Showing hands in all-in situations

#1 10th June 2009, 5:23 AM

All tournaments I've been in required all players to turn their cards face up when a player is all-in and nobody else is left to act. A dealer once told me this is called the "Scotty Nguyen rule" because he used to pay the buyin for his friends under the agreement that if he went all-in they had to call and then muck their cards.

Can anyone confirm or refute this?

#2 12th June 2009, 7:36 AM

I can't confirm whether that really was something Scotty Nguyen used to do. That logic is certainly one of the major reasons for that rule being in place though.

#3 12th June 2009, 9:43 AM

Wow.. the prince of poker used to cheat? Hmmm.... can anyone shed some light on that?

#4 14th June 2009, 2:27 AM

i hate how pokerstars doesnt show the hands when players are all in for cash games. its tilting

#5 14th June 2009, 7:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infamous1020

i hate how pokerstars doesnt show the hands when players are all in for cash games. its tilting

i too find this annoying. i would be interested in knowing why that is if anyone has any info.

#6 14th June 2009, 7:27 AM

The hand history shows what they mucked on Stars. If you have a HUD you'll be able to see as well.

#7 14th June 2009, 7:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falian

The hand history shows what they mucked on Stars. If you have a HUD you'll be able to see as well.

yes i know that. what im wondering is why doesnt it turn the cards face up on the table?

#8 14th June 2009, 7:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ythelongface

yes i know that. what im wondering is why doesnt it turn the cards face up on the table?

So that HH miners can't see them without paying for them. At least that's my guess. I hate it as well though

#9 14th June 2009, 8:00 AM

uh he probably meant men nguyen, not scotty. men nguyen stakes a bunch of people for tourneys and is a known cheater (has had his horses chip dump to him, also has been caught with stolen chips in his hotel room)

#10 14th June 2009, 8:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blankoblanco

uh he probably meant men nguyen, not scotty. men nguyen stakes a bunch of people for tourneys and is a known cheater (has had his horses chip dump to him, also has been caught with stolen chips in his hotel room)

wow, I never knew that about him. You never hear about it nowadays

#11 14th June 2009, 8:21 AM

In cash games you're not required to turn over your cards until after the river... at least that's the way it is where I play. At the end all players show or muck. Its only in tournaments where the hands are exposed preflop.

#12 15th June 2009, 1:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blankoblanco

uh he probably meant men nguyen, not scotty. men nguyen stakes a bunch of people for tourneys and is a known cheater (has had his horses chip dump to him, also has been caught with stolen chips in his hotel room)

^ this. Makes sense if he really meant Men Nguyen and not Scotty, the "Master" is a renowned cheat and angle shooter.

As for why Stars doesn't automatically expose the cards in a cash game, they're following the same rule that live cash games do. Watch High Stakes Poker some time, the players very rarely expose their cards unless they have to.

#13 15th June 2009, 5:36 AM

Can't verify the origin, but it is in the TDA Rules ...

9. All cards will be turned face up once a player is all-in and all action is complete.

#14 17th June 2009, 5:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blankoblanco

uh he probably meant men nguyen, not scotty. men nguyen stakes a bunch of people for tourneys and is a known cheater (has had his horses chip dump to him, also has been caught with stolen chips in his hotel room)

Interesting! I knew little about Men before, but there's quite a bit online about his antics.

As for Poker Stars not showing mucked cards, that's the standard in live casinos. I don't know why Full Tilt shows all cards in the "Last Hand" window. It kind of bugs me, actually, since I generally don't like to give away any info I don't have to. In cash games at my local casino, it goes in the order of last action - the last person to bet or raise is supposed to show first, then the next to call, and so on. Each player gets to decide whether to show or muck their cards.

#15 17th June 2009, 5:22 PM

I was always under the impression (at live games) that the only person who "had" to turn their cards over was the last to act (i.e the person who made the last bet). It was up to the other person to turn their cards over if they lose. Now most casinos do allow for other players (not involved in the hand) to ask to see the cards since it did go to a show down in the case of an allin situation.

#16 23rd June 2009, 6:23 PM

The winning player can always ask to see the losing player's cards if it goes to a showdown. It's just terrible terrible etiquette so nobody would ever do it.

#17 23rd June 2009, 6:43 PM

Cash game: if you are called the person who called has the right to ask to see the hand.
I never want to see the mucked hand, He may have misread his hand and beat my ass. I just want the chips. I will turn my hand up after the action is complete and let the dealer select the winner. But always keep your hand on the cards till the chips are pushed you way.

#18 23rd June 2009, 6:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infamous1020

i hate how pokerstars doesnt show the hands when players are all in for cash games. its tilting

the same thing happens on unibet ,it's very annoying to wait until the last card to see what are the odds to win or not the pot

#19 23rd June 2009, 8:14 PM

Microgaming software also does not show the hole cards face up in all-in situations in the cash games, and I find it very annoying also. A lot of times you are 100% sure that you won, only to see the chips go to the other player at the end. You then see his hole cards, which sucks!

#20 23rd June 2009, 8:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzExorcist

^ this. Makes sense if he really meant Men Nguyen and not Scotty, the "Master" is a renowned cheat and angle shooter.

As for why Stars doesn't automatically expose the cards in a cash game, they're following the same rule that live cash games do. Watch High Stakes Poker some time, the players very rarely expose their cards unless they have to.

I remeber hearing about Men making his horses pocket there chips in the 1500$ buy-in events and give it to him to use in the 10K buy-ins....scum.....

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