Pocket AA

#1 10th March 2010, 4:12 PM

So your dealt pocket AA, you want and should pre flop raise but you don't want to scare anyone away, do you do the minimal raise to reel the table in and slow play it? Or knowing that pocket AA don't always hold up, should you jump right in and go for the jugular????

#2 10th March 2010, 4:29 PM

You shouldnt min raise, nor should you bet stupidly big like 4 x the BB.

Your question is extremely broad, but is frequently asked.

In tournament play, at most levels a raise of around 2.5x the BB - 3x the BB is about right, most the time then your getting rid of the idiots but reeling a few people in playing QK's and AJ's, i cant help you for cash games as i dont play them. But if i did, i would probably make a 2.5x-3x BB raise in Cash games too.

Gl at the felts

FTP

#3 10th March 2010, 4:54 PM

I guess it would depend on the table..tight table 2.5-3 might be to high but would be fine on a looser table..to many times I have seen players go all in and I would say never do that

#4 10th March 2010, 5:39 PM

Generally speaking, depending on position, If late position and 2 or more limpers I am trying to isolate so I am either all in or a very large bet. If in early position I will make a very large bet for the same reason. If late position and 0 or 1 limpers I will bet 4x BB. The only reason I slow play AA is if I havent seen a flop for a long time and there are only 1 or 2 limpers, still pretty dangerous but I try it at times and get burned but I get burned making large bets too so go figure. I try not to go all in with big stack or someone who can damage my stack if possible.

#5 10th March 2010, 6:01 PM

If you want to raise, try and raise the same amount everytime. Generally 2.5-3x the BB + 1 BB per limper.
However, if you're in a freeroll or 25c donkament or hyper turbo or something, just shove preflop, you'll be amazed by what calls you.

#6 10th March 2010, 6:17 PM

Raise the normal amount you usually raise. I usually raise about 3-4 xBB always if I open raise no matter what hand I have. If I reraise, it depends on how much action preceded me. You want to isolate, so the more people involved in a pot, the bigger you should reraise.

#7 10th March 2010, 6:30 PM

Your main goal when youve got aces pre flop, is to disguise your hand, the last thing you want is people knowing youve got DA NUTZ

Like i said your question is very broad.

It depends so much on position, your reads on people on the table. I honetly wouldnt tell you to change how you would normally raise too much though. Especially if you have a loose image.

Say you have been raising alot 3x the BB and have been getting action and called won and turning over weak aces, and QK's, id say you just make the same raise again, disgiuse your hand. Its the best way to get action.

GL

FTP

#8 10th March 2010, 7:07 PM

In freerolls early on I would push all in as people will call with Q3 off suit. In a real tourney generally I like to raise 3XBB, but it all depends on position and your table dynamics.

#9 10th March 2010, 7:35 PM

this happen today on PS with AA, what do you all think? i played it wrong or right?

PokerStars Game #40958232027: Tournament #250222716, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2010/03/10 13:41:25 ET
Table '250222716 2016' 10-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: ELPAVAS (1600 in chips)
Seat 2: sergej64 (1490 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: papijarc (1470 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 4: paula906 (1580 in chips)
Seat 5: randris (6000 in chips)
Seat 6: Hobgoblingr (1490 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 7: GeoValentino (1480 in chips)
Seat 8: Lihula (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: evgenfox (6400 in chips)
Seat 10: jeanluc59140 (1100 in chips)
GeoValentino: posts small blind 15
Lihula: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to GeoValentino [As Ad]
evgenfox: calls 30
jeanluc59140: calls 30
ELPAVAS: folds
sergej64: folds
papijarc: folds
paula906: folds
randris: calls 30
Hobgoblingr: folds
GeoValentino: raises 180 to 210
Lihula: folds
evgenfox: calls 180
jeanluc59140: folds
randris: calls 180
*** FLOP *** [Js 9d Th]
GeoValentino: bets 1270 and is all-in
evgenfox: calls 1270
randris: calls 1270
*** TURN *** [Js 9d Th] 4♥
evgenfox: checks
randris: bets 1020
evgenfox: calls 1020
*** RIVER *** [Js 9d Th 4h] Q♠
evgenfox: checks
randris: bets 1200
evgenfox: calls 1200
GeoValentino said, "aces cracked again"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
randris: shows [Jh 9s] (two pair, Jacks and Nines)
evgenfox: shows [Jc Kh] (a straight, Nine to King)
evgenfox collected 4440 from side pot
GeoValentino: shows [As Ad] (a pair of Aces)
evgenfox collected 4500 from main pot

#10 10th March 2010, 7:40 PM

Many times, your premise about not wanting to scare anyone away is sub-optimal. AA plays best against one opponent, so you usually want to narrow the field, and should raise enough to do so. Sometimes, that means everyone will fold. That doesn't mean the bet was wrong or poor, just that it only won you a small pot - which beats losing a large one because you let too many people stay in the hand and one of them drew out on you.

#11 10th March 2010, 10:08 PM

The only thing you could have done was when you see you have 3 callers, limpers at that and one of them is short stack and two big stacks, you needed to push all in pre flop since your chip stack is short. Short stack will fold since he folded to a standard bet but you may also get one of the big stacks to fold or maybe both, in this case that would have been the best out come since they both hit straights but may not have called an all in. I'm much happier to get all my chips in up front with the best hand then to let someone in and get drawn on, your out either way if one of these calls but you did all you could do to get them out at that point with the all in pre flop.

#12 11th March 2010, 4:37 AM

The only thing that would make me check/fold faster on that flop w AA than the microseconds it would take me is if it were all of one suit - then I would be measuring time in nanoseconds.

You made a huge pf raise in the second level of an MTT and got called by two players. Players who are calling here don't have KK or AA - they would re-raise you - they have 77-QQ, Ax, and a bunch of connecting and suited cards from 87 to KQ, and a bunch of one gappers in the same ranking range. Any flop action here is going to absolutely crush our AA's.

Don't get married to your AA's once you get to postflop.

#13 11th March 2010, 5:22 AM

What SLy said...that's one of the worst flops imaginable for AA, maybe slightly behind KQJ.

#14 11th March 2010, 12:28 PM

Aces are just a pair... Unless you hit a set or a full house. Remember that.

Also, to answer the OP's question, it depends. On what?

Our Stack Size/Table Image
Table's Playstyle/Action Preflop
Cash Game?
Tournament? - Average Stack vs Our stack? Other stacks in the hand, players behind those stacks, and their stacks vs our stack
Etc. Etc.

Raise. If there is a lot of limping before you, raise more. If you are first in to the pot from the button, raise less. Never min-raise unless your stack is like 6 BBs and you plan on jamming on the flop. (Then again, why not just jam now? Then you're up to 7.5 BBs, 12.5-13 BBs if you get called?)

Remember, preflop is the only time you can be sure you're getting your money in good with Aces.

Ussually when I'm dealt them, my plan is to get all my money in as soon as I can. If the pot's 3-bet, I'll 4-bet it. If it's 4-bet, I'll 5-bet. If people give me credit for aces and fold hands like QQ-KK, great. I just got their initial raise and any other raises they made without having too see a flop.

Sometimes people raise big with hands like JJ and TT claiming 'they don't want to see a flop'. I never want to see a flop with any hand I think I'm ahead of preflop, because it's so easy to go from an 70% favorite to drawing all but dead.

My 2 cents.

#15 11th March 2010, 4:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoValentino

this happen today on PS with AA, what do you all think? i played it wrong or right?

PokerStars Game #40958232027: Tournament #250222716, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2010/03/10 13:41:25 ET
Table '250222716 2016' 10-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: ELPAVAS (1600 in chips)
Seat 2: sergej64 (1490 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: papijarc (1470 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 4: paula906 (1580 in chips)
Seat 5: randris (6000 in chips)
Seat 6: Hobgoblingr (1490 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 7: GeoValentino (1480 in chips)
Seat 8: Lihula (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: evgenfox (6400 in chips)
Seat 10: jeanluc59140 (1100 in chips)
GeoValentino: posts small blind 15
Lihula: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to GeoValentino [As Ad]
evgenfox: calls 30
jeanluc59140: calls 30
ELPAVAS: folds
sergej64: folds
papijarc: folds
paula906: folds
randris: calls 30
Hobgoblingr: folds
GeoValentino: raises 180 to 210
Lihula: folds
evgenfox: calls 180
jeanluc59140: folds
randris: calls 180
*** FLOP *** [Js 9d Th]
GeoValentino: bets 1270 and is all-in
evgenfox: calls 1270
randris: calls 1270
*** TURN *** [Js 9d Th] 4♥
evgenfox: checks
randris: bets 1020
evgenfox: calls 1020
*** RIVER *** [Js 9d Th 4h] Q♠
evgenfox: checks
randris: bets 1200
evgenfox: calls 1200
GeoValentino said, "aces cracked again"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
randris: shows [Jh 9s] (two pair, Jacks and Nines)
evgenfox: shows [Jc Kh] (a straight, Nine to King)
evgenfox collected 4440 from side pot
GeoValentino: shows [As Ad] (a pair of Aces)
evgenfox collected 4500 from main pot

In a buy in tournament that raise could be perfectly acceptable, in a freeroll its way too small. You should have just raised all in and let the chips fall as they may.

#16 11th March 2010, 6:57 PM

Some people overvalue KJ, especially offsuit. Could easily be up against KK or AK or what you had. The dude who called with J9 is even worse. Yeah he was getting about 2:1 to call, but against most flops, his hand’s useless.

Not much you can do about it.

I had this guy call me with J8os the other day and he also won. Hit trip 8’s.

It’s about luck in tournaments first and foremost. Then skill.

#17 11th March 2010, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salim271

In a buy in tournament that raise could be perfectly acceptable, in a freeroll its way too small. You should have just raised all in and let the chips fall as they may.

Why? Don't be results oriented, pf he got some awesome results, two guys called his AA hand w junk.

If you mean he should have raised all in because those two players would have called all in w the same junk, then by all means I agree that would be a better play.

If you mean he should have raised all in because it folds out the two junk hands, this is a huge mistake.

#18 11th March 2010, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjonius

Many times, your premise about not wanting to scare anyone away is sub-optimal. AA plays best against one opponent, so you usually want to narrow the field, and should raise enough to do so. Sometimes, that means everyone will fold. That doesn't mean the bet was wrong or poor, just that it only won you a small pot - which beats losing a large one because you let too many people stay in the hand and one of them drew out on you.

Sounds about right to me...its all depends on the situation of the hand, table positioning, knowledge of players. etc. but Me I try to make a normal 3bet maybe 4 if theres too many ppl limping into the hand idk it all depends...next time just move all in and make a wish! lol j/k

ACES GET CRACKED ALL THE TIME

#19 11th March 2010, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BabyAcey

So your dealt pocket AA, you want and should pre flop raise but you don't want to scare anyone away, do you do the minimal raise to reel the table in and slow play it? Or knowing that pocket AA don't always hold up, should you jump right in and go for the jugular????

With AA you ideally want to get as many chips into the pot as you can prelop.... not always easy to do & greatly depends upon level in tourney & situation on table.
Typically I would NEVER decrease my preflop raise size with AA. You'll see a bunch of players doing this, not wanting to just take down the blinds. Better players will pick up on your varying raise size preflop when you have AA. By raising the same each time, you're actually disguising your hand better than by altering your raise sizes.
It also depends alot upon the table you're on (table dynamics). Are most pots being 3-bet preflop & then two players occassionally seeing the flop headsup, OR are most raises not respected & seeing alot of multi-way family pots (ie. like a Pokerstars low buyin MTT).

#20 15th March 2010, 5:04 AM

thanks guys, great advice, truly appreciated!!!!!

#21 15th March 2010, 1:25 PM

Well since we're posting Aces Cracked stories now... I was playing at the 1/2 NL at the Excalibur, I had just droven into Vegas and knew my friend who I was supposed to meet would be sleeping, so I headed to the tables. After a while he came down, and sat directly on my left, having bought in for the $100 max (only buy-in there, actually.)

I'm in the SB, a few limpers, I decide to go for a steal with 4c3c by making it $20. He pops it up to $50. (Had he gone all-in here would have been the only way to win this pot.) I could up the $80+ in the pot, account for the rake, and decide to call.

Flop comes 3s4d5c. I bet out $20. "Oh, trying to crack me?" He says, as he calls. The turn comes Ac. I check, he jams for his last $30, of course I call.

River comes 2c. He both go to the jackpot wheel (aces cracked and straight flush).

And that is how my straight flush cherry was popped...

3c4c made me another str8 flush in a live HU tournament a few months ago, too. Unfortunately the stakes were much smaller, and our tent in Kuwait didn't have a jackpot wheel...

Also, what Sly said.

Play Texas Hold'em Online Poker \| Pocket AA
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