Playing poker for free is illegal

Guess that means playing all board games including Monopoly, Trouble, and Chutes & Ladders is illegal in New York as well.

Unless if they are doing an undercover sting operation where they simply bust down your doors for playing in your own house then your gonna be ooooook now smoking on the other hand!..

Well, good on ya!! This law is the biggest crock of crap I've seen in a long time, if ever. You can't play for 'entertainment value'!??? WTF does anyone play anything for (they need to look up the definition of 'play', they might find 'fun'), especially when there is no money involved? There are trivia and other games on the NTN Network ( http://www.ntn.com/) , played in bars across the country that offer prizes. I love QB1.

They know from the get that they never intend to prosecute for ANYTHING other than poker. Bastards. They shouldn't get away with this, strictly on principle, even if I were against gambling, legally or otherwise. And that 'privilege' thing, I can't even guess what that means.

If you can think of anything else we can do (aside from the obvious legal fees), please post.

Hmm really intersting posts, I didn't hear about this at all, I'm very surprised... playing poker for FREE is ILLEGAL??? WTF?

In their infinite wisdom, they are trying to protect you from yourself again. God forbid you get hooked on the game and try to go a step further and play for, gulp, money.

To add, everybody knows that the only legitimate thing to spend your money on is the lottery and horse races, things that are controlled and taxed. So, is this really about protecting you, or protecting them?

I actually didn't believe this (sounded like a scheme to me), so I researched NY state penal law 225 and the info represented above is a little over the top.

Section 225.00 Gambling offenses; definitions of terms
The following definitions are applicable to this article:
1. "Contest of chance" means any contest, game, gaming scheme or gaming device in which the outcome depends in a material degree upon an element of chance, notwithstanding that skill of the contestants may also be a factor therein.
2. "Gambling." A person engages in gambling when he stakes or risks something of value upon the outcome of a contest of chance or a future contingent event not under his control or influence, upon an agreement or understanding that he will receive something of value in the event of a certain outcome.

The "something of value" factor only applies to contests of chance. So bowling, volleyball, darts, would in no way be illegal because they do not rely on an element of chance.

Almost any sport contains an element of chance, especially if the contestants have similar amounts of skill. I think that's why the best baseball teams barely win more than 6 out of 10 games. Sure, the players have a lot of skill, but in any given game, chance plays a big part. It really wouldn't be that interesting to watch if there weren't some doubt about the outcome.

I can see why some poker proponents have taken the "game of skill" approach -- to try to combat the preconceived bias that poker must be gambling.

I wonder what the original intent of this New York law was. No doubt something to do with state revenues or spending.

I doubt NY States motivations are of moral grounding. Their paramount interest is likely in how to tax online gaming. Given the current economic environment some compromise here would probably take care of the issue. My cable company, for example, has to pay my town to operate here, gaming operators could pay a license fee to pander to New Yorkers in similar fashion. NY gets free money. Politicians like free money I think, at least in Illinois.

wow! i'm happy to live in france xD.

really weird law

its about taxes and not about gambling. if you wanna play poker then you should have the right to do so. whats with liberalism and freedom? all blown away? to me these are really kind of ridiculous laws just repressing people.

You are going to have a hard time proving that the element of chance in any sport plays a "marginal degree" in the outcome of the event. The chance involved in sports is not randomized, it is an illusion to the audience. The only real chance involved in a sporting event, would be things outside the athlete's control, such as wind speed, weather conditions, etc.

The intent of the law is to do exactly what the OP was looking to legalize: tavern poker and it's equivalent. If they don't spell this out, you could set up a "free" poker team that rewards the winner with "a gift". This legislation eliminates any loopholes with gambling. NY wants to make sure that people don't play games of chance with the possibility to win something, regardless of an entry fee.

You mean "material degree." Yeah, I'm sure you're right. It would be hard to prove, but I see it all the time when I watch. The ball takes some funny bounces and many times the outcome of the game rests on it, i.e. "It's a game of inches." That seems "material" to me.

Here's an interesting law I found in Washington state, defining "material degree" of skill; not sure about applying it to chance:

Material degree of skill required in amusement games.


Amusement game operators must conduct games in which the outcome depends to a material degree on the skill of the player. We consider a "material degree of skill" to be present when both of these requirements are met:

(1) The player's physical or mental abilities play an important and integral role in determining the outcome of the game; and

(2) The success rate of the average player would improve with repeated play or practice.

Sounds like poker to me.

Oral sex is also illegal in 17 states plus Washington DC... but I don't think that stops anyone.

In case anyone is wondering, the following states are:

Alabama, Arizona, Florida, Idaho, Kansas, Louisiana, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Mississippi, Georgia, North and South Carolina, Oklahoma, Oregon, Rhode Island, Utah, Virginia and Washington D.C.

But somehow Mr. Clinton gets away with it...sheesh.

im more surprised about that oral sex law.....like most of you were saying its about making money off of doing nothing and that is what our goverment has become so its no surprise to me...it some state out west it is a class 2 felony to play online poker.....horrible what the once great
U.S.A. has become

Arrest us all!

It would be hard to think that a freindly game would bring possible police action, who knew. I guess we are all trouble makers.

How about who cares?

beer, pot , poker, cigarettes, oral sex america is a free country ha.

THE LAND OF THE FREE... lol I always lol at people who tell me AMERICA IS GREAT BECAUSE THERE IS SO MUCH FREEDOM... I live in New York but i used to live in EUROPE and i can tell you that I USED TO have more FREEDOM in EUROPE then in here... The amount of DUMB little laws here is sick.. Well thats what i get for living in USA.. I still wont leave this place unless one day i'll win few mills of $$ then i`ll probably move to Italy.

wow, i didn't know about the oral sex law. My girlfriend and i have been breaking the law for years. even in public.

didnt no that it was illegal 2 play poker with me m8s 4 illegal ow well
looks like il be breaking the law

Honestly..who really cares?

Just what we need....More liberals in politics, dictating what we can and can not do. Unbeliveable.

I can understand that it would be illegal to run a home poker casino, like taking a rake from every pot.

But playing poker for free is simply not illegal, even if there is money involved and no rake/fees, it is not illegal.

Anyone who thinks that it is... is a utter moron. If you think that it is illegal you are clearly too stupid to play poker anyway.

Please continue playing poker for free, or for money, but do not charge people a fee for this....you need a gambling license then I believe.


LOL. Gold, this pretty much proves my point.

There are no casinos in Texas but they have lots of texas hold em tournys at local bars all over the Dallas area. It cost nothing to sit down but the payouts are real money. Won once at a bar near wylie texas and won $200 for first place. Not to bad for 2 hour tournament

I live in florida now,and they have free bar poker.
I dont usually play in the games here for the simple fact that there is nothing to win.
Back home in minnesota we had a bar league that we would play 4 nights a week,the only difference was that you acctually won prises in it.
whether be a bar tab or tshirts or chip sets.
You were stilll competing for some thing.
Here there are no prises allowed at all.

yah , its free and this is also supose to be a free country to but its not

I have to call bs.

The law states that you have to RISK something of value, not simply that you are playing for something of value. Clearly you are not "risking" 'extension of a service, entertainment or a privilege of playing at a game or scheme without charge'.

Either the op is grossly misinformed, or is running some sort of scam.

Wow, that is crazy. Too bad for me....guess I will continue to play illegally....oh wait....playing with money outside of a casino is illegal anyway isn't it?

But officer......we are playing for push-ups.......
each dollar value represents 1 push-up.....

another words.....no value of anything is being risked.....
the looser actually WINS!!!! he/she wins a good workout.....

THERE......keep playing poker!!! HAHA

You have to risk some thing of value playing for free you risk nothing.

This means nothing, there's so much dumb things that are illegal, this law isn't suppose to make poker illegal, you will never see somebody being arrested for playing poker for fun in their own houses.