Your thoughts on this BRM strategy

I am playing single table SnGs (NLO8 KO games)

To become an even bigger nit on BRM I have moved to a theory where if I lose three (not ITM) I am done for the day. I normally play two at a time and play both till I am done.

I play mostly on Pokerstars and if I lose three I move to AP and UB to finish out my playing day. Games don't fill up fast there.

I have also considered adding in a clause where when I finish in 1st this cancels out one of the loses.

What are everyone's thoughts on doing this. Am I am going to miss opportunities by doing this? Is it not effective for VPPs?

I have no idea why I chose three by the way.

Thoughts are greatly appreciated.

I did the three and out thing for a while - wasn't really about BRM though - more about forcing myself to study.
So my question is if you go three and out and are done for the day - then what? Nothing to do with poker until the next day?
If you include in there you have to spend an hour hitting the books (or training site, or DVD or some study method) then you have a winner, in my book.

Well three and out for Pokerstars then three and out on AP and if I still have time I move to UB but those games take so long to fill up.

I usually do use that time in between games to read the forums. I will consider an hour of reading per day though on your suggestion.

Also I agree it might not all be about BRM as much as it is cutting my play when I am not doing all that great.

Thanks

Yeah I bounced back and forth tween PS and Absolute for a while - switching when things weren't going my way. In retrospect I don't think I was doing myself any favors. It was also switching back and and forth form MTT (PS) to full ring and/or 6 max (Absolute). The last few months I forced myself to lock down on one thing and it's been paying off.
Also, if you are already exercising good table selection no need to have to switch sites.

I always start my day on PS and if I am doing well i can usually play there the whole time. Playing 2 at a time and not starting new ones till both are done lasts about 1-1.5 hours. I can usually do this twice sometimes three times before lunch. Then depending on how I am playing 2-3 sessions in the afternoon. If I reach my 3 loses by 4pm I am usually playing two games at AP and then i am done for the day those AP games take a long time to fill though. At night if I play it will usually be at AP unless I hadn't already lost three at PS that day. I also play in the CC games at night and home games when good ones pop up.

Table selection at PLO8/NLO8 is not usually possible since there are hardly ever more than a handful going at once. At the level I am playing you almost never run into the same people maybe one or two regulars at any game. At AP/UB you have to play in the game registering since it can be an hour till another one starts to fill.

Yeah that waiting for fill up at Absolute is just not worth it - is it? That's why I only played cash over there. No sense in punishing yourself by having to wait for action when you could be knee deep in it at PS. There's just no benefit to you or your game - is there?
Probably better to stay in one place and make it about you - not about the site. If you get on a downswing, address it - don't avoid it.
Plus 3 consecutive no ITM finishes is not that unusual. Last month I had a couple negative swings of over 10 in a row and still was +33% ROI for the month. No site change, no game change, no stakes change.
Take em head on!

Moving my play to another site once I lose the three games has nothing to do with the site (running from it or blaming it) just has to do with not losing more of my BR at that site. I always return to PS first thing next morning. I can see your point though.

As far as the three loses I guess there is room to fine tune that. Say maybe a percentage of my BR at that site per day instead of games lost?

As far as waiting for games at AP it is certainly a pain in the A but like we discussed before this could be the time spent studying right?

gruching

why move sites?

Different games. Different players.

it seems like a waste to me to play on multiple sites. your BR will never grow nearly as fast if you switch back and forth. anyway, If I lose a few SNGs in a row I drop down to the lower level, which are generally easier. I stay down there until I place in a few or feel like i am playing better

Honestly it just sounds a bit convoluted to me. If you're rolled for games at a particular level then you should be able to keep playing them all day, even if you lose a few in a row.

Sounds like more of a tilt management strategy than a BRM strategy to me.

Agreed, losing 3 sngs in a row is easy to do and something I do often and well! If you feel good and your playing well play on. If you are a BR nit then you will be good to take a small downswing.

I started playing SnGs again after a run at ring and I started at the 1.40 KOs to get back into it. I feel I might be rolled for the 4.10 games but I also feel that if I am not crushing the 1.40s then I have no business trying to make the 4.10 my daily game. At this point the only way to move down when I am feeling like I could be playing better is to move to the .50 cent games on AP. I have a small BR on AP and on UB but neither is big enough to withdraw from. My hope is to get one of them up to a level where I can and then move it out. I also get RB on AP so I am hoping to grow that a little more as I play these smaller games. I know it will take all year but that is the life of a micro grinder right

Good advice and I will try to keep that in mind. I am def rolled for the 1.40 I am just trying to minimize the hit I take to the PS bankroll I guess. Would you advise this as a good tilt strategy then?

That's the thing I feel like maybe some days I play too much so I am trying to figure out if I can play better by playing only when I am playing my best. I thought that maybe if I hit a certain amount of loses it would be a signal that it is time to take a break.

I am not stuck on the number three as a magic number. I was hopng to see if people agreed with this tye of thing maybe the number of games lost could be factored by something else. As I asked maybe percentage of BR is a better way to look at it. Say no more than 5% down for the day or it's break time?

Sure - if you actually have a tilt problem that's easily triggered.

If you can keep a level head and keep playing your best game after you've lost three games in a row though* then I'd say there's no need for it. Keep playing for as long as you think you're playing your best.



* Hint: you HAVE to be able to do this if you want to play SnGs long-term.

Okay Oz thanks. It's advice like this that I really need in this case.

Do you think it makes more sense (if I am trying to limit mydaily loss) to work off of a BR percentage instead. Say no more than 2% lost or done for the day? Or do you really think I should not limit myself in any way?

How much time a day do you have to play poker?

I can usually play between 4-8 hours during the day. It really varries and also depends on how long I last at the SnGs. When i was playing ring I was on for about 7 hours a day.

So true, you really shouldn't get tilted by losing three in a row, i regularly have 7-10 game streaks when I bubble every one but then I can win the next 2 and cash in the next. Just play through it, 3 games isn't even a sample

Stopping/continuing based on results is pretty bad. Now if you want to stop when you've made 3 bad decisions in a row (win or lose btw) fine.

Also you mentioned being rolled for the $1.40s. Is that 40% rake??? If so, wtf???

Ok then you have plenty of time to play so if you wnat to make any serious money in sngs then your going to have to put volume in because volume is bonus money, shots at leaderboards and profit. That doesnt mean that you have to open a silly amount of tables and become a loosing player but it does mean that you have to let go of some of the fear. When you play sngs with and regularity a few things will happen,

a) you will go large stretches of games with no significant cashes

b) you will be the bubble boy many times because you should be trying to win and many players will throw both yours and their equity right down the sink.

c) you will make the right plays and get sucked out on alot more than you will suck out on them due to this.

The best feeling in sngs is laughing when your QQ loses too 22 on the bubble and sends you out because somebody who should be folding in that spot doesnt understand basic sng concepts. I think you should spend a few days just playing if you feel good and trying not too look at your results, just try and make every play the right one.

These are KO .25 cents goes to the KO pool. Thanks for the advice.

Love Doves - That song rocks in fact I am gonna turn it on for my next two games. Thanks for the advice. I will forget the idea of quitting based on games lost. How about percentage of BR? Still no?

I am also considering bumping to 3 games at a time to help with the volume.

Ok 15% rake makes more sense (although moving up asap to where the rake is 10% should be goal #1).

Why does it matter how many you lose today? If you play well and lose 20BI in a row what's the difference from playing 4 a day over 5 days and losing 20BI in a row?

Thanks Ben. I guess I need to just stay focused and keep these things in mind. Like everyone else I am happiest when the BR is going up.

no problem, just keep grinding away

Will do

So pokertron....I played two games right after you posted the Doves track and listened to the whole CD over here and won both of my games. Guess that was a nice good luck charm. Thanks.

Haha cool, I think Ben posted the most apt thing to do with sngs and online poker in general for most people and that is just keep grinding away, unfortunately most of us will not get a chance to pull of a crazy bluff to become chip leader at the final table of the WSOP, or become the next Blom and play a silly amount of high stakes tables at once. Your poker time should be spent pushing your boundries and in sngs that would be amount played if you want any chance of building a decent roll to move up.

In therory it will only get harder to beat each level anyway so may aswell get used to losing as well as winning.

I guess because I am a nit and I want to lose the least amount possible.

Yeah I like I am going to add another table to the mix. I can handle three on my slow days usually.

As far as moving up goes. I would like to move up at some point. My next goal is to move to the $4.10 games when I hit $200, less than 20 bucks to go.

As far as going much higher than that ia m not sure cause of all the regulars (especially at O8) I might prefer to win at the micros than lose and have to start all over again anyway. Time will tell. I am not playing as a career. If my BR allows for it I will move up. I may actually mix levels when I first move up so continue to play 1.40s while throwing a 4.10 in as my third table. Again time will tell.

For today though I am glad I never did make it to three loses. I am done for the day played in 8 and cashed in 6. Will move to three tables at a time tomorrow.

But you'll lose the same amount, just over a slightly longer period of time...

If you don't sort this attitude out you'll struggle to ever put in any sort of decent volume because you'll be too worried about losing (which will happen) to ever win anything. As long as you don't tilt when you lose all you are doing is slowing down your progress up stakes.

This isn't even a BRM strategy IMO, more a volume curtailing strategy :P

Yeah this hits the nail on the head. The fewer games you play, the more you notice/care about swings, and in sngs you really cannot be caring about 5, 10, 20, hell even 50BI swings in some forms are standard

^^^ This.

Even if i lose 3 games back to back, from a bad move or bad beat, i know i can beat them, and make a comeback..
Just stick to BRM and your fine.

It is pretty clear I should not be using this quit after three loses method. Starting tomorrow I will play as long as I feel I am not tilting and I will add another table for volume.

Thanks all!