advice on this hand?

vinylspiros · Jan 9, 2013

hey guys .
NLHE/8.80 Buy In. Field 6000 players. 150 players untill the bubble (20 minutes or so). like 800 remaining or smthng.
MY POSITION 7th .(100 BB+)
VILLAIN 10th (100BB)
villain raises 3,5x from UTG with pocket 9's, i wake up with aces on button and decide to shove cause it felt like he had a monster(KK,QQ,AKsuited) and wanted to play for stacks.He calls.FLOP comes 554 turn Q river 9.
he rivers his 3rd nine.im crippled. i bubble in ANGER 2 hands later.
SO heres the question. should i have just made a monster raise PF and then a good c-bet on the FLOP and then taken it down with another huge bet on the turn with the Q scarring him off? if i played it without shoving preflop he would have never hit that 9 cause i wouldnt have allowed it to ever come up. by shoving PF i gave him a chance to suck out on me in a way. ESP after 3 hours in the tourney.
sometimes when u slowplay it they hit it and ur doomed and sometimes if u fastplay they dont hit it and u win. whats the right play?

Samweis3 · Jan 9, 2013

i read some post about this villain being an aggressive player who is definetly a reg., may you should have done it in the second way you described, but i am not sure if he would have folded. Anyway i would not have shoved in this stage of the tourney being in that position, being small stack its no question...better play a bit more tight

mandyf27 · Jan 9, 2013

I read Chris Ferguson say something about playing a tournament with the goal being first place and not just ITM. With pocket A's, im trying to get as much money in the pot as possible. I'm nowhere near a pro though but I wouldnt beat urself up about that hand...its the 2 hands later that u chipped it in frustration.

Beanfacekilla · Jan 9, 2013

I think the goal with aces is to get as many chips as you can into the pot with 1 caller preflop. You did this, but villain just sucked you out.

Don't beat yourself up about it. Well played, just unlucky.

doomasiggy · Jan 9, 2013

Shoving AA here is bad against most opponents, but whoever this guy is he's raise calling aipf for 100bb effective on the bubble from utg with 99 so it's fine against him.

My preferred line would be to make a standard 3-bet pre, but only because his utg range is wider than you think and he'll fold a lot of the time if we straight up jam.

Poker Orifice · Jan 9, 2013

vinylspiros said:
hey guys .
NLHE/8.80 Buy In. Field 6000 players. 150 players untill the bubble (20 minutes or so). like 800 remaining or smthng.
MY POSITION 7th .(100 BB+)
VILLAIN 10th (100BB)
villain raises 3,5x from UTG with pocket 9's, i wake up with aces on button and decide to shove cause it felt like he had a monster(KK,QQ,AKsuited) and wanted to play for stacks.He calls.FLOP comes 554 turn Q river 9.
he rivers his 3rd nine.im crippled. i bubble in ANGER 2 hands later.
SO heres the question. should i have just made a monster raise PF and then a good c-bet on the FLOP and then taken it down with another huge bet on the turn with the Q scarring him off? if i played it without shoving preflop he would have never hit that 9 cause i wouldnt have allowed it to ever come up. by shoving PF i gave him a chance to suck out on me in a way. ESP after 3 hours in the tourney.
sometimes when u slowplay it they hit it and ur doomed and sometimes if u fastplay they dont hit it and u win. whats the right play?

What was your goal by shoving pre? Was it to appear weak'ish'.. ie. AK hoping for a call from 99-QQ, or was it a 'please fold I got good but don't want to try to play a hand postflop in position with 100bb's effective' ?

'IF' you had 3bet pre (~2.3 - 2.5x his raise) and villain had called OOP, had him check/call flop to a standard cbet... why would you want him to be scared of the 'Q' on the turn? (wouldn't you hope he'd check/call turn too? I mean why would you hope he'd fold when he's drawing so slim? < seems strange).

If you were hoping for villain to call off pre (who knows why they ever would?) then you got just what you wanted... so in this case > 'nh'

vinylspiros · Jan 9, 2013

Poker Orifice said:
What was your goal by shoving pre? Was it to appear weak'ish'.. ie. AK hoping for a call from 99-QQ, or was it a 'please fold I got good but don't want to try to play a hand postflop in position with 100bb's effective' ?
it was please call me with a AK,KK,QQ type of hand. im trying to scare u off i have trash and im being creative. thats why i shoved.
'IF' you had 3bet pre (~2.3 - 2.5x his raise) and villain had called OOP, had him check/call flop to a standard cbet... why would you want him to be scared of the 'Q' on the turn? (wouldn't you hope he'd check/call turn too? I mean why would you hope he'd fold when he's drawing so slim? < seems strange).
i wouldnt want him to be scarred of the Q on the turn of course. what im saying is,had i played it that way,his 99 overpair to the 554 flop would not look so good after seeing the Q and me raising bigtime on it and perhaps i could have gotten a fold before the river so that he didnt hit his trips.im kinda saying "what if" i had played it that way.
If you were hoping for villain to call off pre (who knows why they ever would?) then you got just what you wanted... so in this case > 'nh'

yea man i just got unlucky i know.Sometimes it seams logical to fold aces if u are way deep in a tourney with a HUGE stack and u dont wanna have any surprises from another HUGE stack. like what if u go from 100BB to 130BB.is that difference worth ur tourney life?
Me personally, next time im 7th or 12th position etc in a tourney of 5000+ players and there are very few remaining,there is no way im gonna go all in against another monster stack even with aces.i preffer to play my game than the coin flips that involve alot of high stack ego.i avoid those traps in general.im more of a raise see flop ,i got good post flop skillz.

vinylspiros · Jan 9, 2013

doomasiggy said:
Shoving AA here is bad against most opponents, but whoever this guy is he's raise calling aipf for 100bb effective on the bubble from utg with 99 so it's fine against him.

My preferred line would be to make a standard 3-bet pre, but only because his utg range is wider than you think and he'll fold a lot of the time if we straight up jam.

i just got inlucky.Aces are a curse and a blessing at the same time . people over rely on them sometimes.and at the end of the day they r just a pair. and they often leave me hanging.

MIShroomer47 · Jan 12, 2013

yeah there was no reason to battle all in pre against a guy that has almost as many chips as you. Ship him a nice 3 bet... and when the flop comes fire again... that should be enough to get him offa a pair of nines... I don't see how the villian called AIPF with 99 anyway but maybe he thought you were on AK or something. Just a bit of bad luck he caught the 2 outer. It's tough to not shove AI on aces preflop... but sometimes it just isnt the right move...

vinylspiros · Jan 12, 2013

MIShroomer47 said:
yeah there was no reason to battle all in pre against a guy that has almost as many chips as you. Ship him a nice 3 bet... and when the flop comes fire again... that should be enough to get him offa a pair of nines... I don't see how the villian called AIPF with 99 anyway but maybe he thought you were on AK or something. Just a bit of bad luck he caught the 2 outer. It's tough to not shove AI on aces preflop... but sometimes it just isnt the right move...

i hear you bud.loud and clear.

Beanfacekilla · Jan 12, 2013

MIShroomer47 said:
yeah there was no reason to battle all in pre against a guy that has almost as many chips as you. Ship him a nice 3 bet... and when the flop comes fire again... that should be enough to get him offa a pair of nines... I don't see how the villian called AIPF with 99 anyway but maybe he thought you were on AK or something. Just a bit of bad luck he caught the 2 outer. It's tough to not shove AI on aces preflop... but sometimes it just isnt the right move...

I disagree respectfully.

A-A all in pre with one caller is getting your money in great. Villain was a serious underdog here. Run it 10 times, 100, 1,000, etc, hero is bound to come up ahead in the long run. Just because villain got lucky and sucked out, doesn't mean hero played it wrong.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I would live to get it in pre against 9-9 holding A-A. I don't know what villain was thinking here.

If I can get one caller, I will ship PF just about every time with A-A (with rare exceptions).

Just my $0.02

vinylspiros · Jan 12, 2013

Beanfacekilla said:
I disagree respectfully.

A-A all in pre with one caller is getting your money in great. Villain was a serious underdog here. Run it 10 times, 100, 1,000, etc, hero is bound to come up ahead in the long run. Just because villain got lucky and sucked out, doesn't mean hero played it wrong.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I would live to get it in pre against 9-9 holding A-A. I don't know what villain was thinking here.

If I can get one caller, I will ship PF just about every time with A-A (with rare exceptions).

Just my $0.02

although im looking for ways to have played it differently and not have bubbled, truth is i would shove those aces even in a multiway pot and always will for ever and ever esp preflop. so yea i dont ever see anyone folding aces in 99% of the cases preflop. it was just not my day. you owe me 4 cents. (that was my attempt for a joke)

Beanfacekilla · Jan 12, 2013

vinylspiros said:
although im looking for ways to have played it differently and not have bubbled, truth is i would shove those aces even in a multiway pot and always will for ever and ever esp preflop. so yea i dont ever see anyone folding aces in 99% of the cases preflop. it was just not my day. you owe me 4 cents. (that was my attempt for a joke)

Lol. It is stressful getting aces sometimes.....

micalupagoo · Jan 12, 2013

i think its a good play- you got the call and shoulda won, which woulda made you a huge stack, very unlucky
im sure he woulda called allin pf,flop,turn,and riv
what can ya do

JusSumguy · Jan 12, 2013

Played perfectly Vinyl.

-

gotchips · Jan 12, 2013

played well.. if you knew then what you know now your right you could have played it differently to maybe get your result you were looking for sometimes i find myself in the same situation..

brainspider · Jan 12, 2013

you could have just pushed it all in pf and he might not have called, but some Villans will call anyway. then you still loose. I think me I play it like u did especially if there are 2 or 3 other people adding to the pot

brainspider · Jan 12, 2013

i cant type..lol i ment i wouldnt wanna shove in pf inless 2 or3 already had. anyway

advice on this hand?

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