Dealing with bad winners.

This I think has become the worse leak in my game.

Bad winners are people who play trash the entire tournament but win despite their poor play.

I have come to the conclusion that most tourneys are the short run. Because you will see these kind of people win all the time.

However you rarely see them at the final table again. Why? because they suck and got lucky in the short run which just happened to be that one tournament.

I never and I mean almost never can get away with play even close to that. I will catch flush or straight draws like 2 or 3 times the entire tourney of like 200 hands. And 1 of those will be a hand I folded preflop because it was just plain junk. But, these bad players will catch a flush or straight 20 or 30 times over the course of the tourney.

Just these puts me on tilt how these idiots can get so lucky playing bad like that and I have to play supertight to just stay in the tourney.

So, the question is how do you deal with this? I tend to get loose for a few hands and then have to retighten when I realize I just am not gonna get draws like they do. Which means I just have to go back to my old style of playing ultra tight.

First off, I must agree with you. I hate people that play horrible cards and catch. One solution to this is to raise preflop so as to make them fold. Another solution is, not to worry. Let each hand go and play the next. As you said, you get loose for a few hands. When you fold a hand you must have ur mind set to say "Oh well". There will always be times when a folded hand becomes an awesome hand with one turn of a card. But more often then this occuring, you will fold and see that it was a good fold.

Let them win on their horrible cards and they will eventually come to a point where they either get screwed in the same way, or you will simply beat them with higher cards. Be patient and you can take them out.

"But one has to start with the basics. There are certain things about probabilities that you absolutely must know*.

"The first is that the cards break even. If you turn over 13 cards from a deck, then reshuffle, and do this again and again, the ace of spades will show up just as many times (one out of four) if I'm shuffling them or if you're shuffling them yourself.

"Over a long period of time, the worst player in the world is going to catch just as many good cards as the best player in the world.

"We'll have the same cards to play, but I'll beat him sooner or later because I'm a better player.

"That's universally true. It applies to all forms of Poker."

-- Doyle Brunson, from "Super System", pg. 28
(*all emphasis his own)

No "great" poker player can make up for luck on internet play. A poor player can easily be spotted in live action play. But not seeing body language or being able to recognize betting habits is a major disadvantage. It is easy to get frustrated when playing these types of players BUT they are easy to overcome..PATIENTS is the only way to beat them. If you let them get under your skin their luck will take you down but if you can wait for the great hands its a no brainer. I NEVER go all in preflop against a player like that unless i know it would be a heads up sitiuation and I'm sitting with A/A or K/K and that is the ONLY time. In the end they will beat themselves.

It bothers me just as much. Though I am new to Hold'em I think that I play a lot better than most others at the tables. Never mind some may have more money at the time. But what gets to me is that in the end I loose a flush I get on the turn, ace high, to a full house on the river, something like 5 and 3s. They go all in with that on the turn and then get lucky. Now I am either out or very low on money. It gets to me every time.

you must also remember that bad players get luckier.

This is because bad players will get a great card when they shouldn't be looking, while good players wont be looking and wwont get that "luck"

If you go in with good cards you will win more, but you will deserve these wins

if you go in with bad hands you will win less and many of these wins will be undeservant

you rarely catch a bad beat (from bad play) from a good player

so next time this happens just think to yourself that the guy who beat you isprobably smiling but probably has lost a lot more money than you in the long run

one time I posted a really nasty chat message to someone that was playing stupid but still winning. It's not worth it though. It doesn't change anything and it didn't make me feel any better.

--it happens in poker.

Well I have to say. The comments have been very good to this post. Lots of useful info. Which is what i was trying to get.

Rammer straight on with your comment. A very valid point. A very smart person who made a ranking system for poker cards. Or else it would a pretty boring game. LOL

Great input everyone. Thanks again for posting.

disquinox said:

you must also remember that bad players get luckier.

This is because bad players will get a great card when they shouldn't be looking, while good players wont be looking and wwont get that "luck"

If you go in with good cards you will win more, but you will deserve these wins

if you go in with bad hands you will win less and many of these wins will be undeservant

you rarely catch a bad beat (from bad play) from a good player

so next time this happens just think to yourself that the guy who beat you isprobably smiling but probably has lost a lot more money than you in the long run

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I don't think bad players get more luck I think they just stick around to see more flops and as a result pull more lower sets and multiple pairs. Tight players only stay in with big cards and low flops hurt them. Loose players hit more pairs but rarely hit them big. Vary your game and you may hit some too. I'll play 7 - 4 on or off suit every time, superstition, my lucky cards, I hit a really big pot on a boat with these and they continue to due well for me. Multi-pairs, boats and straights more than once. So if your playing me and see 7-4-4 flop run and hide.

When I play in tourneys, if a bad player has a large chip stack, I see it as money that is easily winnable back and I do not really worry about them. You just have to wait for them to walk into one of your larger hands with their 2-7o. I'd rather some noob holding the chips rather than some shark who bullies.

Buster Gonad
(and his...)

The best explanation is to deal hands face up to 10 players, determine which the best hand is and after flop, turn and river see which hand would win...the best starting hand won't win all the time...poker is a game of statistics and psychology and good poker players always find a way to bend them

Steveg72 said:

A poor player can easily be spotted in live action play. But not seeing body language or being able to recognize betting habits is a major disadvantage.

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If you play a lot of poker on line, you sure better be able to recognize betting habits & tendencies. It's the only reliable tell you have at the cyber table.

Thats why I use the note factor when I'm playing. You will run into alot of those idiot players and if you keep notes they will help you kill and destroy them when you run into them later.