Interview with the two cheaters in million tourney.

#1 5th December 2007, 11:30 PM

Online Poker: Chris Vaughn and Sorel 'Imper1um' Mizzi Speak, Part 1 | Poker News

#2 5th December 2007, 11:47 PM

Good article... that's insane!

#3 6th December 2007, 12:03 AM

One man/woman one seat. Right?

Unenforceable on the web. They should just stop trying to enforce it.

They could make us all buy fingerprint readers and scan at random times during the gig. But the account holder only hasta be around to thwart that.

Unenforceable on the web. Let it go and recognize that this, along with the donks, are the nature of the beast.

-

#4 6th December 2007, 12:31 AM

they admitted to it tho
can we really believe sorel when he said this was the only time ?
in my oppinion for justice to be restored in online poker they need to be banned if not for life for a long time
if they are allowed back it would just make ppl think they could get away with it and then there will be a major problem

#5 6th December 2007, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAPT. ZIGZAG

One man/woman one seat. Right?

Unenforceable on the web. They should just stop trying to enforce it.

Online poker becomes a joke if the sites legitimise account-selling in the middle of a tournament though

#6 6th December 2007, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzExorcist

Online poker becomes a joke if the sites legitimise account-selling in the middle of a tournament though

But they can't do anything about keeping it from happening. Nothing. Not one thing.

Kinda like the gun thingie. If you take away the guns only cheaters will have them.

They need to just let it go. They can't enforce it, so accept it as a nature of the beast. Online gaming suks anyway, when compared to a casino with actual grumpy dealers and whatnot.

Maybe more folks should pay (Freudian?) a visit to their friendly local casino/Elks club.

-

#7 6th December 2007, 12:46 AM

These two guys are frauds. A shame he is a editor at some magazine. People care too much about the money rather than ethics now a days.

#8 6th December 2007, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAPT. ZIGZAG

But they can't do anything about keeping it from happening. Nothing. Not one thing.

Kinda like the gun thingie. If you take away the guns only cheaters will have them.

They need to just let it go. They can't enforce it, so accept it as a nature of the beast. Online gaming suks anyway, when compared to a casino with actual grumpy dealers and whatnot.

Maybe more folks should pay (Freudian?) a visit to their friendly local casino/Elks club.

-

So, you mean disqualifying the winner and banning the involved parties is "nothing"? I guess if you can get the online pro to come over to your house it's unstoppable and unenforceable. But it really is kind of a smaller problem then, isn't it?

I agree that this pathetic attempt at damage control by these two frauds reads like the bs lies you used to tell your parents in middle school.

#9 6th December 2007, 1:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aliengenius

So, you mean disqualifying the winner and banning the involved parties is "nothing"? I guess if you can get the online pro to come over to your house it's unstoppable and unenforceable. But it really is kind of a smaller problem then, isn't it?

I agree that this pathetic attempt at damage control by these two frauds reads like the bs lies you used to tell your parents in middle school.

Of course. If they find out about it after the fact. Then they can do something.

What about the literally millions of times it is done and gone?

Unless they can police it during the game, it's left to be......

"If we find out it's gonna be your ass buddy." Pretty weak and it's a nature of the beast anyway.

JMO....YMMV

-

#10 6th December 2007, 1:28 AM

so what u are saying zigzag is that u are endorsing this frudulant behaviour
obv it has not been done millions of times that is so farfetched
by disqualifying the cheaters it shows ppl that they will get caught if they do it

#11 6th December 2007, 1:36 AM

Reserving comment till after Part 2.

#12 6th December 2007, 1:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pantin007

so what u are saying zigzag is that u are endorsing this frudulant behaviour

No sir. I'm saying what I said. It's unenforceable and should be accepted as the nature of the beast.

If not, then an unlucky few will get caught and reprimanded and the rest will laugh to the bank.

That said. If there were a way to enforce it (and there isn't), I would be all for the death penalty for violators.

-

#13 6th December 2007, 6:37 AM

Everyone who has never, NEVER, ghosted another player, please raise your hand. Anyone who has never had a friend "Come sit and play for me while I _________ for a second." (add your excuse here..... go to the bathroom, grab a snack, get the mail, etc.) please raise your hand. Any who has not sat next to your roommate or friend to play a SnG or tourney together please raise your hand. Ever go late into a tournament and have to go to work with 2 tables left and have someone finish it for you? If yes, raise your hand.

Why does everyone have their hand up? You are all just a half step below these 2 people. How dare you all to just rip these guys apart when most of us are no better? Would it have made a difference if he finished 20th instead of 1st? He did not buy the chip leaders account or go trolling for it, he bought the account from a FREIND who had a below average stack.

The first mistake was buying the account outright. Why not just finish it and split the profits. Guess people are not smart on spur of the moment things like this. Their 2nd mistake was lying about it afterwards and letting it get way out of hand (just like every politician caught in a scandel) so people can get so pissed about it. They both are getting punished for it.

There are obvious drawbacks that cannot be monitored or controlled when you are using a computer to play poker. This is just one of those. Is this much different than using computer programs to track everything going on at the table? Everyone is using them. They are taking all the skill of table knowledge away from players and not making them remember a darn thing! Is it a fair field for those who don't have it or want to spend the money on it? Do they need to just so they can catch up? You want to play fair... turn off the heads up display and just use it to track your stats. Turn off your outs calculators, rip off the odds charts sitting next to your computer, then come and talk about cheating or creating an unfair advantage. Until you can create a isolation chamber to log into before you sit down, internet poker will never be a fair and legitimate or true field to play against.

You cannot compare online to live poker and I don't think it is fair to even try. They are the same card game that follow the same rules for winning hands. The difference being online and live poker have completely differnet table rules on how to play since you cannot enforce alot of live rules used.

#14 6th December 2007, 7:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by titans4ever

Why does everyone have their hand up?

Although, I agree on some of this post my hand is still down. When I play it's soley me on my own. No else is around, and I don't have any friends that play.

I'm not thinking that this is extreme as Absolute. Where exactly do you draw the fine line in cheating. Small or large situations might differ, but cheating is still cheating.

This isn't making online gaming looking any better for the gaming laws that are trying to be established.

#15 6th December 2007, 12:18 PM

Don't really care who I'm playing when in a tournament. But when a player change takes place late in one; bringing to the table a completely different style of play, and in this case a good online poker technician, I wouldn't be to happy about it.
Many good players do mix up their play, especially late in a tournament. But it's obvious the replacement player was watching the game in contact with original player. Not that he just flopped into the game late needing time to figure everyone else out.
Having someone play a hand or two while eating or taking a crap is one thing. If I got that far in a million dollar tourney, I would shit myself before I let someone play for me. But bringing in a high level player late into a million dollar tourney is pretty serious.

Every tournament player prays to get that far hopefully at least once a year.

Banning was very much in order here, and all poker sites should have a way to blacklist these guys and ban them from all sites. You get caught you go down, end of story.

#16 6th December 2007, 1:50 PM

I've never had anyone play for me or vice versa. I don't use any 'assistance tools' like trackers, hud's and calculators. Just me and the poker client.

Am I in the minority? (again )

#17 6th December 2007, 2:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by titans4ever

Everyone who has never, NEVER, ghosted another player, please raise your hand. Anyone who has never had a friend "Come sit and play for me while I _________ for a second." (add your excuse here..... go to the bathroom, grab a snack, get the mail, etc.) please raise your hand. Any who has not sat next to your roommate or friend to play a SnG or tourney together please raise your hand. Ever go late into a tournament and have to go to work with 2 tables left and have someone finish it for you? If yes, raise your hand.

Why does everyone have their hand up? You are all just a half step below these 2 people. How dare you all to just rip these guys apart when most of us are no better? Would it have made a difference if he finished 20th instead of 1st? He did not buy the chip leaders account or go trolling for it, he bought the account from a FREIND who had a below average stack.

The first mistake was buying the account outright. Why not just finish it and split the profits. Guess people are not smart on spur of the moment things like this. Their 2nd mistake was lying about it afterwards and letting it get way out of hand (just like every politician caught in a scandel) so people can get so pissed about it. They both are getting punished for it.

There are obvious drawbacks that cannot be monitored or controlled when you are using a computer to play poker. This is just one of those. Is this much different than using computer programs to track everything going on at the table? Everyone is using them. They are taking all the skill of table knowledge away from players and not making them remember a darn thing! Is it a fair field for those who don't have it or want to spend the money on it? Do they need to just so they can catch up? You want to play fair... turn off the heads up display and just use it to track your stats. Turn off your outs calculators, rip off the odds charts sitting next to your computer, then come and talk about cheating or creating an unfair advantage. Until you can create a isolation chamber to log into before you sit down, internet poker will never be a fair and legitimate or true field to play against.

You cannot compare online to live poker and I don't think it is fair to even try. They are the same card game that follow the same rules for winning hands. The difference being online and live poker have completely differnet table rules on how to play since you cannot enforce alot of live rules used.

I completely disagree. There is definitely a distinction between my wife playing a freeroll on my account and me calling up a well know pro to come in a finish the game for me. Of course CV and SM are friends, but it isn't the same thing as a buddy of mine playing for me either: clearly the deal would not have been made if both players didn't acknowledge that there was a skill discrepancy between the two of them-- the deal wouldn't have happened the other way around.

There is a difference too in coaching/teaching situations where a stronger player is watching/commenting on another's play. For one thing they would very likely be a consistent style by playing throughout (as opposed to two completely different people playing at different times). Also, it is likely that the stakes in this situation would be much lower, and while you can argue that it shouldn't matter the fact is that there IS a difference between a coaching situation for learning purposes and a selling of a seat in a Sunday major to well know pro for pure monetary gain.

These to players knowingly did this for profit alone. They knew one player was stronger than the other and hand a greater chance of monetary success. Anyone who believes the "oh, it's really just my love of the game that makes me excited to play deep in tournaments" is an idiot.

As to software like pokertracker and huds, I don't think it really is that great of an advantage personally. And to say "They are taking all the skill of table knowledge away from players and not making them remember a darn thing!" just isn't true in my opinion. The primary function of pokertracker isn't to profile your opponents, it's to analyze your own game. And HUDs are mainly useful for multi-tabling ring games. The claim that people can't play without these tools, or that it somehow damages their game overall because they become reliant on them is simply and totally false.

#18 6th December 2007, 4:53 PM

It's a huge grey hole in the middle of the on-line gaming industry.

As far as calculators and such. I usta use em. Now I find they tend to crowd what little mental capacity I have left.

-

#19 6th December 2007, 10:52 PM

The one thing that was never stated but I really want to know is how much was the account bought/sold for in this instance.

Yes they broke a rule about one seat one person. I don't get where all the real anger is coming from. It was not a trolling expidition from the player to find a buyer or a shark hunting for weak player to sell a seat. This was a quick decision between two friends. I don't think there was preplanning or premeditated events going on here. They both made a mistake that will cost them in the long run. I think they got what they deserved by losing the win and getting banned from FT.

The bigger picture for online touranments is if they don't stop this now every tournament when it gets to the final 3 tables will slow to a crawl as people troll for a buyer to their spot. You would not want to be on a table where 2 or 3 are playing as slow as possible while IMing potential buyers for their stack.

#20 6th December 2007, 11:06 PM

The only thing is, I could have figured out a way to do this without getting caught very simply.

It is not hard to make them think that I am playing from the original computer and this could be abused.

#21 7th December 2007, 12:14 AM

I still think what I did was wrong and I – I feel disgusted at myself.

LOL yeah right, what a frickin liar, the only thing this guy is disgusted about is the fact he got caught, who the hell do these morons think they are trying to fool, what a bull shit artist and not a good one at that, yeah like he really would have given the money back.

#22 7th December 2007, 10:34 PM

the only thing they are sorry about is the fact that they got caught..

#23 10th December 2007, 2:06 AM

check out the chat box in tonight's sunday millions (zangbezan is Sorel Mizzi)

this guy just keeps going off on Sorel... expect a chat ban since it's getting nasty

#24 12th December 2007, 6:06 AM

Update on one of the cheaters:

Mizzi/Vaughn Update – Vaughn Out at Bluff | Poker News

Similar Threads for: Interview with the two cheaters in million tourney. > Texas Hold'em Poker
Thread	Replies	Last Post	Forum	Thread Starter
Missing PS tourney in HM1	2	11th March 2012 10:07 PM	Poker Software & Tools	Colbefc
General tourney strat- shove/fold game	14	23rd December 2011 10:13 AM	Tournament Poker	imwatcher
Playing first live tourney tonight!	17	10th April 2011 7:24 PM	Tournament Poker	Rldetheflop

Play Texas Hold'em Online Poker \| Interview with the two cheaters in million tourney.
Titan Poker are the top poker site on the iPoker network. Use the Titan Poker bonus code CC500 to get a 150% up to $500 Bonus.	PokerStars is one of the best sites to play online poker. Using PokerStars marketing code CCHAT you get a $600 bonus. Note: No US Players Accepted.