RUSH MTT EASY COLLUSION?

SO for some reason I am thinking about this and don't know why but here is what I am thinking.

In regular tournaments in online poker collusion is almost impossible unless all the players involved in the collusion luckily get seated together or make it to the final table together in which case it can really get ugly.

Anyways my point is that with this new rush system it is really easy for any group of people to collude. One group could easily see each other many of times and eventually dump a lot of chips ones way.

Not trying to start anything here just thinking out loud, wondering if Full Tilt has things in place for this.

I don't know, they would also have to be positioned at the table just right, as well as make sure no one else go involved in the hand?
It seems too complicated to pull off, but who knows?

Any donkament offers the opportunity for collusion. Just play cash games, imo.

seems to me cash games are easier targets
for colluders.
all they have to do is sit at the same table
they can even pick their position
if the game is short-handed.
is there any defence against this,
besides reporting them, if you are suspicious ?
what do others think ?

Surely not. In any reasonably large tourney, the odds would be way against you being seated at the same table as your colleague, unless you both last until the late stages when the number of tables is greatly reduced. If you can both do that, you have no need to cheat.

KC`s point was that in a Rush tourney, thanks to the constant seat-shifting, you are much more likely to find yourself at the same table (at least briefly), and therefore cheating is easier.

especially if you have half decent players playing then they could play for a while building a stack then dumping. jus sayin.

You could definitely chip dump easier. I'm not sure how big of an advantage that is.

The big advantage (I think) to collusion is that if one person has a monster he can check, and if the victim doesn't raise his buddy can make a small bet to inflate the pot and tempt the victim into calling. Or in other hands, the conspirators can do a series of small re-raises to inflate the pot with the other guy caught in the middle and calling some of those.

Really, the situations where one can collude effectively are rare, and the changes of co-conspirators being together at the same table when the opportunity arises is much rarer.

If it's all fixed, why are you playing there? Dear me.

I think the opposite, but it's just a notion.

If colluder's are in RUSH, they would have to wait a long time to meet each other most of the time. On those rare occasions they did meet up they would need to have a sucker, and if you do much rush, you know most folks are out of each hand early, and most these days are playing pretty decent hands. Maybe not monsters, but by and large, playable hands, not like your normal donkfest IMHO.

While they might try it a time or two, I think they would not be as effective in RUSH as in a normal tourney, or ring game. And truthfully, a couple of colluder's could sit at a short handed table and if they were worth their salt, probably be very effective. And a whole lot faster. And then run.

On the other hand, because so many people don't pay a lot of attention to the rush hand they have already folded to, there would generally be fewer witnesses........

And then maybe in a rush ring game they could find that happy medium where they see their sucker often enough AND each other often enough to maybe worth attempting. Also in the RUSH ring games you can play 4 hands at a time within the same group, which would/could even enhance those rare meetings to be much less rare.

Yup!, I'm convinced, RUSH ring games would be the place to collude.

It'd be a good place to hide bots too. No PTR, etc.

I couldn't see how it would be beneficial. For starting even dumping the chips to someone else early on has no impact really. You could do that several times over and be chip leader but how often do you find when the blinds are getting bigger these overall chip leader don't often stay there.

I can only see colluding working in cash games personally.

Wow, you're soooo clueless.

Colluders who collude by chip dumping do so by dumping chips from the big stacks to the smaller ones, not the opposite as you assume. Ever heard of ICM?

I think in general single table sit n gos especially dons are naturally better for collusion because in rush tournaments colluders aern't going to be on the same table most of the time so opportunities to chip dump don't happen every hand. It is certainly harder and more complicated to chip dump and collude.

On the other hand I think it will be easier to go unnoticed and not get caught when you do chip dump in Rush, as they move onto to another table as soon as they fold, and won't notice strange play as much.

I think would be colluders will need a bigger group to operate effectively for it to give them a real edge though.

A group of colluders with 2 or 3 players which can operate in single tables would be pretty ineffective in Rush. They'd probably want a group of 10+ players playing a tournament, unless they have multiple accounts, and it all gets really complicated.

All in all I think you're much safer from cheating in these than single table sit n gos.

Gotta agree with most of the comments here. I think it would be tougher in Rush tourneys for small groups of cheats. Large groups may work but then your taking the profit margin out of a victory.

Its all fixed, that must explain why ive been winning thousands the last 4 months in them?!

Yeah it's fixed for you to win... :P

^^^

ldo

You quoted me so how did u not manage to notice I said it's not fixed?!

missed the if.....

screw the rush poker SnG's...dam those things are brutal...i got rocked in all 5 of them i played today

I am sure he meant to quote the above post, not yours...

Poker stars watches players IP's. If the same two people who live near each other are in the same games, PS will investigate. Yes its possible to cheat but its also possible to get caught and be prosicuted.

You can certainly be caught and have your account closed, but I doubt there is a serious risk of prosecution. If I remember right, Pokerstars is licensed in the Isle of Man, so you`d be fairly safe from criminal proceedings if you live anywhere outside UK jurisdiction. It`s unlikely that the authorities would be interested in extraditing you to stand trial unless you had defrauded such a large sum (millions ?) that dealing with you was deemed necessary in the public interest.

Well yeah but you would have to have a number of people doing it for it to be effective wouldn't ya? And then if that's the case...all these people colluding are going all to of paid a buy-in fee. Regradless if it's a small stack getting re-stacked for it to be benefical you would need several if not all being ITM and one winning it. Only way it can be effective is cash games in my opinion.

Wat? In cash games, chips are worth their dollar value, so chip dumping is always 0EV (-EV with rake).

What makes chip dumping +EV in tournament is the fact that all chips in your stack are not worth the same. Typically that the $ value of two equal stacks is much bigger than the $ value of a small and big stack with the same total number of chips. That's only true in tournaments, and therefore your opinion about cash games is just plain wrong.