Ask Mental Game Coach Jared Tendler

Hi everyone!

I’m not sure how many of you know me, or are familiar with mental game coaching/poker psychology, so in talking with your faithful leader Debi (Dakota-xx), we decided the best way to introduce me to all of you is to briefly describe what I do, how it can help you, and then open up this thread to any questions you have.

As a coach to over 125 poker players from 19 countries, my work is solely focused on the mental game. Although I’m a fish in most of the games that all of you play, I understand poker players and the challenges all of you face well enough to know how to help you play better. That means not only eliminating or reducing issues like, tilt, anxiety, motivation, focus, decision making, and confidence, but also helping you increase the number of tables/hours you play, learn poker more efficiently, and consistently play in the Zone.

The key difference between what I do, and other psychological approaches you may be familiar with, is that my program draws from a wide variety of sources to create a logical and practical approach to the mental game that is exactly the same as how you’d approach learning poker. The reality is that everything in the mental game can be rational and orderly; though that’s rarely how it feels.

Drawing from my own experience as a former pro golfer, my master’s degree in psychology, 4 years of work in traditional counseling, 3 years working as a mental game coach to golfers, tennis, and football players, and now with poker players for the past 3 years, I’ve created a program not only unique to poker, but within all of sport psychology. It’s based on science, novel use of old theory, new theories I’ve created, a ton of direct experience and practical solutions.

If you’d like to know more about me, my work, read client testimonials, or to be among the first to be notified when my pokers psychology book is available, visit my website: jaredtendlerpoker.com.

I recently posted a guest blog on PartyPoker titled, “6 Reasons Why Poker Psychology Matters in Poker,” that gives an overview of some of the major areas of the mental game and my take on them.

I’m happy to be here, and I look forward to answering your mental game questions in this thread.

Jared

Wow, welcome Jared.

OK I have a question on tilt.

I do not tilt all that much, bad beats dont effect me too much, I dismiss them fairly easily. However I do sometimes get moments of tilt.

THe scenatrio is usually this.

I am multi-tabling

Suddenly I get bet 3-bet and shoved on every which way on multiple tables. This may go on for 5 minutes or so. I know that the players arent all suddenly picking that point to play back at me. Its far more likely that I'm just running into a lot of good hands all at once.

However after I have hit fold for the 12th time, I do find myself becoming more emotionally involved than normal and this leads to me making poor calls (we arent talking absolutely mind blowingly silly calls, but calls that I wouldnt usually make.. obviously I have a hand.. but under normal circumstances I would fold, I'm sure of it).

How can I get better at dealing with this?

Thanks Jared! I will have some questions for you over the next few days.

To the forum - we are very fortunate that Jared is willing to spend some time here discussing a part of playing poker that almost all of us have some kind of issues with. I don't think we have ever had an opportunity like this to have someone of his caliber available to assist us in this area.

So - ask away!

Welcome to CardsChat Jared. I don't have a question off the top of my head but will give it some thought. I just wanted to say Hi.

Welcome to CardsChat, Jared! No questions here, yet.. but I'll think of some

Welcome to CC. Very exciting to have you be apart of the forum.

My question...

I have very little time to play and learn poker. This means my downswings can last a very long time. I love to play poker a lot but can get very frustrated after a couple losing months as I can usually only get about 1-2k hands in a month and its easy to have a 2k hand downswing. What do you suggest to combat the frustration with knowing that its a "long run" game?

Welcome Jared. The first I heard of you was here years ago from ChuckTs (Clean on Stox) so I knew that you had something of value.


I have perhaps an odd question, but one that's been on my mind lately.

Losing is important to poker; without losing and randomness and chance the bad players wouldn't continue to play. But is there an attitude or approach that we can work towards that enables us to accept and even desire losing simply because we acknowledge that it is so important to the game itself?

Welcome Jared. I used to watch your vids repeatedly when you were at Stox. Great to have you here.

1st: Are you now at Drag the Bar?

2nd: Like I said I've watched your videos and they are great but I find myself falling back into old, bad habits when it comes to tilt. What's your best tip to make someone, like me, finally "get it". Is there any hope of being a former tilter or is it like being an addict, will I always just be "in recovery"?

3rd: What's the expected release date on the book?

I can't do it right now but I'm relieved to know that when I can articulate the question of what's up with my attitude, I have a place to do it.

Welcome to Cardschat, Jared. I have no questions at this moment, but I will have some soon. I've only been playing poker since June 2009 so I'm still learning. Thanks so much for your help! MM

Welcome sir, as someone with limited free time, any advice on efficient learning would be greatly appreciated.



Kudos Debi, for getting Jared here.

Welcome to CC Jared!

I have a good feel for how to control my "arrrrrgggggghhhh" tilt - I don't get all that upset by bad beats, and I know to stop playing when I do get irritated.

I do, however, have an issue where I lack confidence in downswings. I know it affects my game, and I will do some simple things to try to psych myself up before sitting at the tables - but I don't think I'm approaching it all that well. Thoughts? Tks!

Hey Jared
How should one deal with web links that take one to a golf site instead of a poker site??
TTTTTTIIIIIIILLLLLLLTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

Hi Stu,

You bring up a really important type of tilt that usually flies under a lot of player's radar because it's so subtle. The key thing to realize is that tilt exists along a spectrum, and even at it's lowest levels is a problem - it's great you see it that way.

To answer your question I need a little more information first. What is it about getting played back at in that moment that is so frustrating for you? I ask that no necessarily logically, but in that moment when you've hit fold for the 12th time, what specifically has you annoyed? How much of the problem (if any) is related to having to make a lot of tough decisions at once?

Jared

Thanks everyone for the welcome! I'm here when questions come to mind.

Hi Jarad

Thanks for getting back on this one.

I'm not 100% sure how to explain it.

I think the number of decisions is a huge factor because it tends to happen more with 10 tables than 6, I guess my concentration is being stretched at that point so a sudden influx of difficult decisions isnt good.

I dont know why I'm going to say the next bit because I dont want to send you off in the wrong direction. So dont take what I say next as being 100% correct. Its just my perception.

I think that it is triggering a flight / fight response. I find my hands shake a little, and I have a sensation that I think is an increase in adrenaline. Visually whites seem whiter.. its very hard to explain but its a feeling I associate with adrenaline.

Poker is a long term game, and the primary way that you'll have success in the long-term is based on the quality of your game. Certainly the quality of the games counts for a lot, but since you can't control that in the long-term, nor the cards at any time, to combat the frustration you have to focus on the one thing you can control - the quality of your play, and the quality of your improvement.

Players who play much more volume than you struggle with this same issue and the best way to combat it is to have good data about how you've improved as a player during that time. Something that isn't anywhere as easy to quantify as results, but can be done with some work.

When you know the weak parts of your game, you can evaluate after your sessions how you did in those spots. To make it easier to review you can mark those hands, and then afterwards see how you did. Then track a general sense of how you played for the session (completely separate from results) and how well you were able to improve. You can also be looking at hands where you were faced with a tough decision and made the right one, or hands where you picked up on something and made the right read. So often these small positives are ignored and by recognizing them, along with how you're playing and improving, you have something to feel good about in your game even when the results aren't there.

Keep in mind I'm not advocating that you fake anything. I'm suggesting you pay closer attention and track parts of your game often ignored. And this is also a skill that you'll get better at, so stick with it, and not only will you improve your emotional reactions as a player, you'll also improve your actual poker ability.

Cool to hear you've heard of me through him, he's a great guy.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that you desire losing, but I think I know where you're head is at in thinking about this. If I'm correct, you're asking what the right attitude is to have towards losing?

The question I have for you is, why do you have trouble losing?

The answer that question and I can share more. There isn't a magic bullet that's the best way all players should think about losing. Your post suggests that you understand logically why losing is important, but there's a part of you that won't accept it and I'm guessing reacts negatively when you do. There a wide range of reason for why players react to losing and with a bit more info on it for you, I can help you solve it.

I would like to know how to deal with this as well. I have the same thing after a couple bad beats or just when running bad. I then find myself playing way too passive.

Glad to hear you enjoyed the videos, yes I am at Drag the Bar now.

The best tip to give you is to stop believing there is a magic solution to tilt that will finally make you get it. Yes, it is possible for you to get to a point where you don't have to work so hard from falling off the wagon, and actually say that you are tilt free. Getting there is a process that takes having the right information not only to solve the problem (your reason for tilt).

Admittedly, my program is now miles ahead of what I was putting out on Stoxpoker. At the time, I was giving the best of what I had - something I've always tried to do. Just like anyone who works hard at something, I know a lot more. Writing the book is a big part of that, and I'm seeing many more intricacies that make huge differences to help players get to the point where they can actually solve these problems for good. Though one of the consequences of solving problems is that if you then continue to improve - new problems are guaranteed to show up. That's just how it goes. If you improve and create a new peak for yourself, that means you've just also created new relative weakness.

I say all that, because part of the reason you may not have been able to totally solve the Tilt prob is you haven't had all the right info. I can't guarantee that I have all the answers now, but I sure as hell know I'm far better able to than before. So feel free to post a bit on your tilt prob.

I don't have a release date set yet. I've set them a couple times before, and at this point I know enough to know that I'm no good at predicting this yet. As my first book, and one that I'm self-publishing, along will all the other things I have going on, it's just too hard to tell. My goal is to be able to have a release date before I head to the wsop the end of June. If that happens the book should be out by the end of the summer. Thanks for asking about it.

Hey Kenzie,

Simple answer is be organized about what you are working on. There may be new mistakes you see each time you play, but EVERY time you play you want to be focused on making certain that your greatest weaknesses/mistakes don't show up. That means having a list of them that you review every time you play, and then when your done, review those spots to ensure you played correctly, and why (just to further reinforce it - even if obvious), and if not, write out why you made the mistake again.

The reason is that by continually focusing on eliminating these mistakes eliminated from your game, you are efficient in constantly eliminating your worst. When that happens, you have trained the correction to the level where it's become instinctual - and not longer requires thought. It's automatic. When it's automatic, that means you're free to use that mental energy/focus on something new - the next mistake. The automatic by product of this is also that your best play will naturally climb higher - you'll automatically start seeing new things, or understanding concepts from videos or forum posts better.

Thanks Sly!


This post I made to Brank is part of the answer for you too: Ask Mental Game Coach Jared Tendler.

To get to the rest though, like I've offered to others here, requires more information from you first. You say that you lack confidence - how do you know it? Do you have questions in your mind about your game? If so, what are they? Do you get negative or worry about the future or goals that you have? As specific as you can be what is it about a downswing that causes you to lose confidence?

Psyching yourself up before sessions is a decent short-term solution, but it's not something that can actually fix the problem. Once we understand the cause, the solution gets much easier.

I would first ask myself how it's possible that someone who clearly took some time writing this post could possibly make an error like that! Then since I'm a nice guy, I'd let them know of the mistake so whatever the reason, they would have a chance to fix it without going too long.

Thanks for doing that

Here's the correct link: jaredtendlerpoker.com

In building on my post to Sly, what is it about bad beats or running bad that affects your confidence?

While you both have a similar problem, the cause may be different.

Hello Jared... welcome to the forum. I heard you on Cash Plays with Jermiah Smith and I was impressed. I have a problem with tilt. I will build a decent bankroll playing poker tournaments only to decide to play cash games for a change. I will take a few bad beats or run bad for a while, and then... BAM!!! I'm playing all kinds of crappy hands and tilting away my bankroll. This is very destructive!! I've considered having FullTilt and PokerStars block me from playing cash games. How can I get beyond this problem. I am profitable in live cash games, but online I seem to go on tilt pretty quickly.

OMG I have never been to a real shrink session, but think it would feel like this. While thinking about how to respond I realized a whole bunch of other things....I will be back, ty lol
I am sure part of it is I rely on my cards way too much, and cannot seem to get over that.
I play ring fwiw.

Nice of you to make this thread and welcome to Cards chat I dont really have many questions right now but I am sure some will be on their way soon.

How much of an advantage do you think having a mental coach is, and do you think anybody can benifit from your work in poker or do you think only certain types of players or personalities are able to be receptive enough to what you do?

What would you say (apart from you ) that your clients have in common to make them winners in what they do?

Welcome to CC Jared,,, ok,, on what to do before you start a tournament,? is there any special things you can do before starting a big MTT, either physically or mentally that would make you think you have an advantage over the other players ? or has everyone have there own little thing they do to get ready,? for myself,i log out of CC @ 12:55 & log into the game site at 12:55, if a game starts at 1pm., i always try to log out & in to the game site 5 minutes before any game starts, for some reason it makes me feel lucky,, or am i just imagining it makes me lucky,? Thank You, Now the other players here know 1 of my tricks,LOL, buck

I think I finally found the perfect person to ask this question...

I've been playing poker for about 3-4 years, since my (now ex-) roommate got me into it.. 3 months after I started playing, I entered into my first tournament of 30 people and won.. have been hooked ever since.

I started out playing as a hobby and just for fun, then joined CardsChat, which has significantly improved my game.. and now, I'm wanting to see if I can actually make a run at poker as a possible profession.. but lately, I've been going through a lot of personal BS, due to my living situation (kind of trapped in a lease with the ex-gf.. long story).. and there's a lot of arguing and crap. Now, it seems I've been using poker as an escape, which has been throwing me off of my game.

I guess my question is... what is the best way to deal with life tilt when playing poker?

I know the reasonable answer is probably just to get out of this situation, lol.. but I'm sure there will be other forms of life tilt that will effect my poker game in the future.. that's pretty much the biggest problem I've had in my poker game. I can deal with tilting during a poker game.. I don't really tilt that often.. but when I'm being affected personally in life situations.. it does affect my poker game.

Not sure if this is a good place or not. You never know when you'll pick up another profitable response that will stick with you. I'm primarily a SNG player. Sometimes I play MTT's. I play cash when the bonuses come out. I play profitable cash through and after the bonus but eventually as the profitbale (thanks to the bonus unlock) play wears off my game changes, my expectations change, and I start losing money. Common sense says stick to the SNG's and MTT's unless there are cash game bonuses to be unlocked above and beyond regular cash game profits. But even so I find myself sticking with it longer than I should. There's some ego there and the iron man medals (full tilt) and other such things. The answer is "hey stoopid, don't play cash after you are done unlocking the bonuses" but I can't help myself at least for a little while.

Thanks for the welcome and the good words on the interview.

I get the sense that at the time your tilting away your bankroll, that you may have gone into desperation mode - where you're doing anything and everything to win NOW. Of course that means making all kinds of ridiculous plays. There are a couple reasons why it comes on so suddenly for you, 1) accumulated tilt - which is emotion that is stored up overtime that doesn't show itself until you can't take it anymore and then it's like the damn breaks open, 2) You aren't aware of the subtle consistent rise in your emotions until its a major problem.

Both of these are really common and there's a different strategy associated with each. So before going further, am I on target about the desperation thing, if so does either reason fit you, and lastly, what is it about bad beats or a sustained bad run that throws you over the edge?

In the meantime, after every bad beat, remind yourself to focus on playing solid poker. The slippery slope starts with one, and if you can prevent emotion from rising by chipping away at the small causes of it immediately when it happens.

That's cool to hear a few things came to mind. For you and for anyone reading this, it's really important to know that anything that comes to mind is rational and logical. So often what feels irrational/illogical to you is only that way because you lack the reason. Sometimes these reason are really quite simple and it doesn't have to be some issue from childhood.

If you're relying on cards too much, that suggests to me that you're relying too much on results to define the quality of your game. Sure making money and winning is at the end of the day how players are measured, but in the short-term results of course are unreliable. So you need a way of having something to hang your confidence on besides results particularly when it goes bad. What that means is that you can measure your skill. That you can finish a session an know how you played, even if you lost. You'll never be able to distinguish your game from variance 100%, but by making and effort to see how you played hands that required a lot of thought (vs. just big wins/losses) you can see how good your decision making is. Or if there are areas of your game you're working on, mark those hands and review afterward how you did.

I'm sure there are 100's of ways to identify how you played, and by consistently doing that you'll be able to walk away from sessions where you lost and feel good that you lost the minimum (and at a time that's really hard for you).

Good questions.

So much of what the mental game offers is the ability for you to consistently play at a high level - for your poker A game to show up. With problems like tilt, anxiety, focus out of the way, the players that I've worked with long enough have definitely gained an advantage.

While I do think anyone who is open to what a mental game coach can offer can benefit, that's really only true if it make sense relative relative to the limits, BR and goals a player has. There are also players who I've turned away because I though they had personal issues (including drugs) that would make my work a waste.

I don't think it's only certain personalities who would be receptive to what I do, I think the main reason people wouldn't benefit is because psychology can often be esoteric and in some cases complete crap. Psychology/mental game can get a bad rap and rightfully so. I've opened a lot of people's eyes with my methods because it makes a lot of the esoteric stuff real, quantifiable and logical. The comment I hear most often in sessions is "that makes sense."


The commonalities among my clients that come to mind are:

1) Generally they have a solid work ethic, especially when things are going great or terrible.

2) Above average intelligence.

3) Open to new ideas and comfortable talking about the parts of their game where they suck.

4) Have clear goals - and when those goals are met, set new ones.

5) Generally self aware or are willing to become more so.

Well, there's all sorts of potential trouble that may come from losing; anger/frustration leading to sub-optimal play and further losing (tilt) and/or bleeding over into non-poker life. Or loss of confidence leading to weak/passive play.

I realized after I posted the question that it may be more of a Tommy Angelo question rather than a Jared Tendler question. It has something to do with me trying to accept and to include losing better as part of the whole experience of playing poker. I suspect that I deal better with losing than many poker players but I also feel that there is further that I can achieve in terms of integrating losing (and winning, for that matter) into a whole integrated experience.

Great reply, and there is so much to think about here that I put off replying for a few days. I also did a bit of reading on your forum at dtb, which put more context around this.

Broadly, when I'm running good, I feel like I'm sitting at the tables with a specific plan of attack, know how to respond to different types of players/table conditions, and feel competent. When I'm running bad, I question my game a lot. It feels very much like the Sun Tzu quote in The Poker Mindset - "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win." I feel like I have some measure of control in the first scenario (control over whether I'm making +Ev moves or not given table conditions), while in the second I feel like I'm "stabbing" at different tactics and playing catchup, trying to find opportunities rather than thinking I have the opportunities mapped out in advance.

I've invested a ton of time, so I have a good deal of self-image tied up in the game, and I'm sure that's having an impact. I have a number of personal goals tied up in the game as well, but I'm reluctant to post them in a public forum.

I realize I haven't directly replied to all the points in your reply, but did want to say thanks for a very thought provoking reply.