Pocket nines or tens on a button.

Would like to know third opinion on specific situation, which is:

Live cash, full ring, say above 100BB.

2-4 limper's, on a button you get pocket nines or tens.
I tend to raise here 4-6xBB to get as less as possible people in a hand and to get idea where do I stand with my medium pair. If someone 3bets me I easy lay it down, case is closed. But say If I get BB called and late position limper called. With flop that has no overcards to my pocket. For instance:
Flop:


BB check, Late position limper check, I bet like 2/3 of the pot. BB call, Late position call. So here I'm thinking that opponents range might be something like straight draw, two overcards, small pairs.

Turn:

BB check, Late position check, I'm happy to see deuces full of nines or tens, supposedly thinking I'm good here I bet half the pot. BB moves all in for the rest, Late position folds and I call.

River:

BB flips over JJ, I lose the pot.

So here is a question: Is it possible to avoid such outcome and put opponent on a bigger pair? Basically its only regarding 1010+JJ if you hold 99 and Jacks if you hold tens, cause bigger pair more likely to re-raise my initial raise. Check the turn I can't cause he might be chasing with overcard, knowing he is quite fishy guy.
If limp in on a button the same story continues, cause no overcards on a flop, only the pot might be not so big.

Any thoughts ?

When you say live game... we need more details. The 1-2 is much different game than the 5-10. Every game is situational, so rounded should you be as to react to the situation you put yourself in. What does this $ mean do this individual? In the case of high stakes... it usually means more the player than the lower stakes (not always), but you must think of the other players' psychology when making complex deductions.
Stix

That was 2/5 in given example. But I see your point, Thank you.

All-in after the flop and before the Turn. Will be interesting to see input... good post, Wally

I'd say you were doomed as it was next to impossible to get away from that hand. It's like having pocket Kings against pocket Aces pre flop. Don't think you're folding the cowboys.....

i agree theres no way you can put him on that with no reraise at all but on the flop when he calls you can sort of guess that hes has a bigger pair than you he wouldnt make that move with ace king or ace queen......or even a deuce....so he has to have pair and its clearly good enough to shove on that board given your betting pre and post flop.....plus the only pairs that have him beat are queens kings and aces.... hes not going to shove with anything less than jjs

yeh sux to against JJ there, generally people re-raise with JJ so he played it tricky and got somewhat lucky i guess, since you can have QQ-AA here as well,

You haven't given any reads on the player so it's hard to say much.

It looks like you narrowed his range down to almost no overpairs because there was no 3-bet pre so basically there's not much you can do here. The fact that he showed up at the very top of his preflop flatting range is just unlucky.

Seems like "bullishwwd" has the right solution in this case. All in on a flop against regulars should work somewhere 50% of the time, unless they have read. It would be difficult for them to call with Jacks knowing I did substantial preflop raise.
Thank you guys.

overbetting the pot on the flop is generally bad especially when you have a lot of money behind. especially on a dry board like 322r.

generally you'll be minimizing your wins when you are ahead and maximizing your losses when behind.

I think if you want more specific advice to put in more details on villians what type of players they are ect.

As you described if everyone had 100BB it might be tough to call 65BB in a 60BB pot if you think villan is a tight player.... Now if he is loose aggressive then maybe you can. If we get more specifics on size of stacks and aggression level helps give better advise.


Generally it is very difficult to read bigger pocket pair especially when villian slow plays it like he did... On the up side is when you have AQ or KQ villian just gave you chance to draw out


Just curious, what do you think he could have that he is risking all of his chips on a board that has 3, 2, 2, 2 on it?

I put him on small pair under nines, knowing he is loose aggressive.