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  Poker - Is this allowed?
 
  #1  
09-12-2007, 12:31 AM
arkadiy
CardsChat Elite
 
Location: Memphis
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Is this allowed?

Lets say I have a friend who is trying to learn poker a little better.

Can he ask me for advice in the middle of a hand? Or is that considered cheating?
 

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  #2  
09-12-2007, 12:41 AM
dweezel
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Location: Medford NJ
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your kidding me ....right?
  #3  
09-12-2007, 12:46 AM
K4Lic0
Amateur Member
 
Location: NC
Plays at: Bodog, FT
Likes: Hold em'
Posts: 74
Online? Live? Home game? Casino?

I don't see a problem with advice, JUST advice.
  #4  
09-12-2007, 12:47 AM
arkadiy
CardsChat Elite
 
Location: Memphis
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See here is my verdict on this.

If this is not allowed, THEN why are calculators that tell when to call, fold, raise allowed?
  #5  
09-12-2007, 1:19 AM
K4Lic0
Amateur Member
 
Location: NC
Plays at: Bodog, FT
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Who said it wasn't allowed? Also, those calculators ONLY take probability into account. I don't think you could win a tourney by just using a calculator.
  #6  
09-12-2007, 1:20 AM
sgroitoy
Junior Member
 
Plays at: full tilt
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hmm

I wouldnt say it's cheating but it's not cool either..you get it?
  #7  
09-12-2007, 1:25 AM
Dorkus Malorkus
VOTE MCBAIN '08
 
Location: Birmingham, UK
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umm of course it's allowed online, "one person to a hand" is completely unenforcible online, and as such sites have no rule with regards to it.
  #8  
09-12-2007, 1:34 AM
dmtrav77
Junior Member
 
Location: new york state
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Posts: 32
tourney rules say you can not discuss hands in play.!!
  #9  
09-12-2007, 1:36 AM
philthy
Ban Worthy
 
Posts: 3,729
Im teaching my friend how to play poker online. I watch him play and we chat online about the hand after it finishes. If he ask for advice during a had, I tell him to play the hand out the way he thinks is best and then we discuss if afterwards.

I dont think its wrong to help out and give advice, but doing it mid hand is like you're playing the game. You have to let your friend play the hand himself and let him learn what he did right and/or wrong.
  #10  
09-12-2007, 1:40 AM
zachvac
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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I think technically it's illegal, but I don't see anything unethical about it. If this person is also discussing the hand with other people in the hand, THEN there's a problem. But as long as they only have the information you have, hell I don't see why a friend can't dictate what you do, it'd be the same as you sending him the money and letting him play. Unless the friend is also in the hand or has multiple "friends" playing at the table there's a problem. Note that this however is a cash game.

For tournaments, it's definitely unethical to have a person who's in the tournament (even if they busted out already) give advice on a hand. In fact, it was more than mere advice, but this got people to lose a lot of money they won, there's another thread around here somewhere on that (I think the WSOOP but I'm not positive).
  #11  
09-12-2007, 6:01 AM
jeffred1111
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Online + home game for pennies I'd say it's right (altough make sure everyone agrees to coaching in a firendly home game). Any other settings, no.
  #12  
09-12-2007, 6:40 AM
chiefer77
<----makes' bunnies cry
 
Location: ogdensburg new york
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pro's have coaches
  #13  
09-12-2007, 6:53 AM
CubanaD64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefer77
pro's have coaches
Yes, but they never discuss strategy or plays while they are in the middle of a hand, only if they are folded or in between deals.
  #14  
09-12-2007, 7:13 AM
jaymfc
I give up2.....
 
Location: arkadelphia ,ar.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkadiy
Lets say I have a friend who is trying to learn poker a little better.

Can he ask me for advice in the middle of a hand? Or is that considered cheating?
it's considered useless by anyone who knows your game

I imagine there a thousands of people playing , with a friend or whole group of drunks behind them yelling suggestions. as long as your playing one hand , I see nothing wrong with it. I'd be willing to play against two people on one hand.
  #15  
09-12-2007, 7:38 AM
BigWaveDaveO
New Member
 
Location: Portland, OR
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As long as you're not at the same tourney or table you're fine. Give all the advice you want. IMHO.
  #16  
10-12-2007, 1:56 AM
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
 
Location: Australia
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Posts: 2,483
Quote:
Originally Posted by philthy
Im teaching my friend how to play poker online. I watch him play and we chat online about the hand after it finishes. If he ask for advice during a had, I tell him to play the hand out the way he thinks is best and then we discuss if afterwards.

I dont think its wrong to help out and give advice, but doing it mid hand is like you're playing the game. You have to let your friend play the hand himself and let him learn what he did right and/or wrong.
I agree with this - for the sheer educational value, aside from the ethical concerns. Let them play the hands their way, make their own mistakes, and ask you how they could've done it different afterwards. Otherwise, they may as well just watch you play, and ask you questions.
  #17  
10-12-2007, 3:06 AM
Goldog
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Location: palmdale, ca
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I've coached friends, usually playing my money. It never works out.

I'll comment "you probably shudda raised there" then the absolute worst card will fall and they'll auto-raise before I can say anything

Or they're just HORRIBLE and experience every kind of suckout imaginable to win the damn thing. What can you say then?
  #18  
10-12-2007, 10:16 AM
Marko75
New Member
 
Posts: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by arkadiy
See here is my verdict on this.

If this is not allowed, THEN why are calculators that tell when to call, fold, raise allowed?
Are they? As far as I know, most sites DO NOT allow programs that say directly what to do (call, raise, fold). The sole reason why Poker Tracker and PokerOffice are generally allowed is exactly this - those programs do not tell the user what to do, but simply provide them with the statistics (something that you might as well do with a pen and a piece of paper).
  #19  
10-12-2007, 4:18 PM
muddawgg
Advanced Member
 
Location: south carolina
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Posts: 187
if you are teaching someone i would think you are playing with play money . if thats the case i see no harm.
  #20  
10-12-2007, 6:52 PM
arahel_jazz
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Location: Arizona, USA
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Posts: 1,601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marko75
Are they? As far as I know, most sites DO NOT allow programs that say directly what to do (call, raise, fold). The sole reason why Poker Tracker and PokerOffice are generally allowed is exactly this - those programs do not tell the user what to do, but simply provide them with the statistics (something that you might as well do with a pen and a piece of paper).
Hmmm... I wonder what kind of response I would get if I sat down at a WSOP NLHE tourney with a clipboard and notepad to calculate odds in the middle of a hand...
  #21  
10-12-2007, 7:13 PM
zachvac
Tenbob Curse Victim
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
Plays at: Pokerstars
Likes: NL Hold 'em
Posts: 5,397
Quote:
Originally Posted by arahel_jazz
Hmmm... I wonder what kind of response I would get if I sat down at a WSOP NLHE tourney with a clipboard and notepad to calculate odds in the middle of a hand...
People would probably look at you funny, but can anyone confirm whether this is actually illegal or not? Can you bring a calculator?
  #22  
11-12-2007, 6:09 AM
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
 
Location: Australia
Plays at: Full Tilt
Likes: wild deuces
Posts: 2,483
Quote:
Originally Posted by arahel_jazz
Hmmm... I wonder what kind of response I would get if I sat down at a WSOP NLHE tourney with a clipboard and notepad to calculate odds in the middle of a hand...
They'd probably assume they were there to keep track of your side bets

As long as your calculator isn't also a communications device, there's no TDA rule against it. The greater concern would probably be someone else looking at your figures and working out from them what kind of hand you're holding.
 

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