Is online poker rigged??? An investigation!

lol i click on 'read first unread post' and its liam going 'OMG i just wasted another 10 minutes of my life reading this thread'

If you're actually open-minded enough to be receptive, let me make a suggestion in all seriousness. Keep visiting this site regularly, listen to these people and learn. You will soon realise who talks bollocks on this site, and who knows what they're talking about.

Go and look in the Strategy Articles tab (top right of this page) and you will find strategy articles there by F Paulsson. Go and look at our poker training videos and they are done by Dorkus Malorkus. These people do know what they're talking about. Read zach's thread about how he set a target of how much money to grind out, and how he achieved it over a period of months.

The only reason that they're taking the piss out of you is because you're talking bollocks. Sorry to be so blunt, but that's what it boils down to. I hope your blinkers don't stop you from taking advantage of all that this site has to offer, and it's all free. Don't let your inflated ego get in the way, please.

Live shuffles are of course not random.

Thought I'd mention it.

Dude... You were being SERIOUS this whole time?

Alright, two points:

1. Your "ability" to play poker means diddly squat if your basic argument completely lacks merit.
2. You seriously still don't see why we thought your posting of only winning tournaments was dumb?

You start out acting the victim, which is fine, but this kinda ruins the moment.

Here's the deal, buddy:

You're allowed to

a) think that only people with proven online poker experience can voice their opinion, and
b) supply complete records showing your prowess as an online poker player

... but you can't claim A and then produce a list where you've cut out all your losses as proof that you're the real deal. That's laughable. Personally, I don't care if the highest you've played is $1 tournaments - what matters is what you can argue. So far, you've come up extremely short.

Thank you, I'll try.

You confuse opinion with fact. You are talking about people ridiculing opinions and being opinionated on something that has nothing to do with opinions. There are several people here who make a good side income playing poker. I know ChuckTs always has a graph with profits of 4 figures each month, and he doesn't even play a ton. Your biggest win isn't a measure of your ability, that's just luck. Would you call Jamie Gold the best player in the world since he had the biggest cash, or would you give it to other pros who consistently cash in tournaments with the best around the world? I'd take the latter.

But poker skill is hardly the criteria needed to judge this, it's more of a math/common sense thing. Hell if we really want to get into appeals to authority, how about the pros who sponsor online poker rooms? You think you're better than people like Negreanu, Ivey, and Hellmuth?

But again, I've asked time and time again for you to define where it is rigged. Put in English what is wrong with the RNG that a fair RNG wouldn't do. I have yet to hear ONE response to this in the form of a question that can be objectively investigated and figured out one way or the other. Of course though, it only makes sense that your side is the one against any and all attempts to actually get to the truth of the matter, you're just scared that your insecurities with your own game will prove to be what they are. You're content with making excuses when you don't succeed. It's the same with people who feel they have to sue everyone else when things don't go their way. It's never your own fault, you never actually have to work at all. Just blame someone else, it's a lot easier. You can't win online? Must be the site. They're not better than me and I can't beat me, so their bad play must stop me from winning, or the site must rig it for them.

Whoa what happened to this thread since my last post. Giant (GIANT - had to use fit to width) pics, strange arguments. Strange accusations.

I wonder about some of these arguments. Particularly the one that they have to be rigging, because rebuys always reach their guaruntee. ?? lol are you serious?

Hey the cards go into and auto shuffler at most my casinos and we don't see em shuffled,,, so they might or might not be random and they might or might not be rigged.

Unless you can see a Geiger-Müller tube and some radioactive isotope near the shuffler, I don't think it's random by the know-it-all picky definition.

Sigh.....

multi marsupial tournaments?

I LOL'd out loud.

FYI, Donkus, MMT = Mega Money Tournament. How do you think Dario Minieri, Annette_15, and others have made so much money? They go all in with big stacks in MMTs with their 70% success rate.

Maybe - could also be Multi Mammal Tournaments (any tourney with more than one donkey entered would qualify...)

1. Most likely this is right, because short stacks are pushing with ATC a lot of the time, and the one big stack with a hand will call.

2. Are there any CC players with a significant amount of MTTs? Luckily this poster has made a testable hypothesis and although I doubt it'll change his mind, we CAN test this. I've got plenty of cash games, but I don't play many MTTs, so I don't have enough data to test it on. Anyone got a significant sample of MTTs?

I did hit 4 of a kind 3 times on PokerStars in a MTT. Once with AK, flop was 3 kings. Had 76. flop wa s 766, another 6 on the river. 3rd time was AA, 2 aces hit the flop. Kind of hard to believe when you hit it 3 times in one tournament. twice from an unpaired hand. I know the odds of flopping 4 of a kind from one whole card is like .000001 percent. Way below 1% anyway. I won't say online poker is rigged but I it is predetermined software.

But 2 half cards give you and extra .0034 percent

It's actually one in 9800, which means it should happen 1 in 9800 times, not that it should never happen. I played about half that many hands today and didn't flop quads, so I guess you hitting made up for me missing. Oh and please don't comment on stuff you don't understand. Like "predetermined software". Since it counts on user input as well as machine entropy I highly doubt that stuff is predetermined, and that doesn't matter anyway.

I see one common thread behind all "omg it's rigged" posts. They see one unlikely event, almost always against them (although granted this one happened for the poster), and believe it's rigged. Guess what? When something is random, unlikely things happen. If I played 100k hands and DIDN'T flop quads MULTIPLE times with non pocket pair hands there'd be some evidence that it was rigged (I'm not calculating how much evidence because either people won't understand it or they're already on my side anyway). Something out of the ordinary happening is proof that it is random, as long as it doesn't happen more frequently than it should in the long term. You can't see one likely event and call it rigged, or even predetermined.

As a side note, seems that those that complain it's rigged are basically using it as a crutch. They are losing, don't want to think that they may be facing better competition, or that perhaps the long run is longer than they think, so of course they blame the site. Note that the one player who accuses the poker sites of doing something wrong and saying it's not rigged, but only predetermined, is the one who had a good thing happen. Flop quads, maybe predetermined, opponent hits a 2-outer, omg rigged. I don't know why I post anymore here knowing that all the people who think it's rigged aren't going to listen to my logic anyway.

I am a WINNING online player. Dont care whether you believe that or not. I just cashed out 800 from 3 MTTS at Betmost. I havent won a penny since I cashed out in over 2 months now. 90% of the time, I have the best hand when the money goes in. Honest. Trust me on that one. I just sat at an MTT for an hour and got 3 playable hands. AA, KK, and AJ. AJ cost me a lot. I saw on NUMEROUS occasions people RE RAISING with A2 suited, and this guy FLOPPED a flush vs AK. So it happens right? It happened AT LEAST 10 times in the hour I played. AT LEAST.
Ok here is another thought, how is it, that when someone has aa you can rest assured any hand you call with will hit top pair? Or, the flop is all diamonds, you ALWAYS improve your hand just like I did, trip sixes on the turn, but someone flopped the flush.
As I write this, I just saw someone call a raise with 6-2 vs AJ, the guy flops a jack, and 6-2 calls and hits two pair on the turn. Yeah, thats about right.
Its right the **** there in black and white. I just flopped top pair king kicker and got beat by the ace kicker. I couldnt hit the side of a ****ing barn if Im not already beaten. By the way, the guy that called the raise with 6-2 and randomly hit two pair AFTER the money went in, is chip leader right now. And, he hits EVERY flop. All Im seeing today, as with every other god damned day online, is how these ****ing donkeys get what they call "lucky" so often. The same chair just flopped with Q2 trip twos, and thats funny because I folded 2-3. He won AGAIN.

NOBODY HITS EVERY FLOP. WAKE UP. I hold a hand that has 17 outs and I dont hit, but if they need the case king, you can ****ing well bet they will river it.

Its like hey Betmost, I didnt change my game, how come I cant win ANY hand at all? I go all in with AA, the guy waits and waits, then calls, flop is A 4 5, he has 55, turn is ANOTHER 5. If you think this is random, then cool, if you can make money online, go for it. I can too, except for these last two months AFTER I cashed out 800 bucks. DO THE MATH.

All of a sudden I forget how to play??????????????? No, I DONT THINK SO.




Here is the kicker assholes,.I just got JJ at a four seat table, the same ****face from uptop raised, then called two all ins with 8-6 and flopped a straight. Put me and the other guy with 10-10 out.

I was all set to triple up, and this ****ing idiot who now has over 7000 chips flops a straight.


GO TO ****ING HELL BETMOST. YOU ****ING SHITHOLE DUMP. IF I COULD, ID HAVE YOU PUT IN JAIL SO ****ING FAST YOU WOULDNT KNOW WHAT THE **** HIT YOU.

obvious overplay

bai bai.

this is ruthlessly absurd

Kill This Thread

This thread performs an important social function.

Ok

Lets say for the sake of saying no its not rigged!

Show me your profits!


What are you really making or are you?

I like this question better.....I play at a min 3x a week live for about 10 hours a week.....not alot I know but hey from a little podunk town.....average 11 players and always finish i the top 3($$). Oh and yes I did mean to type always. Very easy read players and most play incredible crap so its easy to be patient.

Now then back to online.......play every night at a minimum of 3 hours on week ends way more (of course this is when all the crap starts to fly). Couldn'te get a read on any player because its not them Im worried about. Big hands always produce many callers which in turn produces crap hands to draw too. And it never fails!!!!! If not on the turn then on the river@!!! OK enough of that.

I want to see facts! If your playing for entertainment I dont suppose you will have a thing to post becasue thats all it is.

But hey if I wrong feel free to show your plan I'd love to see it.......and here is where the problems lies with cheating or no cheating.......I'll bet nobody can SHOW ME THE MONEY

And again, switch the period to "Full Tracking"

Official Poker Rankings IREXES Poker Ratings, Results, Statistics

No need to apologise.

There are 9 people at the tournament. A short stack pushes. One of three things happen:

1. No one calls, you don't remember a thing
2. One guy calls, probably the one with the best hand out of the other 8. Now which would you pick as the hand that would win the most, the hand that shoved because he had to as his stack was low, or the one who called because he has a legitimate hand? On average if a player is pushing ATC, the one of the other 8 that calls will have a better hand, thus win more.
3. Multiple people call, odds go down even further for small stack winning.


Well first off, it's more likely that you're lying or suffering from selective memory, but by the odds losing 24 flips in a row should happen about 1 in 16 million. How many people play on poker sites? How many sets of 24 in a row happen? More than 16 million I can tell you that much. So although it's probably it's happened to someone, for some reason I don't think what you're saying is true. Just this thing about people who don't track their hands with something like Poker Tracker. They all seem to lose but never win with fluke hands.

Whoa, you mean that when you have almost the same amount of chips in play, and blinds that make the same blind to stack ratios, that people go out at approximately the same rate? Who'da thunk?



Not if there are 50k swollows and 300 trillion birds. A lot of hands are dealt in online poker, A LOT. And guess who complains about them being rigged? Not the ones who have their hands hold up. Not the ones who hit the 1-outer, but the people who have the strange thing happen. You take a ton of people playing something as unlikely as winning the lottery (FAR more unlikely than the 24 in a row, it's something like 1 in 200 million) and one person wins every month or so. And attention is always paid to that one person, not the other millions of tickets that didn't win. Now if the lottery were a bad thing, all the lotto "winners" (say the top prize was you lose your firstborn child or something, I don't know) would complain that the lotto was rigged, how something so unlikely happened to them. Get what I'm saying? We only hear from the people who have unlikely shit happen to them, so of course it seems like everyone thinks it's rigged.

LOL. You give absolutely 0 facts in that first sentence. How about some stats on your hands?

ok and since I don't want to be accused of taking stuff out of context.

1. Does that matter?
2. $855.20 this month over 16,601 hands 12-tabling 50nl. That enough for you? If not ask Chuck, he seems to pretty much win $1k+/month without fail. Pretty sure he'd agree with me that it's not rigged. And of course Irexes, who's posting here, does very well in tournaments, check out his OPR for proof.


Selective memory? Speaking of facts, how about some of them yourself?


I'm not gonna show you the money lol, it's in my bank/poker accounts. I don't understand what you're saying here, but you provide no proof. I've got 200k+ hands to analyze, I'm within expected variation for everything I've checked so far. My offer stands to run a query on those hands and report results here. Put your challenge of the invalidity into English words and I will run the test on my hands and make the SQL query available to anyone who wants to test it on their Poker Tracker dbs. If you want facts, how about you put your money (credibility?) where your mouth is?