Sets in $10NL

Hey guys, having one of those annoying nights where I'm flopping sets left and right but getting paid off on none of them. I'm a big believer in betting out with a set in $10NL, so it makes it easier to stack on a later street, but tonight everyone seems to be folding to a small bet, even with 4 or 5 players in the pot and an ace on board, stuff like that. Just wondering what opinions are about slow playing sets in a $10NL game if the tables seem to be tighter than normal, I hate giving free cards but in this situation would it be more profitable?

If the board is really dry you can slow play the sets against one or two players. You're hoping that someone's A/x hand hits an Ace on turn or river. But with an Ace on the flop you have to bet.
Of course, when this happens you'll run into the overpair hands that are trying to slow playing you, and then they get scared by the turn and/or the river so you can't get their stack in.


You're not limping pre-flop with your pocket pairs before you hit he set are you?

Bet or be stacked.

It sucks to not get paid off with a big hand.

I really sucks to let your opponent catch up for free and chomp your stack.

On a draw heavy board you dont want to give free cards for a few reasons
1) You dont want to get away free cards to beat you and
2) If they are drawing they will only stack off if they get there.
3) If they are not drawing and have like a top pair hand they wont put too much more money in the pot if ugly cards come on the turn and river.

If there is more than two other people in the pot you really dont ever want to give free cards. Someone is going have something in most cases and someone can make a hand to beat you with free cards.

On a dry board you can slow play heads up but I like to bet out most of the time because it help when try to put them on a hand to know how much they will pay off.

i never slow play anything ever

perhaps the absolute nuts, but i have learned my lesson letting them catch their cards, then what? fold or call and lose half my chips

one thing to think about, is that lately i have adopted a smallball approach alot more
i dont mind picking up 4 or 5 big blinds in each hand
granted i am not stacking people like normal, but i also am not getting stacked

i have really committed myself to alot of hours, plus alot of tables and since i have been trying to keep pots smaller but take more of them
that isnt to say i that i advocating not trying to stack a villian with a set, i just mean that i dont mind taking down a smallish pot, since i am putting in the volume to make smallball profitable

When my big hands aren't getting paid off, I start opening my range to get paid more often. This achieves two things. I may not win big pots but I win more small ones. Also, if the players do finally adjust I can hopefully pick up a huge hand and snap them off when they play back at me. This has to be done with some caution but imo, is something you should be doing anyway adjusting to the way the table plays

Make sure you're not donk betting your sets. For example lets say you flatted a preflop raise out of position (you're in the SB for this example). You hit your set and there are three in the pot. You do NOT lead out in this example, a check-raise is standard and check-calling MIGHT be appropriate if you know your opponent will for a fact double-barrel or commit themselves.

Sounds like paradise. just make sure you also bet when you don't hit and you'll be making a fortune...

Seriously, at a table that folds too much, just play more aggressively and make your money that way instead of getting your big hands paid. It's certainly not typical 10nl, but you have to adjust to your tables.

Alot of times I do limp preflop with small/medium pairs, especially from early position, is this bad? Isn't the goal to see a flop as cheap as possible in a multiway pot?

Wouldn't this be a spot where you don't want to let a free card come off though? For example say the flop was and I had in the SB in this example, I have to bet in this spot right? Or am I actually far enough ahead right now to risk them both checking behind? If it's a dry board this makes more sense to me though, thanks!

I'd bet a standard bet and see who comes along and if you get a couple callers out of the 5 handed pot then pop it alittle more on the turn becuase the more chips they put into the pot the more committed alot of players get at these types of levels then if they come along to the turn pop it pot on the river and youll get paid off a little better

This leads to the donk bet that Icemonkey9 was referring to. Basically, it's pretty obvious that you're drawing to something big, so people are less apt to pay you off. A small pot with a lot of people in it is trouble, which is a big reason why you're not getting action post flop when you hit.

You want to open with your small pairs like 6/6. This builds a bigger pot with fewer callers *and* disguises your hand because you could be making the same play with premium hands. This helps you steal post-flop, and gets people to call with better hands that they are a lot less willing to give up on (against fewer players) when they do hit.

Just remembered something else I wanted to ask about but forgot to put in the OP. Flopping a set on a one-suited board. (Isn't it called monotone or something like that?) Alot of times fishys will make it obvious if they do have the flush by minraising/flatting really quick after you throw out a continuation bet that will make me suspicious, but not always. What can you look for to try to recognize who might already have the flush? Also, do you throw out a standard ~2/3 or ~3/4 pot bet if you're one of the first to act, or do you bet closer to the pot to ensure you're not giving the correct odds for people to draw to their flush?

Yeah, but chasers do that as well. In the micros you can expect to be called on the flop and turn by a chaser if he's drawing to the nut flush. But he won't call on the river unless he hits.
On monotone flops you want to make getting a call by a draw a bad decision by giving improper odds, but you still want to bet enough to get his money into the pot with those improper odds. The worst thing you can do is let him draw for free. A 3/4 pot bet seems fine to me. But this is assuming that you raised pre-flop so you're only up against one or two callers. Against four limpers or whatever, you're on shakier ground because someone's 3/4s might have just hit gold. The more people in the pot, the trickier the situation, and the less willing you should be to build a big pot without something close to the nuts.


FYI, the odds of flopping a flush when you have two suit hold cards is 118 to 1.

By that abomination of a statement I meant that you want to bet enough to get him to call with improper odds. You do not want him to fold. You want him to make a mistake by getting too much money in with improper odds.

No. You want to raise from early position. You're doing this to get money in the pot, get rid of trash hands, and set yourself up for a killing when the flop hits you. You don't want multiway pots. Raising up your PP PF gets rid of junkers. Think of it as seed money.

Look at this hand:

http://www.cardschat.com/f50/100nl-f...butter-139654/ (http://www.cardschat.com/f50/100nl-fr-bread-butter-139654/)

villain is probably set mining. 7 times out of 8, he does not hit his set and gives me $6, for a total of $42. The 8th time, he hits his set ... BINGO ... unfortunately, the range of hands I raise in position is not very strong as you can see, and so when he does hit his set, I don't pay him off beyond my raise and cbet, which is $15 in total. So in the end, his set mining lost him $27 over 8 hands.

This is called punishing limpers, and as soon as you move to non micro stakes, that's what happens to 90% of the hands.

Sorry Belgo but this also can happen. That must have hurt.

(http://www.cardschat.com/members/belgosuisse/) BelgoSuisse (http://www.cardschat.com/members/belgosuisse/) vbmenu_register("postmenu_1044878", true);
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Dream flop, then ... Raising river might have been a bit of spew here. Still up 3 buy-ins for the day so far, so no big deal, i guess

Pre-Flop: Hero is MP2 with 6 6
2 folds, Hero raises to $3.50, 3 folds, SB calls $3, BB folds

Flop: ($8) 6 Q Q (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB calls $5

Turn: ($18) K (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $13, SB calls $13

River: ($44) 7 (2 players)
SB bets $30, Hero raises to $78.50 and is all-in, SB calls $48.50

Results: $201 pot ($3 rake)
Hero showed 6 6 (a full house, Sixes full of Queens) and lost (-$100 net)
SB showed K Q (a full house, Queens full of Kings) and won $198 ($98 net)

actually no, it didn't hurt. I'm really past caring about results when i like the way i played the hand. Also, I was on a boomswitch and this was the only nasty spot of the session, so no big deal.

Thanks alot for the input guys. It all makes alot more sense to me now, there's only one thing I'm confused about. In these examples (100NL or around there) I can see why isolating one player and betting him off the hand is more profitable, because alot of times even when you hit the set you aren't gonna be able to stack them anyways. At those stakes a player will actually understand when to fold or not, and stealing becomes a bigger factor. But wouldn't 10NL be a better spot to keep 3 or 4 villains in the pot, because if any one of them hits TPTK or something there's a decent chance you can stack them or atleast cripple their stack a bit. It seems to me like keeping the ace rags along to see the flop is actually +EV in 10NL, becuase then you can let them make a mistake overplaying their weak pair of aces when you have the set. Or should the mindstate be the same as it would be at 100NL?