Abuse At Joker Stars

#1 14th October 2007, 11:52 AM

Last night was supposed to go to Foxwood’s in Conn. with two other couples. Plans went out the window, so my loving and caring wife knew I was all juiced to go, and didn’t mind me getting into online poker. She spent her evening with a friend watching a movie and whatever, and totally let me have complete solitude to play. She even served some snacks and refreshments. (Got to love her)

Well, I have never been so abused at joker pokerstars since I started playing poker. I played, five-$215.00, six-109.00, and two-$55.00 sng’s. Played only one game at a time, which took close to ten hours. I didn’t hit the board once, and bubbled five times.

Of the thirteen games I played I was knocked out of nine of them with my opponents needing a draw on the RIVER !!!!!

Lost $1839.00, and bankroll balance down to $110.00. This brought my negative ROI to a new all time high on this terrific home of great poker player’s fn site.

#2 14th October 2007, 12:08 PM

bankroll management?

#3 14th October 2007, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dorkus Malorkus

bankroll management?

Know exactly what you mean about bankroll managment DM. Appreciate the concern, yet consider myself pretty much on top of that.

It just was the way the night turned out, with my wife giving me a night for myself and everything. Was trying desperately to justify spending more time online in the future. Going to clubs and casinos getting to be a pain in the butt.

What I lost last night at PS's was allot of money I know, but was in the budget and part of a thought out plan. Should of pulled out earlier, but stuck to the plan. ( LOL ) Just hate losing any amount of money on anything at anytime. Guess I'm just really blowing off some steam.

Plus, was just starting to gain some head-way at Poker Star's. Just can't seem to pop the negative variance there. A little more then a year at PS's since Party Poker closed to U.S.. where I did very well after several years there. I know it's only a year at Poker Star's, but that should have nothing to do with my game. In fact I know my game has improved based on long time stats both involving live, and online play. Winning a few big tournaments at Party Poker is still keeping my online bankroll positive.

Many people say that as a result caused by the issues facing U.S. players, most of the top players are at Poker Star's, making it a tougher place to win. May very well be, but I found the negative variance of 70% in my defense, caused by bad luck for me, and great luck for my opponents.

In addition, to be fair when comparing PS's to PP, I'm not risking the same dollar amount being much less at Poker Star's. I did come in strong when I started at PS's, but pulled down rather quickly after first impression after a month. And presently still keeping it low.

#4 14th October 2007, 4:20 PM

Just curious...how much and what were you planning to play had you made it to Foxwoods?

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. It's never fun to bubble, let alone 5 times.

#5 14th October 2007, 5:50 PM

My condolences. That sounds terrible. I know tourney play is fun but please remember that tounaments cost a 10 percent surcharge while ring games are raked approximately 5%. That is a huge gap. It is much easier to profit from the cash games.

#6 14th October 2007, 6:04 PM

I know the feeling. Im in debt due to "variance" or jokerstars. I think I lost over $700 playing headsup .25/.50 with people throwing their whole stacks in on draws and ALWAYS hitting. I think I played 5 matches in a row where my QQ/KK/AA/AK/AQ hit the board or tripped up but some1 called all in on only a draw to hit the river.

#7 14th October 2007, 6:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smd173

Just curious...how much and what were you planning to play had you made it to Foxwoods?

As far as how much I was prepared to lose had I made it to Foxwoods is completely irrelevant. Spending an evening and a full day with me at the poker tables, and my wife on the slots, could have been much worst then what I lost last nigh on Joker Star’s. Of course providing the amount of money that anyone including myself may lose is acceptable, and knowing before going into any gambling game, it could happen.

Had I decided to play slot machines all night, I no doubt would even expect to lose whatever I brought. We all play poker knowing that too is also gambling. But with experience and the development of a talented good game, you should be able to compete with a slight edge most of the time in your favor. Of course we all expect negative variance in poker, along with just bad luck runs as well as vis versa.

I will usually out of 13 attempts win, place, and show at least one time each, which will hold losses to a minimum. Anything more then that will usually show a modest profit for the days work. My rant is how it was lost last night not necessarily the amount. If I put my money on the felt, I’m prepared to leave without it, even in the virtual sense. But last night to get thrown on the rail nine times to suck-out’s on the river, is a bit much.

#8 14th October 2007, 6:21 PM

You should all move to FullTilt.

#9 14th October 2007, 6:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dorkus Malorkus

bankroll management?

aw you're no fun

#10 14th October 2007, 7:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Know exactly what you mean about bankroll managment DM. Appreciate the concern, yet consider myself pretty much on top of that.

Obviously not. (sorry to be harsh)

Your BR to start was $1949. One $215 SNG entry was 11% of that in the beginning. Not good BR management. Starting at or below the $55-$109 buy-ins would have been a better choice.

Enough said. Hope you learned a good lesson from this.

#11 14th October 2007, 7:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSticker

Obviously not. (sorry to be harsh)

Your BR to start was $1949. One $215 SNG entry was 11% of that in the beginning. Not good BR management. Starting at or below the $55-$109 buy-ins would have been a better choice.

Enough said. Hope you learned a good lesson from this.

Before you comment on bankroll management you would need to know what the bankroll is. Cash on hand at the site was only $1949.00, because I could only max deposit $1,000.00 dollars every 24 hours. I never play beyond my means. Got that out of the way about 20 years ago.

And yes, I did learn a lesson from this. Joker Stars is loaded with fish driving the negative variance way beyond where it should be.

Love the way everyone wants to put a spin on the facts. Nothing was wrong with my BR management coupled with playing great poker.

#12 14th October 2007, 7:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arkadiy

You should all move to FullTilt.

#13 14th October 2007, 7:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Before you comment on bankroll management you would need to know what the bankroll is. Cash on hand at the site was only $1949.00, because I could only max deposit $1,000.00 dollars every 24 hours. I never play beyond my means. Got that out of the way about 20 years ago.

And yes, I did learn a lesson from this. Joker Stars is loaded with fish driving the negative variance way beyond where it should be.

Love the way everyone wants to put a spin on the facts. Nothing was wrong with my BR management coupled with playing great poker.

To be fair, you did say "bankroll balance down to $110.00," implying that the money you lost plus the remaining $110 was the entirety of your bankroll.

#14 14th October 2007, 8:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aliengenius

To be fair, you did say "bankroll balance down to $110.00," implying that the money you lost plus the remaining $110 was the entirety of your bankroll.

Should I deposit $1,000.00 dollars a day for five days in a row before I sit at a table ????????????
What I played with on hand is exactly what I planned. Tonight at 7:00, I would make another deposit if I want to play. Suppose I want to play four $215.00 buy-in sng's tonight, should I wait a week till my bankroll mathematically makes sense, with what is on hand at the site ????? I'm unable to deposit more then $1,000.00 dollars a day, since the UIEGA. If i was going to play a marathon online for a weekend now, I would be forced to make on site cash provisions in advance.

Not playing cash games. SNG's and MTT'S

Just ranting about Joker Star's. Why does there have to be something wrong other then what took place with how I lost ????

#15 14th October 2007, 8:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Should I deposit $1,000.00 dollars a day for five days in a row before I sit at a table ????????????
What I played with on hand is exactly what I planned. Tonight at 7:00, I would make another deposit if I want to play. Suppose I want to play four $215.00 buy-in sng's tonight, should I wait a week till my bankroll mathematically makes sense, with what is on hand at the site ????? I'm unable to deposit more then $1,000.00 dollars a day, since the UIEGA. If i was going to play a marathon online for a weekend now, I would be forced to make on site cash provisions in advance.

Not playing cash games. SNG's and MTT'S

Just ranting about Joker Star's. Why does there have to be something wrong other then what took place with how I lost ????

Calm down. I understand your point: I was just trying to explain to you why
previous posters gave you BR advice that you were not really looking for/didn't need.

#16 14th October 2007, 8:46 PM

No problem Ag, still blowing off steam.

#17 14th October 2007, 8:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

No problem Ag, still blowing off steam.

No problem-- I have felt your pain: losing is hard to do, I know, I suck at it too.

#18 14th October 2007, 9:20 PM

13 game losing streak.... Hmm, I think I've had 9-10 game losing streaks, with a lot of them on the bubble. I dont think this is anything out of the ordinary to be honest, in fact I know it definately isn't. Top online sng pro's can go a 1000 game streaks at break even rate. If playing perfect poker is your aim and being rewarded, then sng's isnt the place for that. Variance in these games is too high. Most ppl are playing these games to a predefined ICM strategy. They play a high volume of games for relatively low +ve ROI's. There pushing all in with 52o, 94o A3s etc etc in the latter stages because ICM dictates it. Therefore when your calling with AK, KQ. TT etc and get outdrawn your thinking major travesty. This is what SNG's are all about like it or loathe it.

#19 14th October 2007, 10:10 PM

Going back several years, I to have played several thousand SNG's. Losing 13 games in a row is also no surprise.

My post is not about losing 13 sng's in a row, it's a rant on how 9 out of the 13 of this particular losing streak was lost to a river suck out, and the horrible play taking place that led to it on Joker Stars. Being outdrawn is no major travesty, and expected especially with many outs. But last night it was just horrendous play, by horrendous players.

#20 14th October 2007, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Before you comment on bankroll management you would need to know what the bankroll is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Lost $1839.00, and bankroll balance down to $110.00.

Sorry for the misunderstanding, but I'm sure you can see why I raised the BR management point.

#21 14th October 2007, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Lost $1839.00, and bankroll balance down to $110.00. This brought my negative ROI to a new all time high on this terrific home of great poker player’s fn site.

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Before you comment on bankroll management you would need to know what the bankroll is. Cash on hand at the site was only $1949.00, because I could only max deposit $1,000.00 dollars every 24 hours. I never play beyond my means. Got that out of the way about 20 years ago.

And yes, I did learn a lesson from this. Joker Stars is loaded with fish driving the negative variance way beyond where it should be.

Love the way everyone wants to put a spin on the facts. Nothing was wrong with my BR management coupled with playing great poker.

You already said what your bankroll is. Was that a lie or did you mistype? Is your BR $110 or not? If you want to rant, at least get your own facts correct.

Then blaming "Joker Stars" for your loss doesn't really make things look any better.

Also, it seems to me like "everyone who wants to put a spin on the facts" are the ones trying to help you. By posting here, you had to expect some replies of this type. Or did you expect everyone just to say "Yeah, JokerStars DOES suck!" ? If you don't want varying replies to your rants, start a personal blog at Blogspot.com. That's what I did. If someone leaves a comment on my blog that I don't like, I can delete it.

#22 14th October 2007, 11:18 PM

joker pokerstars huh? more like.. poker stars

zing!

#23 14th October 2007, 11:27 PM

As I read it, he has a large BR, but only had 1900 on site when he started playing. Total BR could be any size. Could be millions.

Most of us think our br is what we have at any particular site. Definitely true for me. Perhaps he has been withdrawing for years, and has pocketed 50K, in which case he can afford it.

Still, blow off all the steam you need to quads, you paid for it......

#24 15th October 2007, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dj11;636859
[[I

Still, blow off all the steam you need to quads, you paid for it.....[/i].

Thanks dj11. Finally someone that understands. Here are some actual facts of my past play online. "Actual Facts Playing Online Poker"

#25 15th October 2007, 1:28 AM

playing on PS is so hard with the amount of players out there now, i've won in the past at PS but ever since the BIG POKER BOOM is very hard to even make a final table, let alone not get busted on the bubble, been there so many times i stopped counting LOL....KEEP THE FAITH

#26 15th October 2007, 1:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

But last night to get thrown on the rail nine times to suck-out’s on the river, is a bit much.

I can totally relate to that. I went through about a week recently when I couldn't win to save my life. If I wasn't card-dead, I was getting sucked out by 2-3 outters when I was all-in with the best of it. When that happens, I just log out and walk away from it. If you keep trying to grind it back, it just messes with your play (for me at least).

I'm on a little upswing, and I am doing my best to practice good br management (a longtime problem of mine). It seems to be helping--quite a bit actually.

Good luck to you quads. Hope things turn around for you soon.

#27 15th October 2007, 1:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quads

Know exactly what you mean about bankroll managment DM. Appreciate the concern, yet consider myself pretty much on top of that.

It just was the way the night turned out, with my wife giving me a night for myself and everything. Was trying desperately to justify spending more time online in the future. Going to clubs and casinos getting to be a pain in the butt.

What I lost last night at PS's was allot of money I know, but was in the budget and part of a thought out plan. Should of pulled out earlier, but stuck to the plan. ( LOL ) Just hate losing any amount of money on anything at anytime. Guess I'm just really blowing off some steam.

Plus, was just starting to gain some head-way at Poker Star's. Just can't seem to pop the negative variance there. A little more then a year at PS's since Party Poker closed to U.S.. where I did very well after several years there. I know it's only a year at Poker Star's, but that should have nothing to do with my game. In fact I know my game has improved based on long time stats both involving live, and online play. Winning a few big tournaments at Party Poker is still keeping my online bankroll positive.

Many people say that as a result caused by the issues facing U.S. players, most of the top players are at Poker Star's, making it a tougher place to win. May very well be, but I found the negative variance of 70% in my defense, caused by bad luck for me, and great luck for my opponents.

In addition, to be fair when comparing PS's to PP, I'm not risking the same dollar amount being much less at Poker Star's. I did come in strong when I started at PS's, but pulled down rather quickly after first impression after a month. And presently still keeping it low.

I only read the first paragraph but I don't think you knew what Dorkus was talking about After the first $500 lost I would probably stop. But hey, thats just me

#28 15th October 2007, 12:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by quads
Lost $1839.00, and bankroll balance down to $110.00.

Sorry for the misunderstanding, but I'm sure you can see why I raised the BR management point.

Sorry DM and to everyone commenting on BR management. My mistake in OP was stating BR down to $110.00 I should of stated cash on hand at site down to $110.00, not BR.

It's a new day and woke up with all the steam cleared out of my head. Re-read this post and realized I was typing in a fit of anger yesterday. (tilt)

Didn't play one hand of poker last night. Gonna take advice from juiceeQ, and break for week. If home for the weekend will give another go of it.

P.S. Damn, you got to be on your toes when posting here.

#29 15th October 2007, 12:30 PM

I should have stepped in cause I knew what you meant having read a lot of your previous posts.

Anyway - fresh day, fresh week. You have won plenty of money playing online, this was just a bad night for you. Got to look at the big picture and you are way up overall.

After your break hopefully you will have a good run.

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