Omaha paired boards

I've been looking at the FH draws for Omaha with paired boards. This applies to micro limit more than higher limits. Also Omaha offers much more opportunity to make FH's than Hold'em that these situations come up way more often.

I'd like someone like Baubid1 to talk about the math of these plays, I don't make any claim to be an "expert" so critical analysis of my thinking is welcome. Neither am I getting into the betting of these hands or the villain reads, anyone who wishes to discuss those topics is welcome.

Let's look at an example
You on BB with unraised board and 2 limpers


Flop:
Turn:
river:
This is the "idiot" end FH (named after the idiot end of the straight): So you have the 4' full of 7's FH, but you are dominated so easily by a number of hands 7k, 7j, 74, KK, JJ, even 77. I've seen these type of hands crushed so often they almost seem worthless. So you raise after the turn and in turn are re-raised, I'm thinking 4 out of 5 times you are beat by K7 or KK. If the villan calls then he is either slow-playing or has another pocket over pair and wants to see the river. Yes he could be bluffing, but in Omaha the half-way good players have made their hand, a really good or really stupid player may bluff.

"Safe" FH boards, the best FH hand is the one-of -each over card
Say Pocket KQ with a KKQ board, that's the nuts and there's no beating it (unless an A is on the board). Doesn't matter which cards just that they are the two highest. Notice the board has paired the KK not the QQ.

After that is the Over Pair: KK on a K88 board (with K being the High card). Still slight chance of loosing to pocket 8's but not worth worrying about, except tight passive who re-raises to your Pot sized bet (assuming the pot has grown significantly). He may have K8 or perhaps a set of overs in between K and 8. The problem with these really tight passives is that when they bet you take notice. I think you still have to call.

The next is the middle one of each: J9 on a JJ9 board with an over card or 2 (say A,Q). Now the FH's start to get a little tricky, The villan may have a nut straight or nut Flush and still think it's good so he's betting in. On the other hand he may have the higher FH or lower FH. These hands are often the most expensive mistakes, it allways seems when you are good they fold and when you are beat they raise, we remember our losses more.

After that switch the JJ9 board with a J99 board, then a decending order till you get to the idiot end. All these hands must be treated cautiously, it becomes important to limit the feild and isolate early when playing these. If you can't shove one villain out before turn with 2 villans post flop then you are in for heart ache.

Oops meant Baudib1

In the hand you mentioned it really depends...

I'd be betting out 2/3 pot atleast, as you'll get lots of calls from OESD's, top pair hands, two pair and combo pair and straight draws. All passive players are just going to call and all aggressive players would not be limping pre, so I don't see a reason why you would ever check.

Yea, you need to be careful w/full houses, but at the super micro's, I'm rarely folding a FH unless it's completely dominated. In your example, K88, literally 0% of the time am I ever folding KK. It's so unbelievably -ev to fold KK, as you'll be seeing so many more trip 8's/8K then you will 88.

As far as the rest of your examples, too little information to seriously debate what action to take. If there's an obvious flush/straight on the board, then folding becomes less +ev. If it's an extremely dry board, say "JJ94A" and your holding J9, there's still only two hand combos beating you (AA, AJ).

As far as PLO goes, focus more on making correct decisions preflop, such as playing hands that connect well, playing for more nut flush/straight hands, such as playing hands like AcKh4c3h, instead of 10h9h3c2c is much more relevant/applicable to the beginning player. The most common mistake early players make is committing to as you say "the idiot end" of a straight or making a non nut flush.

Coolers are overrated in PLO. I mean they obviously happen all the time; there are tons of times when you say, "Well, I'm only losing to xx-hand" and they of course have it. Bottom set when facing big action or the nut-low full house is not really worth investing a lot of money in and most competent players know this.

Also, it's not like you flop a king-high flush and get it in on the flop and stack off to an ace-high flush very often.

Huge equity edges occur when you get it in on a dominating draw or made hand with redraw and are freerolling. I.e. you flop broadway with a flush draw or a set vs. someone with a naked straight or you have 9876 on 762r flop vs. someone with a structurally flawed hand like KQ98.

This is a very interesting thread

The best hands to hold are nut straights with better draws, hands like
are always playable pre-flop
then when you get a flop like you are looking at the nut straight with flush draws (J high on a 2 card flush draw flop usually won't hold up because someone prol'y has the Axd, or Kxd). you also have 9 outs to a higher strait (3-8's, 3-T's, 3-J's) not to mention the slight chance of the 7d, 8d, Qd, and Kd giving you the SF. Also cards like 4's and 5's only make your hand that much better against lower straight draws. Not to mention the wacky long shot 97, 96, 99 draws that do happen on occasion, but not worth worrying about.

Variance does happen more often though, last night I was on the BB and the board was limped all around I had something like
XX
the flop was , so I bet 3xBB and had one caller in position on me.
Turn I bet the pot and was re-raised by a lag, and ended up all in
the river was a dead card (an 8) and he had
so the one hand that could beat me he had, eh I probably would have played it the same way again.