min raising with aces...

will someone please let me know what the logic is to min raise preflop with aces ? Who wants to price the bigblind in and have his rags hit the flop..

please will someone let me kno what they are thinking when they min raise with a bigpair. I just dont think its to smart its better to win the blinds then lose your stack because u min raised and priced a guy in

I will min raise with AA in a couple of cases.

1. The game is short handed and I want some action.
2. I think there is someone who might re-reaise.

In the first case I will make a big bet post flop to the point of an all-in.
In the second I will re-raise again probably all-in.

But these are the only 2 situation I may do it in and not all the time. Depends on the table and how well I know the players.

The Muppetteer

I have won more with the min raise with AA then pushing a big amount, and the more you push in to a pot the more you have to lose to rags..
I used to go allin with AA and would lose, and i think it looked like i was trying to steal the pot, so i got called alot.
I would go for losing a small pot in stead of a big pot, who else is with me on that?

i usually make a medium raise with AA and avoid going all in(because if i do then i depend on luck; and i prefer skill over luck )
i guess some players think if they make a min raise preflop and got a hostile flop then they will not lose much money...which i think it's a good thing, isn't it?

I will only min raise if there is a serial raiser at the table.

It's a good way to disguise your hand as they may put you on a low pocket pair.

I too have been sucked out on alot when I have AA so I have learned that the best thing to do is to raise 4 or 5 X BB.

I think min raising is never a good play.
It's very often a tell when someone min raises , I am very careful then.
You get often too much players in a pot when you min raise too.

The only time I min raise is at a tight table. This will loosen up the table a little and might get your opponents to start playing weaker hands. I will do this on hands such as JTs and T9s, and if i get plenty of callers i'm happy because of implied odds with these type of hands. If i'm in late position, i always make a standard raise 3-4X the big blind because it might be interpreted as a steal attempt anyway, and they BB might come over the top with a weak ace or somthing. The other point of a min-raise is to alter my play and increase my deception, not to get more limps into the pot. I do it very rarely, and do not like to play my aces or other high pairs like this. I want to get maximum value for my good hands and make the weaker hands pay to draw on me. Last time i min-raised with my aces, a 5-9s flopped two pair and the rest was history. If i'm in early position i will raise 4-5 times the BB depending on how loose or tight the table has been. If im in middle-3-4x, late-3 times the BB. Note though, perceptive players will notice that you want a little action with your 3xBB raise and might give you credit for a strong hand, weak players will take your bet for what it means and fold, aggresive players will try to hit a flop strong on you. Alot of times you can bust aggresive players who flop top pair(but under your high pair) and will play it to the end. All in all, I only like to use the min-raise to loosen up a tight table, or to alter my betting pattern.

Oh, i forgot to add last night, that there just a pair, and will get cracked.

If I can shove and have it look 'weak' while on AA.... I'm doing it all day long (why wouldn't I want to get my opponent stacked while being an 80% fav?). Definitely 'not with you on this'.

Let me get this straight.. 'the more I bet out preflop with AA,.. the more money I lose to rags'?? Umm... I think not.

I think alot of players will min-raise with AA as they're really hoping to get paid off for them, almost desperately so. I don't alter my preflop raise amount for when I'm on a monster... by betting out roughly the same for any hand I'm opening with, will keep it disguised enough as it is.
If I'm on a table where I've spotted a loose, reckless maniac or lag-tard who just loves 3-betting to isolate in an MTT on holdings as weak as A-5o (PlayedYou73 & pokerchild69 for example), then I'm going to open with my standard raise of around 2.4x (if blinds are mid-levels+) in hopes of the Lag-tard reraising me preflop.

raise a small amount that way you arent pissed when something goes wrong.

Where are you playing at the moment, exactly?? What table?

A minraise with the nuts preflop is suicide at a table full of loose passive players. So at low stakes it just almost never makes sense.

Even with decentish players at FR it still doesn;t make much sense.

Now at a table where people play a strong tight preflop game, I would see opening with a minraise when in early position a reasonable action. Especially when it's a short game.

Well my view is different then yours, and thats ok with me, i mid raise + 1 BB per limper, and will do the same thing with high PP, they won't know if there AA or 1010, and keeps them thinking. I got that from Fulltilt's site.

Unless you're min-raising with other types of hands (like all pocket pairs, for instance) min-raising with AA is usually a bad play. It signals to anyone paying attention at the table that you may have a monster hand. It also lets at least the BB see a cheap flop. (not to mention the risk of multi-way flops) If villain flops 2-pair or better, you're probably losing a big pot to him. If not, he's probably folding his trash on the flop, and you've made a whopping 1BB more than you would have making a normal raise.

At the low-limit cash tables, I see players all the time who regularly min-raise AA and KK. They are usually losing players, because the only time they get action is when they've been outdrawn. Even worse are the people who min-raise preflop, then check-call to the river before making their move. All you are doing by slow-playing AA is giving away some (or all?) of your edge. Use your edge when you have it by making your opponents pay for cards.

Min-raise has its advantages, but it all depends on your image and what the table has been doing. If your table is super-tight and seems to fold when you raise a standard 3x-4x amount, then sometimes it can be profitable to throw in a main raise to try and get some action. Many times players will hit a pair on the flop and then you will be able to extract money from them by having the best hand.

Also, if (like stated) your table has a few LAGs on it, then a min-raise is perfect. More than likely one of these LAGs will see your raise as a weakness and will re-raise you, in which case you can re-raise them all in and take their money right there or have them call your all-in and win %80 of the time.

(EDIT)
I really don't advise anyone to ever min-raise, but you asked why people do it....so these are my reasons.

the biggest reason is if your in early position at an aggressive table and youll probably get reraised... or if your in late position and its folded you you and you want some action... the biggest mistake with this play is taht if you dont get reraised and they limp in... are you willing to fold them if the other person hits...most begginers arent... if your not willing to fold AA here and there i wouldnt limp or min raise with them

Yeah, if the table is very tight or short-handed. I'll usually do it from early position, OR from late position if there are no limpers. I can't tell you the number of times I've seen people raise 5x UTG or go all-in with them, get no callers, and then proudly show you their AA that they've made no money on.

So here's one more situation I haven't seen mentioned for a min-raise or between a min-raise & 2x the BB. Late in a tournament where the blinds are very high, there is usually a larger disparity between stack sizes. When the blinds are 1000/2000, the small to near-medium stacks will not call a raise to 8000. (Sometimes, you won't even get your min-raise called.) And I've also often found that the big stacks won't call it either unless they've got something huge too, like QQ - in which case they might put in for a nice re-raise, and then you can come back over the top and isolate him, if he hasn't isolated you already.

I do tend to raise the same amount from the button, it all depends on what position i am in, and who's at the table. And DB said it better then i did....

There is a place to min raise, or even call with A's. If I have an aggressive player following me and I am in early position I will min raise or even call A's because I know they are going to raise me. Also if a couple of players are short stacked then there is a chance they will go all in after a min raise or call. There is always a risk and A's are not guarenteed to win. Play the cards and the other players not just the cards.

playing full ring cash or tourney? min-raise is very wrong. If you want to play it tricky(which i dont suggest), then limp/reraise is much better. By min-raising u show that there's a possibility(small, but still) that u have aces, kings. The other reason is that people tend to play more pots when it's min-raised, because dead money in the pot is double size and its not a big difference to call 1BB or 2BB. And in a 6 way pot its so easy to lose your BI with AA.

I totally hate min-raising preflop and 99,99% time i dont do it(unless all players are very shortstack in shorthanded play or smth). Min-raising gives so good odds to your opponents. By min-raising AAs u most likely lose your stack or win almost nothing, unless you hit the nuts. Limp/reraise is better if you got an agro player in your table, but that is a play that should be used very rarely(especially at online poker).

I'm more suspicious when someone min raises when they normally 3BB-5BB raise. If I'm in the blinds I now have the odds to call and I'm only playing a flop with 2 pair or better. If I miss then your not getting more money out of me, so I really don't like this play with observant players. Tourneys I can see it being a little more effective when people are going all-in pretty regularly, but don't do this in cash. Keep in mind in tourneys as well that the BB almost has to call and when he hits his hand don't go broke.

Situational

Position
Stack Size
Table Image
Table Dynamics

All Situational

General Rule >>>>>> No Min Raise




Good Luck

The only reason I am minraising AA is to get someone to raise over me... To not want to get all in with aces is absurd. Just because you have lost a small percentage of the time with aces doesn't mean you are depending on luck. You are taking a huge edge against any hand other than AA when getting all it.

Also, a lot of people are talking about it showing so much strength minraising and looks like you want action. I am assuming that most of you are micro or small stakes player since this is the beginning forum so you shouldnt worry too much about meta game. I think there are very few players at this level that could distinguish between your 3x raises or min raises.

Just my two cents, but I always raise 4x BB with a hand like AA. Regardless of position. Simply because I don't want somebody to outflop me without paying for it. If i'm first to act postflop I'll usually go all in depending on my stack and board texture.

I only minimum raise with AA when I'm absolutely certain that someone will re-reaise on top of me. Usually I go with the 3-4x BB

I play $10nl and quite a few times I see AA played like this.

Board can be anything whatsoever.

Villain with Aces. Checks or min raise pre.

Flop: Check
Turn: Check
River: Bet (of many different sizes) and the funny thing is if they get raised they just keep re raising - irrespective of the board.

Its so funny when they get cracked by something like 36 offsuit who was in the big blind and made a straight.

I can't fold aces, so I allin preflop everytime. I just can't fold them.
If all I win is the blinds, it is what it is. I may not win the most this way but I lose alot less. It's an easier decision for me preflop/allin than folding/playing them postflop.

I think that is not a good tactic because then ur opponent knows when u have AA. Moreover u win to less with this tactic. Sometimes it is a good tactic but when ur opponent has luck than you will loose with AA against a much worse hand.

In some ways Aces are the bane of every poker players game.
Brunson always says - you win a small pot or lose a big one.

I usually looks at Aces, like any other pair. I raise (3-4x BB depending on the action at the table) in early to mid position and may call or re-raise in late position.
A lot depends on the table, are they loose, tight, is someone on a run?

Once I see the flop I look at what everyone who has stayed in might have, my Aces are of no importance at this point, they are still just a pair.
(Unless of course I hit that set.......YUM)

Is there a flush draw, a straight draw, has the board paired?
These are the questions I think you have to ask yourself.

Once you see the board if you have been following the other players actions you will know what to do.

The biggest problem for a lot of people is they think Aces are invincible....guess what....THEY AREN'T!

If you've been playing for any reasonable amount of time you've had your Aces cracked. And it will happen again.

It is JUST a pair of cards!

^^^^This.
I only min raise at a table where I am fairly certain I will be re-raised so I can push preflop and then I only do it in early position. I believe it was Doyle who said "It is better to win a small pot with AA than lose a large one". If you practice min raising with large pprs and it is not under the right circumstances (which is rare anyways) then expect to be telling a lot of so called "bad beat" stories of how your AA got cracked yet again.