Russia Bans Casinos

#1 2nd July 2009, 11:12 PM

Hey Everyone,

This is for all of my Russian friends out there...

If the economic melt down wasn't enough the Russian Government is trying to shut down all of the Casinos, and move them out of the major cities.

They say it's to help it's people get rid of their gambling problems, but I think it's BS... it's just going to create unemployment... from all the people working at the casinos...

what do you guys think about this?

#2 2nd July 2009, 11:28 PM

Russia is totally corrupt and run by criminals, so there must be an ulterior motive...

#3 3rd July 2009, 1:35 AM

Well that puts KGB out of work, but the casinos will now go underground to be ruled by the mob more easily. Taxes go to the mob, not government. Meanwhile, lots of peeps will be coming online to collude openly at OFC and other places. Long before the recent invasion by Russians at OFC, I see more and more that online, they are treating poker as a team sport (Russia vs America etc.), and will work together like party poker members to invade. Not good.
These are not small issues.

#4 3rd July 2009, 3:01 AM

I'm guessing the Russina Mafia owns the casinos, and the government gets little if any revenue from them.

#5 3rd July 2009, 3:23 AM

They tried to illegalize vodka at one point too, closed down a lot of refineries to try and eliminate the alcohol problem out there... caused a massive economic breakdown.

#6 3rd July 2009, 3:27 AM

I think Tony G just got very sad in the pants.

#7 3rd July 2009, 3:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makwa

Well that puts KGB out of work, but the casinos will now go underground to be ruled by the mob more easily. Taxes go to the mob, not government. Meanwhile, lots of peeps will be coming online to collude openly at OFC and other places. Long before the recent invasion by Russians at OFC, I see more and more that online, they are treating poker as a team sport (Russia vs America etc.), and will work together like party poker members to invade. Not good.
These are not small issues.

Kinda unfair to group all Russians together with a small group of cheaters imo.

#8 3rd July 2009, 4:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoWuckingFurries

Russia is totally corrupt and run by criminals, so there must be an ulterior motive...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makwa

.......Meanwhile, lots of peeps will be coming online to collude openly at OFC and other places. Long before the recent invasion by Russians at OFC........

ha haaaa...... I knew there's be some of this due to the recent events....

maybe Russian Govt is doing for the good of the people.....cause they know more of them will be + ROI in online poker if they follow solid "timpley" strategy.....

seriously though, Makwa is correct, this is a serious problem and if it continues and grows, it very well could spell the end of online poker ......

enough people get into the cheating biz, and all the honest players will begin to leave (cause they will be watching their stats drop ever lower) .....for every honest player that leaves online behind, the % of cheaters becomes that much higher and it can only accelerate from there

there's been an explosion in the number of players online from that whole region ....Russia and all the former soviet bloc/satellite countries......and most definitely there are at least some fairly large and organized rings (why else would cheating strategies/lessons be openly discussed in a publicly viewable forum otherwise ?....perhaps because it's gotten so big, to the point that they figure "no big deal, everyone knows anyhow" ?)...

surely there are cheaters from every country or region, but I believe that particular region boasts more than it's fair share of them.....

seen too many instances over the last few months where for some reason a freerolls entries are overwhelmingly all from the region..... couple of times now I've seen freerolls where password didnt work for anyone, and nobody was registered.....but then in the last few minutes before the start time the list quickly fills up and 80 to near 100% of the entries are from that region ???

definitely some well organized fishy business goin on....and for those that figure "who cares, it's a freeroll".... they're just gaining experience and will be coming to your cash ring or buy-in tourny soon (prob already plenty there)

any large, organized ring, that plays it smart and doesn't use same players together over and over many times............can clean up and be invisible to any poker sites security... (a few hundred people, or a dozen people with dozens of accts each, constantly cycling out used accts and always making new ones).....

it's happening...you can stick your head in the sand if you want to.....but it's happening on some level already, and will only increase over time

the only thing that has any chance of stopping it is if enough people get off their lazy azz, and take 2 minutes to e-mail the poker sites they play at and voice their concerns about the lax state of security.......

any time a site gets any signifigant increase in similarly themed e-mails for a given period you can be sure they will be paying attention......increased e-mails such as these where people voice concern over security and integrity of the games and they will be sure to start the ball rolling on in depth investigation and new security measures

send e-mails to security@fulltiltpoker.com, and CC same e-mail to collusion@fulltiltpoker.com, and feedback@fulltiltpoker.com ...(dont bother sending anything to the generic support@fulltiltpoker.com.....the other addresses go straight to the people that would get em anyhow

at pokerstars support@pokerstars.com is the only address I know of

also a good idea to take the few seconds to email them any time you see anything that's even slightly suspect... if players involved did no wrong then they dont even know they were looked at..... no harm no foul.....players that get reported repeatedly will be more closely scrutinzed and eventually a pattern may form that security can pick up on....(many times players could be indeed cheating and security can find no evidence because the players are sophisticated and only through many instances may they be able to detect somethings not right).... it's all of ours responsibility to do what we can to try and keep the game as honest as possible

any 10 yr old can make 10 accts in same day from the same computer and connection, then register all 10 of those accts in the same MTT.... that fact alone makes me certain that site security is severely lacking

they're pretty good at stopping swearing or spamming in the chat though....some how they can find the time and money to make an automatic system to stop that.........

but typing in "other than English" they cant stop (even though it's against their own rules)....
even typing in non-English alphabet is ok.......like cyrillic (Russian) alphabet is ok (that chat looks like this -> lll llllll llll lllllllll lll)..... they cant stop that.....
but if you use a curse word, even with spaces and dots in between the letters...the automatic chat monitor instantly catches on......better to stop profane insults that to stop even the least sophisticated of cheaters

guess I got a little off topic (cant help myself sometimes)........sorry to hijack your thread Texas....

#9 3rd July 2009, 7:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachinpntdry

surely there are cheaters from every country or region, but I believe that particular region boasts more than it's fair share of them.....

I really think you need some kind of proof before you smear an entire country like that.

I think that's exactly what Full Tilt and Stars will say to you too if you just send them generic e-mails raising vague concerns about security.

#10 3rd July 2009, 12:33 PM

I think it's very sad when a government decides what's good for the people, good or bad. Here in the USA, we are fighting for the same rights...please sign all petitions so we don't lose that right too!

#11 3rd July 2009, 3:26 PM

Funny no Russians comenting on this. They are mostly easy money, and I love to see them on my table. Once in awhile Ill run across one who actually knows how to play poker.
Also recently I herd China shut down their internet. Although back now. Good ole comunism at work.

#12 3rd July 2009, 9:29 PM

I think poker is up and coming in Russia.

Also, I heard that poker rooms are allowed to stay open... only casinos are closing down. (Only a rumor, though, unconfirmed).

I think that Demidov's performance has created the "Moneymarker effect" out there.

FYI: I am Russian, moved to the US when I was 10... been here most of my life.

#13 3rd July 2009, 11:04 PM

This correct decision of the Russian government! Ordinary people lose last money in slots even pensioners! When casinos will move far they become accessible only to the rich!(for example LasVegas) And poker clubs are allowed to work on former-after all it is sports kind!
MeTim i think you see what are you want!

#14 4th July 2009, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzExorcist

I really think you need some kind of proof before you smear an entire country like that........

if you read the quote you posted..... I said surely it happens everywhere, ......but that I believed they constitute a larger than avg slice of that total collusionary pie (comparing apples to apples.... total # of accounts from a region in relation to total # of accounts from that region involved in such activity) .... never said it was the entire country

I consider the recent discovery of open public promotion, and lessons in such activity, along with some recent instances where I've witnessed some very odd happenings proof enough that it is quite prevalent

example: $1,300 freeroll on Pokerstars where the password wouldnt work for anyone......no players registered........then shortly before the start time, somehow about 50 players register (tourny was pre-set to pay 40 places) ......all but 2 of them listed Russia(or other nearby country) as their location......
those players that registered did not just happen to be lucky enough receive a new password in time from the sponsoring site...

pokerstars voided the tournament literally 4 or 5 seconds before the start time........and the sponsoring site re-scheduled the tourny for another time and had pokerstars geo-block Russians from the tourny......

and just a couple minutes before the re-scheduled tourny started, a flood of Russian players entered (obv. using proxy servers to disguise their location from Pokerstars)......

I never said, and most certainly do NOT believe that it's every one of them, or even a majority of them.....
in fact I'm positive that the number of players from that region that do cheat, constitute a small % of the total number of players from that region.... maybe I should have made that point clear in my first post, and I apologize to any honest players from there that may have taken my statement as a blanket accusation

.....and to be an equal opportunity accuser, ....I'm pretty sure the US is running a close second in the total accts per region/collusionary accts from region equation, ..........and prob constitutes the largest total # of collusionary accts amongst all locations

#15 5th July 2009, 1:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachinpntdry

ha haaaa...... I knew there's be some of this due to the recent events....

maybe Russian Govt is doing for the good of the people.....cause they know more of them will be + ROI in online poker if they follow solid "timpley" strategy.....

seriously though, Makwa is correct, this is a serious problem and if it continues and grows, it very well could spell the end of online poker ......

enough people get into the cheating biz, and all the honest players will begin to leave (cause they will be watching their stats drop ever lower) .....for every honest player that leaves online behind, the % of cheaters becomes that much higher and it can only accelerate from there

there's been an explosion in the number of players online from that whole region ....Russia and all the former soviet bloc/satellite countries......and most definitely there are at least some fairly large and organized rings (why else would cheating strategies/lessons be openly discussed in a publicly viewable forum otherwise ?....perhaps because it's gotten so big, to the point that they figure "no big deal, everyone knows anyhow" ?)...

surely there are cheaters from every country or region, but I believe that particular region boasts more than it's fair share of them.....

seen too many instances over the last few months where for some reason a freerolls entries are overwhelmingly all from the region..... couple of times now I've seen freerolls where password didnt work for anyone, and nobody was registered.....but then in the last few minutes before the start time the list quickly fills up and 80 to near 100% of the entries are from that region ???

definitely some well organized fishy business goin on....and for those that figure "who cares, it's a freeroll".... they're just gaining experience and will be coming to your cash ring or buy-in tourny soon (prob already plenty there)

any large, organized ring, that plays it smart and doesn't use same players together over and over many times............can clean up and be invisible to any poker sites security... (a few hundred people, or a dozen people with dozens of accts each, constantly cycling out used accts and always making new ones).....

it's happening...you can stick your head in the sand if you want to.....but it's happening on some level already, and will only increase over time

the only thing that has any chance of stopping it is if enough people get off their lazy azz, and take 2 minutes to e-mail the poker sites they play at and voice their concerns about the lax state of security.......

any time a site gets any signifigant increase in similarly themed e-mails for a given period you can be sure they will be paying attention......increased e-mails such as these where people voice concern over security and integrity of the games and they will be sure to start the ball rolling on in depth investigation and new security measures

send e-mails to security@fulltiltpoker.com, and CC same e-mail to collusion@fulltiltpoker.com, and feedback@fulltiltpoker.com ...(dont bother sending anything to the generic support@fulltiltpoker.com.....the other addresses go straight to the people that would get em anyhow

at pokerstars support@pokerstars.com is the only address I know of

also a good idea to take the few seconds to email them any time you see anything that's even slightly suspect... if players involved did no wrong then they dont even know they were looked at..... no harm no foul.....players that get reported repeatedly will be more closely scrutinzed and eventually a pattern may form that security can pick up on....(many times players could be indeed cheating and security can find no evidence because the players are sophisticated and only through many instances may they be able to detect somethings not right).... it's all of ours responsibility to do what we can to try and keep the game as honest as possible

any 10 yr old can make 10 accts in same day from the same computer and connection, then register all 10 of those accts in the same MTT.... that fact alone makes me certain that site security is severely lacking

they're pretty good at stopping swearing or spamming in the chat though....some how they can find the time and money to make an automatic system to stop that.........

but typing in "other than English" they cant stop (even though it's against their own rules)....
even typing in non-English alphabet is ok.......like cyrillic (Russian) alphabet is ok (that chat looks like this -> lll llllll llll lllllllll lll)..... they cant stop that.....
but if you use a curse word, even with spaces and dots in between the letters...the automatic chat monitor instantly catches on......better to stop profane insults that to stop even the least sophisticated of cheaters

guess I got a little off topic (cant help myself sometimes)........sorry to hijack your thread Texas....

I know who, and why

Quote:

voronezh poker

Russia, may see a big problem, and see whats going on, online, and is trying to put an end to it..

#16 5th July 2009, 1:40 AM

I've done some research and most of the people at Railbirds are from the US the and the UK. Railbirds has in the past been a place where passwords are shared.

Based on this I'm telling Pokerstars and other sites to be careful about people from these countries and as a result have turned myself in.

Seriously, it's good to be vigilant and it's great to be stopping cheating in OFC tournaments, but to extrapolate freeroll cheating to the end of online poker due to a Russian invasion is a hell of a stretch.

#17 5th July 2009, 1:44 AM

fwiw, i vacation in russia for 4 weeks like 10 years ago, some of the comments in this thread are rediculous stereotypes of russians which has been brought about by the american media

#18 5th July 2009, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pantin007

fwiw, i vacation in russia for 4 weeks like 10 years ago, some of the comments in this thread are rediculous stereotypes of russians which has been brought about by the american media

I think that perhaps you're making a mistake of stereotyping the respondents here, I for one see very little American media which is likely to influence my opinion of Russians, but I do work with quite a few Russians.

#19 5th July 2009, 11:57 PM

I'm not sure how I feel about what Russia is doing without doing some research on it. However, I do have mixed emotions on gambling. It's a real great past time and lots of fun and I enjoy it very much. However, for those that do have a gambling problem, maybe it's best????

#20 6th July 2009, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pantin007

fwiw, i vacation in russia for 4 weeks like 10 years ago, some of the comments in this thread are rediculous stereotypes of russians which has been brought about by the american media

I agree some of these comments are a bit bit out there.
Wow.... I must live in a bubble. Brought on by the American media????

#21 6th July 2009, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewLucker

This correct decision of the Russian government! Ordinary people lose last money in slots even pensioners! When casinos will move far they become accessible only to the rich!(for example LasVegas) And poker clubs are allowed to work on former-after all it is sports kind!
MeTim i think you see what are you want!

Welcome Russki, yes u r right casinos and slots in particular bleed the common man. Big problem in Canada also.
I did not mean earlier to imply all Russians are cheating online, only that there are identifiable crews from Russia, Romania, and South America that have been spotlighted in forums recently. And that these crews are on the rise, due partly to sites such as voronez (sp?) subject of a related thread....
And yes I believe it is a 'national' trait of some countries (Russia, Romania) to see themselves as 'against the west,' so collusion would be seen as a good game/war strategy to defeat the capitalist swine, and therefore more acceptable a practice on nationalistic grounds.
God help us if the Islamic fundamentalists ever start playing poker. Lol. Not really.

#22 6th July 2009, 1:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachinpntdry

if you read the quote you posted..... I said surely it happens everywhere, ......but that I believed they constitute a larger than avg slice of that total collusionary pie (comparing apples to apples.... total # of accounts from a region in relation to total # of accounts from that region involved in such activity) .... never said it was the entire country

No, go back and read what you said. What you said was that Russians made up a disproportionate number of cheats, without offering a single shred of proof other than your "belief".

Your example of one tournament and the things you may or may not have seen don't constitue proof. You'd need hard data from a reasonable and relevant sample size for that.

Made up statements can be used to prove anything. 40% of all people know that.

#23 7th July 2009, 1:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makwa

Welcome Russki, yes u r right casinos and slots in particular bleed the common man. Big problem in Canada also.
I did not mean earlier to imply all Russians are cheating online, only that there are identifiable crews from Russia, Romania, and South America that have been spotlighted in forums recently. And that these crews are on the rise, due partly to sites such as voronez (sp?) subject of a related thread....
And yes I believe it is a 'national' trait of some countries (Russia, Romania) to see themselves as 'against the west,' so collusion would be seen as a good game/war strategy to defeat the capitalist swine, and therefore more acceptable a practice on nationalistic grounds.
God help us if the Islamic fundamentalists ever start playing poker. Lol. Not really.

Hi Canadian!In your words there is an element of truth! But it is conversation on other theme, here I have simply answered a question... And thinking it is not necessary to mention national themes, it is fraught... And concerning some forums from Russia...I will tell so... team play is in any country and separate people, but not a forum all there are engaged in it! And it is watched by any poker rooms!Its problem for their security not for us!

#24 4th August 2009, 10:09 PM

As followed expect... Poker in Russia now not sports, was closed by all clubs!

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