White House Finally Answers on Poker Petition

Took them 8 months to answer the petition.

Email I received 2 days ago. No surprises here. Only continues the frustration.

The email requested feedback on the petition process in general. This was mine:

Petitions were a good idea. Unfortunately, all the responses I have received were the typical answers we always get from politicians. Which is basically, thank you for your response but we have already made up our minds and are invested in the status quo no matter what the people want.

At least no trees were needlessly slaughtered.

But taxpayer dollars were.

Here's the news story courtesy of tbdbitl:

http://www.anteupmagazine.com/news/w...online-pok.htm

partial: I need to find that petition!.

We are suppose to be the Land of the Free. I say Prove it and let me play poker online, its my right and my choice. I am an American for freedom!

So typical of the nanny state in which we live. We can always count on our elected officials to protect us from ourselves, no matter the cost to our personal freedom.

Obviously by "answered" they didn't answer anything... standard.

You think this is bad, wait until, if ever, they legalize poker online. Gov. always seems to make the easy hard, they could turn a lifetime long twinkie into a rotten pile of mush.

I've had this battle with several players in the past that keep clicking their heels in hopes that the gov. will see it their way.

You may end up with, few options, too high of stakes and or rakes. For instance California indian casinos in the south part of the state have huge minimums sometimes starting at $25 per blackjack hand.

For some of you thats fine but joe and jane pokermann in a whole wont play those high stakes. Another big problem is politicians greed, dont be surprised to see $10 minimum tournaments with a 2 or even 2.50 fee.

While that's all a concern, and I don't mean to minimize it at all; I'm far more concerned about the taxes you'll inevitably face as you try to withdraw your winnings. Can anyone really afford to pay something like a 30% or so tax on their winnings IF they are fortunate enough to win in the first place?

In a "sport" where something like 80%+ of the players are aleady losing players to begin with; this will virtually eliminate any profits that the portion of players who are only marginally winning players now enjoy. That's gonna leave only the "crushers" as enjoying any true winnings and, eventually, I fear, will kill online poker as, say, 90%+ of people realize that, with the onerous taxes, there is just little money left to be made unless you are at the top of the heap.

Hope I'm wrong....... I wouldn't mind an up-front tax so much (taxed as you deposit) and then any winnings are free and clear, but I just don't think it'll pan-out that way.

I can see how a 30% tax on withdraws would kill marginal winnings but what makes you think it would be such a high number?

All US players just migrate north to Canada..

Greed, Government ineptness, Sin tax; take your pick.

If I were younger, and single, I'd already be there. Or, in Vegas playin live.

Im only 18, still a possibility for me , poker games definitely going to have to improve though, which it seems to be doing.

So no actual evidence. Gotcha. A bit surprising since half the posts on this site are along the lines of "can you post more information, I can't draw a conclusion with what's provided"

Of course no actual evidence. It would be difficult to have evidence of what rate it will be taxed at when they haven't even passed anything to regulate it/make it legal. Just past experience.

Best I can do atm is anecdotal evidence. Look around. Taxes are ridiculously high. Taxes on "luxury" and/or "sin" items tend to be even higher. Poker will be an easy target for taxation when/if the government gets involved in it's regulation. As I stated in my previous post, I hope I'm wrong. But, I doubt it.

I know some of the feds tax laws, it would be 15% to 30%.
You also have to pay the sate tax.

Tax laws will make your head spin.

That's the plan...and why so many don't do their own taxes. The government really doesn't want you to know all the games they play. Everyone seems to know how much they get back, but ask them how much they paid and they don't know. If you get a refund, you just loaned your money to the government for 0 interest.

if you want safety...regulation....you need govt.....because people are inherently greedy and without regulation bad things happen.

or you can take the risk of playing cards with friends and friends of friends and hope not to get busted or cheated....

or stop playing altogether.

this is still a free country...even if options are limited

You guys keep saying that despite mountains of evidence to the contrary..

Not trying to knock America or anything, but to keep saying that cliche all the time, regardless of the ridiculous restrictions and legislation is stretching it a bit.

I really hope, for all our sakes, that the intelligent people in your country start overpowering all the sheep and finally get things rolling the other way before we all have to suffer even more over this nonsense.

^^Agree 110%.

Why, exactly, do we the government to "keep us safe" while playing poker? I always felt entirely safe pre BF, was never ripped-off, not even once, and got all my money back when the DOJ forced PS to kick me out. Turns out it was the government that I needed protection from, not big, bad PokerStars.

I realize this was not the case for everyone, but I'm just sayin'. There is no need for the government to "keep you safe" in an online environment if you just do a little due diligence yourself before you invest your money anywhere. Even if you allocated xAmount of your online money to be lost to fraud/dishonesty, unless you are a total fool, this amount will end-up being less than the government will charge all of us for the priviledge of "keeping us safe".

should say:

what we know about online poker:

**** all.

And if things could be this simple then we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place. If only.

The two parties have such a stranglehold on the election process, that any intelligent 3rd party poker candidate doesn't have a chance. And since the Supreme Court decided that corporations are people, Congress is hopelessly bought and paid for. The kool-aid drinkers at both ends of the political spectrum will vote their party poker even if the devil himself were running and since both presidential candiates have to pander to their base, the whole thing is depressing.

I lost a lot more money to the DOJ (Tilt, AP, UB) than I did to fraud.

Lost a few hundred at Pitbull (the f****rs), and $8 at gohard (luckily I cashed out just before they closed everleaf to US players. I suppose that could be put on the DOJ, too ).

That reminds me, did anyone ever get any of their everleaf money?

This US boy agrees! I love my country but hate the politics. In with the sharks out with sheep is what I say. I bet every one of those hipocritcal politicians have once in there lives played a freindly .25/.50 or 1.00 / 2.00 game amongst friends. If I'm wrong, I'll eat Angelina Jolies dirty underwear. Come to think of it, if I'm right I'll eat Angelinas Jolies dirty underwear!

All we can do is keep pushing the fact... Persistence is the key to success... Get out and vote in November... Every vote counts! Don't just sit around and wait for everything to be put into your lap... do your part... Vote!

P.S. I just registered to vote in my district yesterday... it took me a total of 15 minutes from receiving the paperwork to it being accepted by the worker on site... Fight for your rights! Do not let you vote go silent into the night! Fight for your rights and for what you believe to be fair and just. If you are not registered to vote then here is a start for you:

http://www.usa.gov/Citizen/Topics/Voting/Register.shtml

Let your voice be heard this November! And Continue to fight for what you believe in!

Moe.

P.S. I know I sound repetitive, but sometimes people need to hear or read it a few times to let it sink in. In no way am I being or intended to be patronizing or sarcastic.

They means of technologically circumventing restrictions that can allow individuals from countries where gambling is illegal to play. Online games publishers are like a cheater because gambling sites are much easier and like telemarketing scams.

you do know that the white house does not care, since they like to spend money that they dont have

Try writing your congressman. I received a very similar, wordy response, that took absolutely no position and thanked me for contacting him. Until they figure out how to tax something for their benefit, they don't care.

I have been saying for years on this issue...be careful what you wish for. The folks who are taking a stance that government usually turns out to be a bigger problem for the average joe than a business out in the world, usually have a little more experience with such things in their personal history.

Government is greed and power and unstoppable force with unlimited resources (relative to the average joe or the average billionaire, for that matter).

Government in America was supposed to focus on protecting Americans lives and property, and it did just that for about a hundred years.

Today, Government is just as likely to destroy your life over what should be none of their damn business as they are to protect you.

Todays politicians are usually more focused on what they can extract from you in regulation and taxes than they are on protecting you from shady businessfolks. And when they do go after the shady ones they usually end up seizing citizens assets and levying fines against the offending shady business and everybody gets screwed (except the bureaucrats, of course).

I agree that a 30% tax will ruin the game of online poker. Nevada has legalized online poker so we will be able to see what the taxes are like soon.

So much for the American Dream, what about the Poker Dream ??? I think it is time they wake up and allow the US to live like a democracy!

I would think that the tax would be levied as some type of licence say $25,000/poker site/year rather than a % of winnings.

Maybe I am wrong and the states will go for a % of profits.

^^ Not sure what you're referring to here. The sites will certainly be taxed on their profits, but most of the discussion is about how/how much PLAYERS will be taxed on their winnings. We've been over this ground in other threads before and, although no one knows anything definite yet, I would anticipate a personal tax in the area of 25-30%. That will just make it even tougher to turn any kind of post-tax profit for many players.

If they dont do it federaly, it wont happen without headaches. Lets say Nevade starts online site tomorrow for Navadians. The same thing that is happening to the pot dispensaries in CA for medical Pot. Its ok in the state but the feds come into the state raid them and close them down or take the the money. You think the feds wont do that over and over to state run online poker. HMMM Navada Party poker is out of line lets raid them, take the money and then tell players, Its not legal federally

Not the same thing. Unlike drugs, no federal law makes playing online poker illegal, the Wire Act is out of play and the UIGEA defers to state law.