Suited connectors

As time progresses, it seems that people are falling in love more and more with suited connectors, especially near the middle of the deck (such as 78s). The theory is, these hands have the potential to hit a huge hand and in general, it opponents would not put you on such hands. However, with more and more people adopting the strategy of playing such hands, it seems that more and more people (rightfully) are including those hands in the range of hands that an opponent could have. I used to play suited connectors all the time, even raising with them at times, but following losses on many whiffed flops and minimal winnings when I did actually hit a big hand, it got me thinking as to whether or not it is actually worth it to play the mid-level suited connectors. In the end, I determined that in general, especially when out of position, you are far better throwing your hand away for several reasons (for these purposes, let's assume the hand is 78 suited):

1) You don't want to keep putting money in with a draw, which you will need to if you want to experience the benefits of playing the hand. You will flop a flush less than once in 118 flops, yet making a flush is still considered to be one of the major hands that 78 suited can hit. Therefore, it is generally necessary to see a turn and potentially a river in order to make your flush. While you will sometimes see free cards, good players will usually make you put money into the pot to see the additional cards. Also, the odds of flopping a straight is about 1.3%, so in general, you're missing the flop.

2) Unless you are really good at extracting chips with a made hand, you will lose money in the long run. With the 2 suited cards, you will make a flush once in every 15 hands you play with suited cards once the river has been dealt. Even if you're limping in preflop, chances are that your hand will not go anywhere, so when it does, you better be able to get people to put in a whole lot of money with a marginal hand. Additionally, this is probably harder than it seems, because once the flush hits the board, the chances of someone else putting in a whole lot of money with a hand worse than yours is unlikely (this would generally only happen if they have a lower flush, which is unlikely, since yours is only an 8 high flush).

3. You could lose a ton of money even when you make your hand. As I mentioned before, you need to make a ton of money just to make up for the times when you miss your hand. However, you need to make even more than that to make up for the times when you make a big hand and lose to an even bigger hand. Keep in mind, if you make a flush, it is only an 8 high flush. Therefore, there are 6 higher flushes that could be made. However, in order to make up for all of the times when you miss your hand, you need to get a ton of money into the pot when you do make your flush, even if you suspect that you might be beat. As a result, you are going to start running into higher flushes or full houses, which can cause you to lose even more money. Making a hand like a flush or a straight can look deceptively strong, even when they are actually very far away from being the nuts.


As a whole, play these hands with caution, if at all. And you absolutely must be willing to bluff if you miss your hand. If there is a scare card on the river that actually misses you, you can't afford to just give up on the money that you put in waiting for the draw that you missed. However, if you were going to bluff, did you really need to do it with the 78 suited? Consider all the different hands that you could bluff with, yet you've been forced to do it in this spot when your opponent could be very strong.

Thoughts?

I agree that a lot of times you end up losing more then winning when you hit the flush with mid suited connectors. I'd much rather hit the straight then the flush with these cards because I'll be a lot more confident that I have the best hand in such a case. Secondly if you flop the flush you have to bet out in order to sniff out the higher draw and be willing to fold if that deadly 4th suited card does hit...

Granted the potential to lose money, probably outweighs (largely outweighs) the potential for profit, BUT BUT (big butt) it is almost necessary for you to show that you are capable of playing not only suited connectors, but merely connectibles, on occasion. It will pay off bigger hands when you bet larger, as it puts doubt in the minds of your villains.

So position, and the ability to much these hands, regardless of what you have already done in the hand are paramount.

A trick is to wait till you feel the table is asleep, and then run a few hands using connectibles. Any resistance, and your done. Calls are caution flags, and if you miss the flop or turn, ditch em.

IMHO anyway.

i love suited connectors as starting cards. great to bust an overpair. but do be careful you can always end 4 flushing and losing a big pot.

It is considered that SS are very good cards for stealing blinds,but i play them very carefully,especially against loose players(only J10 or higher)

Generally... i will play these hands if i can only limp in or if there are 4 or 5 callers to a smaller raise. You have pretty much covered all the problems with these hands... But the benefits of hitting them once out of 4 times with the 4 or 5 callers is very high... I think people put to much value on going to a heads up battle with a high raise, which generally means the person will have a very strong starting hand, and will lose.

So basically my strategy is to call with them if there are a lot of people or i can get in cheap to see a flop... but i don't always play them...

1.) what are SS?

2.) people playing J 10 or higher? wouldn those be the tight players?

Oh,of course suited connectors. No,I don't think it's a tight play when there are 3 or more aggressive players at the table(i don't mean short tables)

i'm not a huge fan of playing them. i play pretty tight, sometimes i feel when my raises and bets are getting a lot more folds than anything, and i want to seem a little more lose i'll try to stick it out with them. then again, i'm pretty tight

I dont play tourneys so I cannot really comment and I would think very strongly they are not that strong of a hand in a tourney, but in cash games you have some pretty big flaws in your thinking.

SC can certainly be played profitable, how usually depends on who you are playing but it can certainly be done. These are only the direct benefits I am talking about as well, when in reality the extra value you get out of your big hands because these hands are in your range probably outweigh these.

Probably the biggest key and things some beginners do wrong is to just call these hands, especially OOP. These are not good hands OOP, and especially to a raise OOP as its just so difficult to keep pots you want small and to get a stack when you dont. So the key is to play these hands aggressively, come in for a raise or for a 3bet against people that fold to much preflop and be in position. Dont play hoping to flop a straight or flush, play the hand because you can get in good equity spots and you want to play as many hands as you can in position. When you do get a draw, its more times than not, essential you play it like the nuts. People dont want to play for stacks with TPGK type hands so make them fold. Obviously there are players who dont fold third pair, so play according(and actually these hands are much worse vs these players and hands like KJ are way better).

So in general, play them in position for a raise(or reraise) and play them aggressively post flop. If you have 78s and raise from button and get called by BB and flop is AT3r bet, they think you have an ace. Obviously over simplified but you dont need a flush to win the hand since you are in position.

Also, very importantly, make sure you have deep effective stacks. if someone has 15bb then there are much better hands to attack them with, the deeper the better here.

Looking at my PT I am winning with every suited connector except 34s and 56s, and all suited gapper except 46s and 8Ts. Non suited connectors are similar as well. My sample is only ~50k ish as my old computer fried a few months ago but I highly doubt this is all positive variance. Again, keep in mind the main benefit of these hands is most likely widening my range and increases value of all my better hands.

The point of suited connectors is not to hit big made hands. The point is to hit hands with good equity on the flop because you have a lot of outs. That allows you to play those hands aggressively, which makes them profitable as fold equity + equity when called combined become positive.

Suited connectors do hit flops often enough when you understand that hitting the flop means flopping a hand with decent equity and not simply flopping the nuts.

IMHO, good for mixing your range and it really comes down to your post-flop play and reads on your opponents. 78 suited may be the best hand w/o hitting the nuts HU but in a loose game, its about extracting value from other as you draw to the nuts.

from the sound of the OP, this is more in the context of cash games more than anything?

I love playing suited connectors. If you hit, it pays great and the hand is easy to mask.

If you don't hit it is an easy hand to get away from.