Looking at Winner's Hand

I have a question about poker rules. Specifically, a person that folds that looks at winner's hand after the hand is over without permission. He folds rather than calling bet. Then after winner collects chips, and winner throws hand in to next dealer, folding player routs through cards to see what winner's hand is (i.e., "without paying to see").

Does anyone have a specific rule cite for this?

Thank you and best regards,
bjcowan

You can not, I repeat can not touch your opponents chips or his cards, it is terrible etiquette and not allowed. You can however request to see a players hand and the dealer has to show you the hand, again it is bad etiquette but is allowed. Just dont make a habit of doing it all the time or the players might get a little pissed.

Highly out of line, if this occured at a casino, there would be some serious drama, 99% of the time. If this is at a home game, its still very wrong, as it goes against all that poker is. I know home games are basicaly for fun most of the time, but you need to be somewhat stern on these matters.

Oh, and that request to see the hand bit, thats only if you called the bet. He is slightly wrong in saying you can do that all the time. You must call the raisers bet in order to bear the right to request a visual. If you fold, you are no longer in the action therefore have no more rights.

Thanks everyone (especially you Mr. Armadillo Trim). That is the etiquette that I am also aware of. However what I am looking for is a specific rule that I can reference or cite to settle this dispute.(for example Chapter in Hoyle or other reference, online or otherwise).

Thank you and best regards,
BJCOWAN

This a site by site rule. Some places allow you to request to see a hand. It is very poor taste to ask but you can ask at any time. The rule is there to help prevent collusion and soft playing between friends. The players at no time can go and fish out cards. They can ask and the dealer and he will do it for them. The player can get anything from a 10 min time out to removed from the game for touching the cards.

I have run poker tournaments for several years and this is how I was taught:
At any time another player can request to see a hand. If that someone has already folded during that hand, the requested cards remain dead.

If the winner of the hand requests to see someones hand. Those cards become live again and he can actually lose the pot if they beat his hand.

Sorry I don't remember the exact page or the name of the book I had to read.

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no shit!!!


I thought we were talking about showdown.

Dear Friends.

Thanks for your responses. Can any one help me with a specific cite or reference that I can show the offending party poker regarding looking at my winning hand after he has folded and I have thrown my cards in to dealer for the next hand (this is at-home poker).

Thank you and regards,
BJCOWAN

http://www.pokertda.com/rules.pdf Which is the basis for Harrah's rules... The closest you'll get is #36, which is an etiquette violation. If the cards have gone into the muck, they're gone.

Thanks, Drew.

That's helpful. Do you or anyone else know of any other written rule or reference I can cite specifically that does not allow a player that folds a hand cannot look at the cards once they have gone in the muck, fishing to see what the winner's hand (that he did not pay to see) was?

Hoyle?

Thank you and best regards,
BJCOWAN

Read number 5. It is like I said but now you can show everyone at home. Hope this what you were looking for. He has the right to look. But the way he did it is not acceptable, you have to ask the dealer of the hand to do. You should have a reason to look, thinks he's cheating etc.

Got it from card player magazine website linked below.
CardPlayer.com - Poker Rules


THE SHOWDOWN



1. A player must show all cards in the hand face-up on the table to win any part of the pot.
2. Cards speak (cards read for themselves). The dealer assists in reading hands, but players are responsible for holding onto the ir cards until the winner is declared. Although verbal declarations as to the contents of a hand are not binding, deliberately misca lling a hand with the intent of causing another player to discard a winning hand is unethical and may result in forfeiture of the po t. (For more information on miscalling a hand see ?Section 11 - Lowball,? Rule 15 and Rule 16.)
3. Anyone who sees an incorrect amount of chips put into the pot, or an error about to be made in awarding a pot, has an ethical obligation to point out the error. Please help us keep mistakes of this nature to a minimum.
4. All losing hands must be killed by the dealer before a pot is awarded.
5. Any player who has been dealt in can request to see any hand that has been called, even if the opponent's hand or the winning hand has been mucked. However, this is a privilege that can be revoked if abused. If a player other than the pot winner asks to see a hand that has been folded, that hand is dead. If the winning player asks to see a losing player's hand, both hands are live, and t he best hand wins.
6. If you show cards to another player during or after a deal, any player at the table has the right to see those exposed cards. Cards shown during a deal to a player not in the pot should only be shown to all players when the deal is finished.
7. If everyone checks (or is all-in) on the final betting round, the player who acted first is the first to show the hand. If the re is wagering on the final betting round, the last player to take aggressive action by a bet or raise is the first to show the hand . In order to speed up the game, a player holding a probable winner is encouraged to show the hand without delay. If there is a side pot, players involved in the side pot should show their hands before anyone who is all-in for only the main pot.

Just tell them that back in the old days, people were shot for doing that. Then proceed to tell them that you are Old School.