difference between slow play and slow roll

whats the difference between slow play and slow roll? why is slow roll considered bad play?

Slowrolling is when you are already at showdown, your opponent has shown their hand and your actions or words make him believe that he has won the pot, then you show your superior hand and take it away.

Slowplaying is when you have a monster flopped hand (or p/f hand) and you check/call all the way until making a big river raise. You are considered playing the hand slow because you didn't bet out.

slow rolling is also if your opponent makes a big bet or allin and you holding the nuts and take 5 minutes to make your decision to call him .

its not liked very much and seen as bad behavior at the tables.

^ this.

The problem with slow rolling is that you're wasting time that could've been spend dealing the next hand just to rub the other player's face in their loss. As a result, it's generally considered poor form. Unless you're playing Men The Master, in which case I believe slow rolling is pretty much mandatory.

You don't have to be at showdown to slow roll someone. Slowrolling is having the nuts but pretending it's a tough decision to call or fold...

If I flop a royal flush and slowly play the turn and river trying to max out my take, I don't consider it a slow roll until after my oponents chips are all in.

That's not a slow roll, that's a slow play.

A slow roll is when you have pocket aces preflop and someone shoves and instead of calling instantly like anyone with a brain would, you pretend to have a tough decision to make.

It's not a strategic play, it's just stupid.

Wikipedia

slow roll

To delay or avoid showing one's hand at showdown, forcing other players to expose their hands first. When done while holding a good hand likely to be the winner, it is considered poor etiquette, because it often gives other players "false hope" that their hands might win before the slow-roller's is exposed.

So I was at a table the other day with sb and bb involved in the hand. Flop comes something like: 6d 5h 8d. Player 1 goes all in. Player 2 takes a long time to decide whether to call or not. After a bit he shoves and they turn over. Player 1 has hit a set and Player 2 has a low str8.
Player 1 starts complaining that Player 2 was slow rolling.

I pitched in and disagreed cos of the board. What do you think?

It has never really bother me if someone slow rolls me..i do get mad when opponent is all in and the other guys takes 5 minutes to call with the nuts. but the point of poker is trying to get all the money of your opponent whats wrong with pretending that you have a weak hand and hollywooding some

Player 2 certainly has a strong hand but it's also vulnerable to draws (including the one Player 1 has). Maybe he was being overly cautious but I don't think it's a proper slowroll per se.

I think it was a slowroll. There is only one hand that beats player2 so this should be an instant call.

I slow rolled once in a live tourney and did not have the hand I thought I had. The other player mucked before I turned over my cards so I still won the hand, but I only had two pair and thought I had a boat. Both are consider poor sportmanship. CM

if you are playing head and somebody goes all-in why wait to call if you going to call. I agree it is bad sportmanship to do that.

In a cash game, yes, but in a tournament it might not be quite so easy a decision depending on the stack sizes, blinds, players left until the bubble, etc.

For example, suppose you're in a tournament that is on the bubble and you're on the button with less than a big blind left, but there are two others in early positions with about the same chip count as you. Even if you know that villian just has a set, you're only about a 3:2 favorite and it is probably better to fold and hope that one of the other players busts out to put you in the money. Yes, this would be a rare situation, but my point is that there may be times when it's not an insta-call.

I tend to think it's slow rolling only if the villain already knows he's won, but puts on a show to make hero think otherwise before revealing his hand.

Why in the heck would someone slowroll, there is absolutely no advantage to it whatsoever, all it does is piss your opponent off. You've won, show your cards or call. Then you can go home, put your winnings under you bed, and start picking the wings off those little flies you caught this afternoon. If you slowroll, you're an dork.

^^^^ LOL, Interesting Post

I agree wit CAMurray I would do the same thing someone may get mad but why push all in right away or just raise alot when you have the chance of them folding i would rather take them for what i can, isnt that what everyone is in the game for to win????

Recently in one of the league games, I flopped the nut flush. I raised just under 1/2 the pot to give the appearance of either a standard continuation bet or a weakish catch. I got one caller. The turn paired the board. There was still no st8flush or quads possible so I only sweated a boat. The river was a nothing so i only stressed over the boat.

Im sure many will think me a wuss but whem Im in the mood to win, I dont gamble until Ive fully reviewied the hand and the likelyhood of the villan's hand given his HH and stats.

Anyway, I bet .75pot and he insta shoves.

Im putting him on a lesser flush or a boat given my read at the momemt but if Im wrong I will be cripled in the game.

I hit the time clock & looked back over some hands and replayed his 2 ckraise hands and determined he is either on a well played boat or trips.

I called his all in and he was on trips so I felted the bum.

He totally accused me of a slow roll even went as far as posting it in the game thread. Im sure in his mind it was a slow roll b/c he, Im guessing, cant fathom taking so much time to consider the probabilities of where I was in the hand. But for me, in that hand, there was absolutely no malice intended, just good poker in my mind. and Yes, I won that game too.

No I do not think this was a slow roll, I can remember a few games I played in when I was first learning the game and had a "sucker straight" the low end of a straight and lost to someone who had a higher straight, I was so excited to get a good hand that I did not even consider the other player could beat me, I like to think I am a bit smarter now, but in this case I would have had to think a while too with the low end straight, it can be a tough call to make, of course sometimes I have to think a lot anyway, lol.

This is a slowroll.
Why do it? Well.... I've got lots of history with villain & believe they're a total jerkoff & in this particular tourney they proved this over & over.
So why slowplay them while HeadsUp, stooping to their level? Cuz... it felt good. (& I wasn't able to grab them by the throat thru my puter monitor).

Full Tilt Poker Game), - 1000/2000 Ante 250 - No Limit Hold'em - 20:19:24 ET - 2010/07/31
Seat 1: HERO (32,006)
Seat 5: Villain (18,994)
HERO antes 250
Villain antes 250
HERO posts the small blind of 1,000
Villlain posts the big blind of 2,000
The button is in seat #1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to HERO [Ks Kd]
HERO raises to 4,000
Villain: gg
Villain has 15 seconds left to act
Villain raises to 18,744, and is all in
HERO has 15 seconds left to act
HERO has requested TIME
Villain: rogue for the win?
Villain: go Bullets
Villain: hurry
Villain: dont u gots to go
HERO calls 14,744
Villain shows [8h Kc]
HERO shows [Ks Kd]
*** FLOP *** [Qh 7h Kh]
*** TURN *** [Qh 7h Kh] 5♠
*** RIVER *** [Qh 7h Kh 5s] 7♣
Villain: oh slowroll kk
Villain shows two pair, Kings and Sevens
HERO shows a full house, Kings full of Sevens
HERO wins the pot (37,988) with a full house, Kings full of Sevens

^^^

LMAO, nice slowroll PO

Slow play you get admiration and respect from your peers.

Slow roll you get knocked out.

Ha ha ha... good one! I've never had to worry about the latter... I make 'Biggee247' look like smally365.

I wouldn't normally ever intentionally slowroll online... but this guy was a particular ahole who had it comin'. (& will get it again, lol)

For those interested in how to slowroll properly, BTW, here's a lesson from an expert:

http://justinbonomo.com/blog/slowrol...en-the-master/

Some people like a challenge ;P.

Falsely accusing players of a slowroll is one of my biggest pet peeves.

In my mind, you can't really be accused of slowrolling if you don't have the absolute stone nuts. Even if you have the 2nd nuts, there's a chance you could be behind. I've been boated over my nut flush more times than I can remember, so CAM's case of taking his time with the nf after the board pairs is obviously not a slowroll. Now if there is no pair out there, and no sfd, then ok, nut flush is nuts.

Same with PO's KK -- even though he intentionally tried to slowroll it, it's still not a slowroll in my book. There's always AA, and who hasn't seen AA vs KK a hundred times before? Granted, I probably won't ever fold KK pre either, unless it's a DoN/satty near the bubble, but that doesn't mean I won't take a moment to try and eliminate AA from your holdings first.

Some people argue that nuts or not, you wouldn't have folded anyway, so taking time is a slowroll. I disagree, because you don't know what I'm capable of folding. I might have made a soul read on you, or I might just be a wuss when my tourney is on the line, whatever. Zeebo's theorem to the contrary, I have laid down losing boats on at least a couple of occasions I can remember (once to a bigger boat, once to quads). Was it mathematically correct? Probably not, but it felt right (and was right). So don't tell me I'll never fold the 2nd or 3rd nuts. If I don't have the obvious stone nuts, especially in a tournament, I'm going to take as much time as I need to be sure. If someone *thinks* that's slowrolling, well I don't really care.

So when someone does intentionally slowroll.... it's not a slowroll???
you lost me here, LOL

Well, in your case... yeah, kinda. I mean, if that's your definition of slowroll then I guess it would. But in my mind, while it may have been intended as a slowroll, based on some folk's interpretation (mine included) it still doesn't qualify as one even if you called it that.

It's a semantical argument, but since I lost you, let me try to explain my line of thinking: Ultimately, you intentionally stalled. Okay, we agree on that. However stalling, in and of itself, is done for a number of reasons, a few being:

1. slowplaying a big hand to induce action
2. taking time to thoroughly analyze the hand and previous action in order to make the best decision you can
3. to needle or tilt an opponent
4. to give off a false tell
5. to slowroll

Arguably, only the last one is considered an egregious breach of poker etiquette. So it comes down to the definition of the term, which is different to different people. It has to meet certain criteria to distinguish itself from the other stalling tactics. First and foremost, and we can all agree on, is that you are closing the action for the entire hand (e.g. facing an AI). Next, in my interpretation, you must have the nuts -- not simply a hand you're never folding. Therefore claiming that you intentionally slowrolled without the nuts means it couldn't actually be a slowroll to someone who defines the term as I do. It's more of a #3 or #4. Even beyond that, I consider there must be an intent to slowroll. I've probably unintentionally slowrolled someone, because I can recall numerous times where I misread the board or didn't realize I had a flush when I thought I just had a pair, or whatever. But in my mind that's not intentional so doesn't really qualify (although the opponent won't always trust you on that, so to them it'll always be a slowroll).

So I guess the distinction is whether you belong to the camp that includes "stalling on a non-nut hand you'd never fold" as slowrolling. They would see your play as a slowroll. I do not, so IMO it's just another case of running out the clock to needle your opponent. It's annoying, but does not stoop to the level of a slowroll.

The was the point I was attempting to make.

thanks to all who replied to my post you were verry helpful