Playing for free

OK, now that I have your attention
Here's a theory I've had for awhile and I intend on testing it out someday. I'm curious if anyone else have done this.
As everyone knows, you risk your bankroll buying in tourneys hoping to cash.most of the time we don't, sometimes we do.
What if you could play for free? when you cash, you get 100% of your investment.
So here's my theory. you play a $11 sattelite for Sunday million ($200+$15). You win. Now unregister. You now have 215 T$ to win another satelite. you have enough to play 20 more. So if you can win 1 out of 20 or better, you could build your T$ up to a comfortable bankroll to play for money tourneys.
So now you could play risk free with your T$'s. When your T$ get low, then use them for sattelites again. Simple, right?

Oh ok. So your plan to win money is to win money.

Ummmm................what?

I think this is a major waste of time. You are essentially playing MTTs with no shot at ever winning big. If you go deep and are running good, you can win $200 max. If you were just to play a $11 MTT you could win thousands if you make a deep run.

So I would have to say no to this one.

dont follow your logic on this one. i myself never buy into sat's just wait till you got the BR for the tourney you want. unless you are just a casual player then its ok i guess, for fun

You forgot the bit where you don't win lol.

I do admire you trying to find an edge and sharing. I think this is how ideas are formed.

But unfortunately, I don't think that idea works well.

Keep trying though.

lol, regardless if it was intended, that cringed with sarcasm.

it actually aint bad, i have done such things and i find the chance to win on a sat. game pretty good, but all the bigger games i play i usually lose, but just cashing out and playing smaller games you're comfy with works well, if all you have to do is win 1 of 20 to win- it aint to bad, win 2 or 3 and your up, sure you dont win the million, but i always lose my bankroll going in games above my level.
i think if it works then cool gl

Believe it or not, I think I know what OP is trying to say. When you play a sattelite into one of the big tournaments is costs a fraction of the buy-in for the tournament ($11.22 for a $215 tourney).

If you can get the tourney ticket (without playing it 20 times) then you cash out the ticket and now have $215 to enter other tournaments or to continue to try and get another tourney ticket, repeat process.

FWIW, I did this today and I won $150 by missing the ticket by one spot. It cost me $50 in entries to do this. So I am up $100.

I have done this-won then unregistered. But the question is-can you win more than 1 out of 20? If you win one then you're breaking even. If you don't win then...well...you're back to square 1. I do this once in a while but not as a way to build BR- I guess it's possible but I'd win one then put it into smaller sngs where more spots pay with fewer players.

Nice try mate but in my opinion what happens if you keep having a bad run? Then your bankroll is crushed the theory is good but in practice it wont work :P Like communism :P

Satties are a great way to build a roll. I have won like 5 5.50 satties to the double deuce in a row. Easy 100.00 but these are 9 man sng. There are also some great sats to mini ftops now.

Good way to play in bigger buy ins cheap

Basically this is just the same as sound bankroll management. Your 1 in 20 scenario puts you at the high end (investing 5%) of what you should be wagering. But this isn't much different than what most good players do, you are just doing it with Sats rather than Sit-n-gos, MTTs or Cash Tables.

I did went out with a tournament win 20ftpp the inscription as it had already won one gave me the q points were 220 ... the problem is you have to win every tournament satellites nor anything that is not easy, but it's true that good the idea.

lol... I was thinking the same thing

Actually, there is an article about this topic in WPT Magazine. It talks about playing sats. for a living, and how many players over look the value they have. You are "min" cashing for 10-20 times your buy-in.

In the article, however, he sells the T$, but I think it is a good way to build a BR.

Yeah, I guess it's not a bad idea. I think it's fairly probable if you're a good player to win the tourney at least 1/20 times.

BY GEORGE, I THINK HE"S GOT IT!
The whole theory depends on if/when you can win a ticket.
You basically build your BR playing with T$ instead of your own money.

Doesn't make sense at all. How did you get that $11 in the first place? You're not playing for free. You're basically saying, when you win a satellite, it's free money. It's not free money, it's yours.

What you're saying is don't play large tournaments. Only play small ones, so you won't lose as much.

Is your cash game strategy, double up? Then instead of playing with all your "free" money that you won, play with only part of it?

Hilarious!

How is this different to playing regular tournaments or SnGs though, other than the fact that you're being paid in $T rather than real money? Those tournament dollars aren't free and they're not someone else's money.

All you're saying is "win a tournament then play with the profits". If you were saying something like "ZOMGZ the fields in these satellite tournaments are so bad it's almost like playing with free money" then maybe I could understand, but that's not what you're saying, is it...

Thought I would also add that this method is a slow, slow grind -- so best used when you find a really soft satellite. The problem is, other players know the trick, and will soon spot the softest of the soft, making it more difficult.

Recently, I ran up about 70 T$ with very little risk. The super turbo sat to the Mini FTOPS cost just $1.50 + $0.10. A ticket was worth $5.50, so I figured if I won just 1 in 3, I could make a profit. Actually I did a bit better than 50% over a sample of some 30-40 satellites. I am not that good, but these were super soft, bordering on stupid.

With just 300 starting chips and blinds raising every 5 minutes, players were too impatient. Around 20% of the field would go all in on the first hand.

I on the other hand, sat back waiting to double up once or twice; usually getting my money in good, and then folding my way to victory. It was clear that once I hit around 750 chips, there was no reason to play any more hands, which saw me folding even pocket aces (to all those players who would NEVER fold pocket aces pre-flop, here is yet another example where you are wrong).

Well, that satellite is gone, and I have found nothing comparable since. So, your method is really sound, if you can find an easily beatable satellite.

Or you could forget about the big tourneys, and make your living on satellites...

Yeah, im not really seeing this work at all. Most people play for the big win anyway, and this just doesnt give that. Why not just stick to micro cash games and play like 10 tables? Youre getting more play, spreading your money across way more games and you can still hit big wins. Not really a free way to play if you want to really win good money.

Now that I think about it, if there's an overlay (the tournament promises at least one seat worth $215 but only 16 people enter, for example) then there's a small "free money" component to this that wouldn't be present compared to say a standard $11 tournament or SnG.

If OP meant this I assume he would've said it though. If the plan is "play in satellites whether there's an overlay or not" then plan is no different to standard tournaments and there's no real free money aspect.

Besides, standard tournaments have overlays too. The Daily Dollar on Full Tilt almost always has a $3Kish overlay and you can enter that with FPPs - now that is more like free money.

It depends on how big the tournament is and how wide the pay out range is. You can use this strategy, but you would most likely come close to breaking even. Just lost time really...

Here are the pluses of Syds plan;

-You seldom have to fight all that hard to win the SNG ticket to the bigger tourney, and unregistering for the T$ can be profitable.

A favorite one amongst at least several folks around here are the sats to the 1/4 mil. There are several versions, I prefer the $2+.20 36 seat sats which give out 6 tickets ($11) and some leftover change to a 7th player.

Maybe once in a couple of years have I not got a seat for the 1/4 mil for far less than the $11 buy in to the 1/4 mil. On average I probably pay approx $5 for a seat in the 1/4 mil.

Sometimes when I think the dealer likes me, I will win a seat, then go play another one for the $T.

Here are the negatives of Syd's plan....

-At some point you have to convert the $T into real money. Can't use em in ring play, so you have to play either a big MTT or a SnG. But since we're all poker players here, is this even a negative?
-Uh, I can't think of any others.............................

the title of the post is misleading, the op is trying to say that you can build up a br by playing satelites. For ex if your br is about 200$ you`re not registering to a 200$ tournament but instead play a zilion satelites for a 11$ buy`in (assuming you don`t go broke) and when you have a br of 10k$ risk it on big tournaments, and that`s when you try to "score big".
The thing is, it`s time consuming and you need a long run to achive this and in the long run it makes no difference if you play normal 11$ MTTs.

Yeah, QFT. Satellites are notoriously weak games, and can be extremely profitable. If you consider the T$ as a route to real money, which it certainly is if you can cash in tourneys, satellites are a real winner. But like other people have said, the OP phrased it in a .. strange way? Good intentions though, right?

The hardest part is placing in fisrt. You have at least 20 other people to beat out . Your best bet would be double or nothing then you just have to b ein the top five out 10 to double your money. Just dont be a donk sit back and take your time only play premuim hands and you will make top five easy. That just a suggestion not saying yours was bad . I know sound great pay 11 make 215 if only it was that easy

Yes, I realize it wasn't a good title for my post. I think alot of people misunderstood my point, and some got it...sort of.
Let me try this one more time, and then I'll leave it alone. Of course now since I wrote, this, I have to try and prove my theory....anyways, here goes.

1. Assuming you already have a moderate BR of $250+

2. Enter a satellite. look for one that has multiple payouts such as the $10 + .70 for Sunday Million. Top 2 wins ticket. The first round is not even a full table (usually 3-5).

3. Win ticket for $200 + 15...unregister.

4. You now have 215 T$ to play with. Now the plan is to never play with your real money again. (Free money)

5. You're going to use the T$ to play smaller tourneys. (Use standard BR management) All cash winnings go into your real money account.

6. When your T$ gets low (set a min limit), probally around 150 T$, use your T$ to play the same satellites to win more T$. (might be best to just play satellites at first to get your T$ up above 400 or 500. Your decision.

7. Now, say if your T$ is above your safe limit, theirs no reason why you can't play another Sunday Million satellite and decide to play it. I'm all for the big win too, I was just trying to come up with a way to reduce the risk of your own money to win money.

So what happens when u dont cash in 20-20 at $11 a piece u are then out $220 or somethat around there LOL. I can see your logic though but most people want win the 1st time they play the will have to play 5-10 times maybe even more before winning

LOL, its the same exact thing. This post is pointless. It doesn't matter if its $T or regular money it is still the same EXACT thing. All you are saying is use bankroll management for your $T and dont play with non $Ts, but it is all the same money and in reality none of it was free. I mean I could say the same thing but I used freerolls to start my BRs, but my way its ACTUALLY free money while yours is just different money. Just because its a $T means absolutely nothing other than you lose 5% if you want to play ring games with it or cash out.

your theory implies that you win your satellite the 1st time you play it

Othewise, you don't play for free, but play for losing $11 each time you play and lose

Interesting post. Still no full proof way of making money rather it be T$ or e cash. Everyone has their own ideas good to see an original one at least. Rather it works or not.

this method has it`s advantages though, sat players are weaker than normal mtts players