The best poker player ever?

Undeniably I would have to say Stu Ungar, even though I'm not sure how developed he was in games other than hold'em. He's the only player to have won the main event 3 times... its really sad that he never got to even see the poker boom, I think he would have mopped the floor with the dead money, maybe even made enough at once that even he couldnt gamble/give it away...

Omg, I forgot about that guy. Would LOVE it if he wasn't dead, lol. Yeah, I think you're right, man. I mean I was obviously going to say Phil Ivey. Well, I don't think I was going to actually bother posting it because about 10 other people will probably follow being like "ZOMG PHIL IVEY" so yeah. From what I've read about Ungar though, he seemed to absolutely kill it as far as cardplaying goes. Seemed like a bit of a Rain Man type.

At this moment and time, I have to say the best poker player in the world today would be Phil Ivey... and really we'll never know how Stu would have done in today's poker world, but his table image was aggressive and controlling, he played hands that were unprofitable and turned profit doing it, you look at pros like Phil Ivey, Durrr, Gus Hansen and Daniel Negreanu, it's like you can see how Stu Ungar was described in their play.

A friend of mine is engaged to be married to Stu's daughter Stephanie.

That is a difficult question. Do you mean to ask "The best known pro poker player of all time?"

If so, I will have to say Doyle. He is versed on any and all games and was a hustler from way back when. He has advanced with the times and even admits SS is outdated to todays standard of aggressive play. He also still plays some of the worlds highest limit mixed games and wins.

I dont know much about Stu other than that sub par movie High Roller, but what he did was pretty amazing.

As far as the best poker player player ever, well that would be me.

stu was awesome no doubt about it, but for me he didnt do it for a really long time. a decade? maybe a little more. and the sad thing about it was he mostly lost everything that he had.

for just talent wise and forgot about him losing most of what he won, if i were to compare him to a baseball player id compare him to a albert belle or a dwight gooden figure. dominated the scene but just something held him back like not being there long enough or personal problems.

i like johnny moss myself as a one of the greatest. won in wsop tourns, his peers thought him the best and the cash game stories of him during the 1950s. . . . .priceless.

yeah johnny moss.

I'm going to have to agree with Stu Unger! Really tragic story though.

If you've never seen the movie about him, check it out!

Ill vote for Ivey. IMO Every bit as good as Stu withouth all the demons. I dont think you'll read about Phil being broke in 10 years or anything.

Ah, just as I predicted. Lol :P

Phil Hellmuth told me it was him........

I'm thinking Ivey would be rolling over Stu today.

I've heard a lot of Stuey's friends from back in the day -- Mike Sexton, Billy Baxter, Danny Robison -- say that while Stuey would absolutely love the action available 24/7 today, he most likely wouldn't have adapted to it well enough to play at the level he did then. I'm sure he'd still be a force, but according to them, most likely not to the level of Ivey or Dwan. Especially Ivey who is an all-around great player. Stuey's primary poker game was NLHE and he didn't do well in other poker games.

However to a person they all agree that to this day there has never been a better gin player, and probably never will be since gin is almost dead as an action game, compared to Stu's early days. He was a gin machine, virtually unbeatable -- he had to give up so many spots to his opponents just to get them to play, and even with the handicap he just steamrolled everyone.

I think that Stu would have been able to play with Durrr and Ivey if he had gotten clean... he was very good at adapting and changing his game, but played terrible when he was high or coming off a binge. But really its all up for debate, the saddest thing is that we'll never really know... :/

Zomg! Phil Ivey !11!!

No Doubt, It Phil Ivey to today standard. Ain't no way to compare him to a player from the past. How could we, right.

For Stu Ungar it was easier to outplay his opponents at his time. His aggrostyle was very new for his opponents.
I think Phil Ivey is the best poker player of all time, not the other Phil :-) (Hellmouth with his 11 bracelets)

From what i've seen probably Phil Ivey. But yeah im fairly new to poker.

I had to dig this thread up. Debates like this are fun. Of course its not really possible to fairly compare players from different eras but here's my two cents:

I read the book "One of a Kind" about Stu Ungar and came away amazed. Ungar was a true genius. He was a tragically messed up person but a mental freak of nature and a total action junkie. I can picture him, if he were alive, playing the nosebleeds on FT with Durr, Ivey and the rest. It might take him a bit to adapt to the newer players but I think that in the end he would be a winner. The Kid gets my vote for best ever.

chip reece was the ultimate professional. Ivey will probably surpass him, but he has a lifetime to play yet, so who knows. He might do a tiger woods on us...

ZOMG PHIL IVEY OBV$!~!!

Honestly, it really depends on how you choose to classify the "best". For my money, to be the best you've got to be able to play all the games and be just as good away from the table as you are at it.

As has been pointed out above, Ungar specialised in just a few games and while he may have been godly in them while he was at the table (and could have fared even better today given the way NL has grown) his life away from the table, sadly, wasn't the same.

Someone like Ivey, on the other hand, is the complete package. Same goes for the likes of Chip Reese, Barry Greenstein, Jennifer Harman and Doyle Brunson.

Phil Ivey will win more and more bracelets in the future so it has to b him?

Woah, maybe they can have babies and they'll all become poker gods... But yeah, she's pretty hawt...

Stu's game was gin rummy, no one better there. If question was stated "best card player", he would win hands down. To be able to win at poker without a lot of experience playing is impressive. Being the best at poker he is probably right there with the best of them.

I'm giving a top five:

1. Phil Ivey
2. Stu Ungar
3. Johnny Moss
4. Doyle Brunson
5. Johnny Chan

Imo if Ivey is the Tiger Woods of Poker, then Stu Ungar is Van Gogh, who could paint some of the most beautiful art of all time but who's life was miserable, he took his own life at 37, as he suffered from mental disorders such as severe depression.

Where's Dwan? And who's Johnny Moss anyway? And Chan's mainly a donkament player, right?

" The Kid"............not Kid Poker

Not an all around great player. NLHE is his game, PLO he's pretty good. And he's strictly a cash game specialist, not much of an tournament record.

Level?

One of the all time greats. First WSOP winner (which at the time was composed almost entirely of cash game road players). I believe Doyle considers him the best ever. Moss or Chip Reese, which I would say deserves a spot on that Top 5 list, at least ahead of Doyle or Chan.

He's a high stakes cash player too. Wrote a book about FLE cash games, I think. He plays all the games.

what might be the name of the movie ... what actor played Stu? Wally

Where does Phil Hellmuth come in...he currently holds so many records?

I assume he means "High Roller: The Stu Ungar Story," with Michael Imperioli playing Stu.

A terrible movie, and largely inaccurate by all accounts including the author of his biography Nolan Dalla, so I wouldn't recommend it as an accurate portrayal of Stuey's life. Dalla's book itself, "One of a Kind: The Rise and Fall of Stuey 'the Kid' Ungar, the World's Greatest Poker Player," would be a much better choice.

lolz. Phil is only the greatest poker player in his own little mind.

I say Chip Reese. Stu or Ivey would be my other choices if I didn't like Chip so much.

He didn't play that many tournaments because for a long time he was away from poker & when he did play, he only played the big cash games. But Chip is/was the best all-around player ever IMO.

R.I.P. Chip

Any answer someone comes up with is subjective because the game has changed so much.

When Stu won in 1980 there were only 73 entrants.
When Sty won in 1981 there were only 75 entrants.
When Stu won in 1997 there were 312 entrants.
I would guess that *none* of these players has played a million hands of poker. That's a hard number to get to without multi-tabling online.

In the post-Moneymaker era, the WSOP Main Event has averaged about 6,300 players. Far more of these players have read and studied and applied themselves to the game. They play millions of hands online and know the game thoroughly.
Yes there are donkeys, but there are a lot more sharks than there have ever been in the game.

Phil Ivey winning two bracelets and making the ME final table last year, then winning another bracelet this year puts him on the top of the list in my opinion.
Most poker professionals today point to Ivey as the best poker players in the world, and the worlds has never been this poker savvy before.

Chip Reese was considered one of the best there ever was by guys like Doyle, Johnny Chan and even Hellmuth.
They all agree that had he lived, Unger, would have been an amazing player.

Right now most of the pros in poker consider Ivey to be the best.

And for the guy who asked Johnny Moss was,
he was the very first WSOP Main Event winner (although he was voted in)
They started the tournament at Binions because of Moss.

/thread

Both Chan and Moss are in the Poker Hall Of Fame. Both with back to back wins. To do it two years in a row regardless of the field size speaks for itself. Chan and donkament don't belong in same sentence or paragragh for that matter.

Get a cash game with Chan, let me know how that works out for you.

I agree phil Ivey is the best of all time and also that Ungar had a big advantage only facing under 80 players and his style of play was an advantage against many of the other players. I think "hellmouth" is a great player but wouldn't make the top 10 list.