I know the right way to play poker, So why dont I play right?

I dont want to start the post sounding arrogant but the fact is that I feel I have a very good grip on how to play winning sng poker. I have read many books and am well versed on ICM as well as +/-Cev play. I browse the hand analysis forum, sometimes even giving my thoughts. I mostly agree with the advice given by the regs but more importantly I understand the thinking behind the decisions.

With all that being said my problem is, if I know the correct decesions, why do I still make the wrong plays? When reviewing hands I often spot errors in my play and wondering wtf I was thinking. It's not usually one specific thing which I think i could fix. Just various random stupidity. I guess part of it may be lack of concentration and I know sometimes I get caught up in the emotions of the game. Am I the only one? is there ever a point where you play flawlessly making the correct decision every time?

It is very frustration to realize that knowing the way to play and playing that way are two totally different things.

I feel exactly the same you know! I can give good sound advice and know how to play a good game, but when i'm playing it seems to go out the window

I do this all the time. I think we all have our weaknesses on this front, in fact.

Mine is the "That's a cheap flop" syndrome. Oh, that's a cheap flop, I'll call with my T3o. Oh, that's another cheap flop, I'll call with my 92o. It doesn't help when my 92o hits a 992 flop and I win a big pot...then I start thinking, "Yeah, lets see MORE cheap flops!"

I've started opening a notepad window while I play that has little reminders in it of things I don't need to be doing.

I have the same problem. Here is what our downfalls is guys:
LACK OF DISCIPLINE!!

Playing under a clock puts most players under pressure. Timebanks are useful but even then there is still pressure not to use up to much of your timebank. We can all work out the odds, the outs and everything else we need to work out when looking at hand histories but during the actual game is not so easy because of the time.

And playing online u dont get much time to think about a crucial pot.

If you ever stop learning in poker, your never going to achieve your potential. You need to constantly work on improving your game. Whether it be adjusting to regs, improoving your ITM play, upping the volume played, upping the amount of time spent reviewing. There's always something you can be improoving on, Hell, i've been playing SNG for years, and today im making a radical change to the way i view the game. I think some players tend to play well for a period of time, then their play becomes stagnant. They continue to make the same plays, they don't bother to review as much. THey get lazy. They might open their range up from 14% to 16%. They might start making moderately bad shoves/calls of shoves etc.

Point is this. Keep learning and improving, i guarantee the best players in the world still learn new things day to day, and constantly work hard at their game.

There are a lot of variables in poker, and we constantly adapt our play depending on many different circumstances. For example, we may play very differently against a loose bully as opposed to a tight, solid player. Stack sizes, structure, position, players' styles, and many many more factors come into play. That's what makes poker so interesting! So the point is we are always varying our play, even if we "know how to play correctly". We play hands we know we should muck, because the circumstances may warrant is sometimes. Often, it does not work out. Even if it does and you play your (example) "trap" perfectly, sometimes your opponent will hit his 4 outer on the river. Lots of variables, lots of luck, things don't always work out, and nobody always plays correctly. It just ain't possible. Even pros make bad plays. It's the nature of the beast. There is often no "right way to play a hand". When you have a full house against quads, you're losing your stack, and there's really nothing you can do about it.

I think some of it comes down to that at the time given how play was going or where you were at in the tournament, it could have been the correct play for you to make. Although, when you are looking through your results and certain hands individually or completely played out, you see a mistake, but if you think of the hand as how it was played before you saw their cards or the board cards, it was a fine play.

Example. On the bubble in a 9 man SnG, so 4 players left. You are on the button with 77 and push with the short stack, say t1500 and for simplicity we will say the other 3 had equal stacks of t4000 with blinds at 100/200. And you are called by the BB who has AJs and the board runs out giving him the win. Looking back on it you might think to yourself, why did I do that blah blah blah, but you made the right move, just didn't work out for you.

My point is that sometimes it's easy to see what you think was a mistake when you're looking at the completed hand instead of everything preflop. That's why when you post hands in the forum for feedback you shouldn't post the final results, because it's going to sway how people think you should have played the hand because they are able to see that you won or lost in reality.

i think we sometimes do plays we would not normally do because of the boredom grinding can give. for example i multi table 10 nl, after 2 hours i get out of robot mode by playing some stupid hand like 54o, i usually lose with this type of hand but it also reminds me why i shouldn't play it, and i get back to my normal game.

I don't want to give any advice, just a little thing to remind you what you already know.

Discipline...! Don't let your emotions turn you off your path...

Situations where something is not going well might bring you off,
...but also if things go well...!
Then you risk more and do thing that are not good, and you know it...!

I maybe do not know much like you, but I a feel that this is your problem.
I play with lot discipline and it helps me even if I lack of more skills !

You still play wrong because you're human... we don't like to lose, but to win overall in poker sometimes you have to give up hands and give up pots that you really want to win. Overcoming your own idiosyncrasies is part of becoming a good poker player.

thanks for the responses guys. I think those talking about discipline are right on the money. I am glad I am not the only one who channels my inner donkey from time to time.

on a side note, whenever I am reviewing a hand I rarely take into consideration the outcome of the hand. thus the 77 shove on the button I know instantly is the right play whether or not I lose the hand. I do however question the Q8 shove sometimes but I am getting past that.

I was just using it as an example, but it can be used for all kinds of situations.

^^^^^^^^^^^^this

When are you going to make a post that DOESENT make sense????

I make some bad mistakes sometimes after hours of relatively solid play and it pisses me off a bit.

But it also helps me to stay sharp and have some stuff to think about when reviewing hands.

My biggest problem is double and triple barreling in spots I shouldn't against bad players

Shocker Wiz gets it spot on.

I know how you feel RTF and pretty sure alot of people here do. JUst to add to what has been said here, an aspect of this and I dont know if your the same is sometimes I played too much poker. Grinding sngs for many hours a day and/or playing to many tables or even too few tables can lead to some questionable plays even when you know mentally your making a wrong move. Apart from that yeah. knowing the basics of playing sngs and things like ICM are great but if your not continuosly trying to improve your game and find every edge that you can your not going to be a great a poker player. Incedently this is probally why I will never even make an average poker player.

Yep, I think we all tend to have difficulty breaking "HABITS" ... the "notepad" idea is a good way to remind us of what NOT TO DO and what TO DO. I'll give it a try. Wally

Yes... quite often I'm certain. Does this guar. results... umm.. not necessarily, lol.
Sounds like maybe concentration is the problem you're having. When I'm playing it's everything off (TV, phone, note on door saying I'm not home, etc.). Other 'stuff' in life taken care of (hopefully) and out of the way before I start. Eat a decent meal, get the coffee on (maybe take a walk beforehand.. maybe watch a few mins. of a sng training vid... maybe read a few pages of a poker book).... then >> headphones on & play!

Certain times I'd consider spots re: whether or not I'm making the 'right play' might be with adjustments made for certain randoms. I don't typically mass multi-table sng's so I usually have decent reads on the other players (sng's I usually only play a few at a time... sometimes only '2'.. mtt's I play more of.. more like 6 at once). One thing for sure during late level play &/or bubble play I will make adjustments for randoms who seem to be unaware/unfamiliar with ICM (I note them as ICMd < ICM dumb... or ICMa.. < ICM aware).

I think if you're reviewing fairly regularly (at least pulling aside certain 'trouble hands') then things just become more intuitive (second nature) & you're making less mistakes. Hey.. at least you're spotting your mistakes (I'm betting that MANY don't even have a clue what mistakes they're making... at least it sure doesn't seem like it on the tables).

Have you watched any decent sng training vids.? (not referring to ones made by break-even players, but more so to the guys who are at the top of the game... but who are also very good at getting their pts. across). I've found Matt Glitlr's SNG vids. to be really decent.

Another suggestion... "TAKE YOUR TIME"... take your time with your decisions. I help out a few players & one thing I find myself telling them often is >>TAKE YOUR F'N TIME!!! (asked one the other day.. "how many times have you used your timebank in the past 2mos.? I bet you it's less than 5times" Their answer, "umm... hmm... never I don't think?").

Sure if you're playing a ton of tables at a time, you're not going to be able to ever take your time... but I dont' think you should be playing a ton of tables if you're finding yourself making a bunch of poor decisions. Take it back to a table or two... "Take Your Time" with your decisions... check out every single hand that goes to showdown... take notes like crazy < your hand-reading skills, intuition, etc. will improve dramatically, resulting in the right decisions the majority of the time.
Get a solid base.. review a bunch (use SNG WIZ & Pokerstove), then gradually add tables (if that's what you're into.. personally I prefer to play MTT's by far... but do play the occassional sng (occassional meaning I've played ~2,000 of them)).

If you're able to pick off the spots where you're making bad decisions (while reviewing, either at the time or later on)... bonus. As I said earlier, many don't even know they are.

maybe my responses to what you're posting is totally irrelevant.. idk Maybe you've got a ton of experience (you've suggested you've done alot of work on it), so wouldn't it just be a focus/concentration thing?

I'm not getting the impression that OP is looking at plays from a 'results-oriented' viewpoint (ie the 77 btn shove example... I mean you could look at that all day long & know it was the right play even if you ran into AA & KK in a 3wy pot).

Maybe if OP outlined what some of the 'mistakes' were.. ie. is it stuff like 3-bet shoving resteal w/o fold equity? ... or what? Is there some similiarities in the mistakes you're making? I know one friend who calls themself "TinCup" because they make some really stubborn-ass calls at times when they know they need to let it go (I'm talking preflop sng play.. not shite like calling down w low pp being married to them or whatever).
Are the mistakes you're making similiar in nature? (or happening for similiar reason.. ie. emotion, ego, lack of focus, lack of giving a shite at the time, etc.)

Oops.. I just read your post over again & find it answers some of my questions, lol... sorry about that. Sounds like a post for Jared Tendler

well yes I do think its mostly a concentration thing. I was up to 6 tables but realized that is just too much right now and am back to 2 at the moment. Watching more videos is definitely something I need to do more. I watch some but clearly not as many as needed. I dont think I have as much experience as some of the others here but I have played over 4k sng's usually the 3-5 dollar variety.

As far as some of the mistakes. Usually its a fold where I should have shoved or a 3 bet shove when clearly the villain was strong.

Just the other day I had a hand in the early levels(15/30) of the tourney I had about 1700. The big stack of the tourney 3x raise from MP player directly behind him player 3 bets making it 200 to go, I am on the button with KK. I make it 550. Original raiser jams his stack and the player behind calls. I tank this thinking one of them has to have rockets. I called anyway and not only did the original raiser have AA but the other player hand the other 2 kings. I've heard several on here say never fold Kings pf but I think if ever there was a hand screaming fold it was here but I called anyway.

One thing that has been working for me is using more of my clock.

NO snap decisions.

I make really bad plays after my brain becomes fatiged after hours of play or whateverand I start moving too fast.

Now Im trying to use more clock and think about each hand befor

The proof is in the pudding, so to speak. If you cant do it then you dont really understand it.

As a non-poker example, I know how to build a nuclear reactor, I know most of the theory behind it. I understand it better than a lot of people... but if you had the money to fund me actually taking on such a project...I'm pretty sure I would fail because as much as I understand about the construction of reactors.. the truth of the matter is I dont understand it anywhere near enough to actually be any good at it.

I think the same is true of poker. You probably understand it more than many, but that dosent mean you fully understand it.

What can get me into trouble is "assumption", and by the river, allowing that "assumption" to become "belief", losing complete focus on what "really" transpired in the hand.
Playing by the book is only half the skill, the rest is in your guts.

My FIVE biggest problems:
Lack of time online to make good decisions (I'm 5x better live)
Playing too many pots due to boredom
Do to playing idiots for years, never crediting anyone with a hand.
Tightning up nearer the money in MTTs
Tilting on table 2 after a bad beat on Table 1

My FIVE biggest problems:
Lack of time online to make good decisions (I'm 5x better live)
Use the timebank. How much time do you really ever need to make a simple decision? The allotted amount of time, with the timebank should be more that enough
Playing too many pots due to boredom
Play more than one table. If you're playing too many hands out of boredom online, then you're playing WAAAY too many hands out of boredom live.
Do to playing idiots for years, never crediting anyone with a hand.
Bad excuse for taking a bad hand too far
Tightning up nearer the money in MTTs
Do the opposite because everyone else is tightening up too, so you're going to benefit from them laying down a lot of hands. I think you already knew this one.
Tilting on table 2 after a bad beat on Table 1
If you're going to tilt then just quit playing altogether for a while that night and start again after you've calmed down.

Thanks! Of course I know all this ...but bad habits come back!
I get entertained by the banter when playing live, and you can look at others playing too.

Also, check out Mike Caro's law of loose wiring.

Over/under on number of days before Interpol shows up at Stu's house?

Stu, are you there? Stu? STU?????

relpraggy, I think they already hit......lol

Even computers, which theoritically should have no flaws, make mistakes. Thus, even machines make mistakes!! Humans, much more so. We cant be perfect every time

I like this post, mainly because I like the idea of some bloke in england building a nuclear reactor, I shall meet you at the carpark with a DeLorean and we are set. Seriously though I think this is a decent way to start thinking about the game.

And so begins my life on the run.