chip leader. But at these blinds, $35 in enough to do some real damage to the other guys stack so he would still be hesitant to call in fear of doubling you up.

I'm sure plenty of people would disagree, but I'll gladly take my way to the bank everytime. Yes, there are two possible answers. But the RIGHT answer is to fold.

LOL....ummmmmmmmmm......LOL all in duh

what the **** you mean FOLD is the best play??? if you are playing for second place and want to fold aces instead of possibly tripling up you should also should never play poker again.....why fold them? to me, it seems like this guy was playing on pokerstars and first prize was play chips....cuz i cant possibly if you are playing for real cash you dont know the answer to this ...you call everytime

I would say fold, but the only reason is because every time I have the dreaded pocket rockets I lose no matter how I play them.

bpazjr13 you are consistently insulting fellow members here. Seems you cant participate in the simplest of threads without gunning hard at other peoples skills or pesonality. I havent seen any evidence making you the poker guru of Cardschat, so hang back on the insults!

Try stating your opinion in a normal fashion as grown ups would do in a normal debate.

the right answer is to call, you should always be playing for the first place, second and third really are the same.

i think the answer is dependent on your style of playing. if you play to win the tournament you call every time. if you are playing to win the money that you know is guaranteed to you then you fold and hope that you move up in position. neither one is right or wrong. it just seems that different types of players would play this differently. i think the real question is how would a pro like Lederer or Brunson play these. The answer to that is probably differently for different reasons. Doyle would go all in because of his aggressive nature where as Lederer would probably fold and wait it out. Or maybe they would both call because everyone wants to win first and nobody cares about the difference between second and third.

Call and let the cards fall as they may. If you are not going to call with the short stack and the best hand when are you going to call? In this situatuion I can see folding Kings and definitely Queens or Jacks but not Aces.

i have to agree with fubarcdn...I realize the more opponents there are the easier it is to lose with aces. I would fold qq and down but if you are not going to play here with aces when are you.

Go all in.. you are allready guaranteed money for 3rd.. So why not go all in.. my favorite saying "no guts no glory". However being that both are all in, you could fold cause either 1 will be out or the other will be the short stack. Then your significant chance of getting more money will be on the plus side.

If i was the short stack with the best hand..i'd call it....jeez throw in a shirt or 2 if i have to, but whats the best choice..not sure..the one that wont get u knocked out?

cranck said:

bpazjr13 you are consistently insulting fellow members here. Seems you cant participate in the simplest of threads without gunning hard at other peoples skills or pesonality. I havent seen any evidence making you the poker guru of Cardschat, so hang back on the insults!

Try stating your opinion in a normal fashion as grown ups would do in a normal debate.

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ummm...blow me......they are not insults....i tell it like i see it....you read my posts and i am str8 forward and to the point..i dont dick around....if you dont likey..dont ready...thanks for coming out..

easy answer

fold. someone has a hand like KQ or QJ or K10 and will either hit a straight or a flush 35% of the time after a good flop. i would fold my As cuz the loser of that hand will be down to 10000 or be out!! and i would still have 35000+

I stand by my response. And I've done it to the tune of a first place finish (btw bpazjr, it was real money) cash tourney. The buy in was $300 + $20, not a free roll so there was a solid difference in payout for top 4. I did it by laying down AA against three other players. Actually two were called all in and one was pot committed but folded (worked in his favor but left him hopelessly crippled in chips).

Guess what. If I'd have played my hand, I'd have lost to a flush that came on the turn. Pushing all-in based on two pocket cards in this situation is simply plain gambling. I don't play poker to gamble, I play to win. And I will take any ethical edge I can get to win, including folding AA to a field of all in callers.

You can debate theory all you'd like (especially those saying, you just push in because they are aces, that would be an interesting conversation). No one claiming to be a solid poker player would make a decision simply based on the card value of two pocket cards. How some of you can say that you would, I will never understand. There is much more to it.

Folding AA is not and was not an emotional decision, it was a skillful decision. If you can't understand that or can't understand the logic to get to that decision, then by all means make the call. Life will be easier and more profitable for all of us.

Oh, and one point of clarity...I didn't say I always fold AA. The fold is situational and there is logic involved. Again, like I said before. You may disagree, but I'll take my decision to the bank.

you show me one time a professional player folded AA and i will give you a cookie...

and jack..are you Bigfreelife too? cuz he was the original poster and he never said if it was real or not

bpazjr13 said:

you show me one time a professional player folded AA

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You mean in real life or that horseshit they video tape and play on TV. Screw that. Go poll your own professionals. You don't seem to understand the logic (and apparently don't have facts to back up your retaliations), but you'll be surprised at what they'd tell you.

bpazjr13 said:

and jack..are you Bigfreelife too? cuz he was the original poster and he never said if it was real or not

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No genius, I am not Bigfreelife, too. I was simply responding to what appeared to be comments directed to me about my post that you didn't like because it conflicted with your warped reality. I must have gotten confused by your intellectual, fact based responses that are always clearly written. :rofl:

When you feel like discussing this in a logical manner (in case you're confused, that means using facts and logic, not name calling, flaming, and everything else you like to do), let me know. I'll be happy to debate with you.

The answer may seem obvious to call... But supposing that two of these players go allin and you will have 2nd place secure when the hand is over and will secure $6000. If you were to call your chances of winning is 1 in 3 since you have about a 3rd of the chips. If you call you will get an average of (1/3) $6000 + 2/3 ( $2000) = 2000 + 1,333 = $3,333

But If we fold: (1/2) $17,000 + (1/2) $6000 = 8,500 + 3,000 = $11,500 average... I think this hand... although tempting.... is an easy fold unless you have other feelings about the situation that may suggest you to do otherwise.

Well put Prysm. I like the way you detailed the money angle, too. It helps make the point.

I can't quote numbers and percentages, 'cause I'm just too dumb, but it seems to me that the odds of all four aces being distributed to three players in six cards would be pretty astronomical. Jack makes a good point that you have to consider the number of opponents in a hand when playing AA, but that's usually in a full ring. I'd have to call it and see if the poker pigeon shits on my head. Getting your money in, in the best possible spot, is really all you can do anyway.

(And I'm gratified to see that I'm not the only member who thinks bjpazjr is just a rude jerk. Was beginning to think I was being overly sensitive.)