micro stakespoker advice, 10k hands checkup

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gnarus

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I am trying to make the move from tournaments to cash to better free up my schedule. Tough sledding so far, It seems most players aren't that good but it's hard to exploit. For example on guy was playing 70 VPIP 30 PFR & I played against him for hours and watched his stack grow 10x. It seemed he always had what he needed when challenged and connected with bad cards. Anyway I would really appreciate any insight. Let me know what stats would be most useful, this is driving me nuts LOL

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Justinawe12

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Hey man I saw you at the tables earlier. I don't know if you remember "Justinawe", but that was me. Anyways, VPIP/PFR are of course the two biggest numbers that need to be looked at. All of your stats seem solid, so that doesn't look like an issue. When looking at my stats, I noticed that I was losing money by making bad plays. By this I mean Cbetting the flop and turn way more than I should have. Calling down to the river even when I was almost sure that I was beat. Dumb stuff like that. Have you found that to be an issue?
 
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gnarus

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Justin I looked up my biggest losing hands where I lost my stack This is an issue for me.

Hand 1

I had AK & 3 bet to 25 bb. Push allin to over 100 bb and I called. Was up against AJ & 25. Of course 25 won LOL I dont really remember that hand but I'm sure it was a read.

Hand 2

I had KK from the CO. I raised to 2.5 bb and was 3 bet to 9.5 bb. smooth call

Flop 9, 6, 7 rainbow. he raises to 9.5 bb I call

Turn 3 c he raised 23 bb, I went allin. guess i should have fold? He flips AA

Hand 3

KK from mid position. I raised to 2.75 smoothcall from 1 opp

flop 2, 9, 10 he checks, I raise to 4 bb, he 3 bets to 11, I smooth call

turn;7.

he raises 18.5 i call, (should I have folded here?)

flop- another 10 no flush on board. he all in's. I have 67.5 bb left he has me covered. My thinking here was I really didn't think he had a 10 here. I thought JJ-AA was his most likely range. Looking at it now it seems dumb to call. He had 2-2 by the way.

Hand 4- A 10 in the cutoff. I open bet 2.75. 1 opp smooth calls

flop 10, 9, 6 raise 3.5, he smooth calls

turn; 4. I raise 26 BB, he allin I call with 48.75. he flips 7-8 for the flopped str8

Iwasted about60 bb here. I think I should have made a smaller bet on the turn and then folded the 3 bet. Agree?

Hand 5-

10-10 in the CO. I three bet, opp 4 bet, I went all in and he called flipping aces. I usually dont play this way must have been tilting. He was a 20/11% player and was 3 betting me almost every time I entered a pot. I believe this is why it happened.

Hand 6- JJ early. I rais 2.5, opp raises to 8, I smooth call.

flop 7, 10, 8 (2 hearts) I raise 26 and he pushes all in. I call- have 54.5 left. he flips aces. It's easy to see he would likely only do these with a higher paid, str8, 2 pair, or perhaps a flush draw. I should have bet smaller and folded the 3 betI think.

Hand 7- JJ on the button. Opp min raises in front of me, and I 3 bet to 5.5. He goes all in with about 100, I call. I'm ok with this play. This is a pretty inexplicable raise and my experience has been people that over-raise like this usually have something like a smaller pocket pair they dont want to have to play post flop. I expected to see something like Ax or a smaller PP. This was against a 21/11% player. I can understand the argument for folding though. I won't tell you what he had, let me know what you think his range is and if you would have made the call...

Hand 8- KK- I raise and re-raise to an allin prefop. about a 20/10 player. he flips aces.

These are my 8 biggest losing hands and account for about 1000 BB loses..... Appreciate any insight. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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Justinawe12

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Justin I looked up my biggest losing hands where I lost my stack This is an issue for me.

Hand 1

I had AK & 3 bet to 25 bb. Push allin to over 100 bb and I called. Was up against AJ & 25. Of course 25 won LOL I dont really remember that hand but I'm sure it was a read.
If your read was good and the stats showed the players as being looser, you made the right play with AK. Just a suckout that's going to happen. Fish have to win sometimes..


Hand 2

I had KK from the CO. I raised to 2.5 bb and was 3 bet to 9.5 bb. smooth call

Flop 9, 6, 7 rainbow. he raises to 9.5 bb I call

Turn 3 c he raised 23 bb, I went allin. guess i should have fold? He flips AA
One of those spots where overpair looks good, but your opponent only feared a set. With KK you have to be careful on flops like these, as a preflop raise of only 2.5, opponent will call with any decent pair. Anyways KK running into AA, one of those situations that happens, although rarely, so don't sweat it too much. Personally I would have folded the turn after all the aggression, even though I know it's tough to lay down a huge overpair on a fairly dry board.

Hand 3

KK from mid position. I raised to 2.75 smoothcall from 1 opp

flop 2, 9, 10 he checks, I raise to 4 bb, he 3 bets to 11, I smooth call

turn;7.

he raises 18.5 i call, (should I have folded here?)

flop- another 10 no flush on board. he all in's. I have 67.5 bb left he has me covered. My thinking here was I really didn't think he had a 10 here. I thought JJ-AA was his most likely range. Looking at it now it seems dumb to call. He had 2-2 by the way.
Definitely an easy fold on the turn. Checkraise is a pretty straightforward sign of strength, and leading into the turn just seals the deal. Like I said, overpairs can be hard to fold on these boards, but with an opponent being that aggressive, you just have to know when to let it go.

Hand 4- A 10 in the cutoff. I open bet 2.75. 1 opp smooth calls

flop 10, 9, 6 raise 3.5, he smooth calls

turn; 4. I raise 26 BB, he allin I call with 48.75. he flips 7-8 for the flopped str8

Iwasted about60 bb here. I think I should have made a smaller bet on the turn and then folded the 3 bet. Agree?
Agreed 100%. No reason to bet that much on the turn. Could have bet maybe 1/3rd of the pot just to see where you were at, although he could always just call in hopes of you checkraising on the river.
Hand 5-

10-10 in the CO. I three bet, opp 4 bet, I went all in and he called flipping aces. I usually dont play this way must have been tilting. He was a 20/11% player and was 3 betting me almost every time I entered a pot. I believe this is why it happened.
If it was me I would have folded after the 4bet. 10s are a great hand, but if an opponent is raising my reraise, I'm instantly putting them on a premium hand, especially if they have the stats of a TAG/nit.

Hand 6- JJ early. I rais 2.5, opp raises to 8, I smooth call.

flop 7, 10, 8 (2 hearts) I raise 26 and he pushes all in. I call- have 54.5 left. he flips aces. It's easy to see he would likely only do these with a higher paid, str8, 2 pair, or perhaps a flush draw. I should have bet smaller and folded the 3 betI think.
Another situation where overpair looks good, but played too aggressively. He's not 3betting for value in this spot, especially when he knows you're going to most likely call with the size of the pot now. Gotta bet smaller on the flop, no reason to overbet, especially with the wetness of the board.

Hand 7- JJ on the button. Opp min raises in front of me, and I 3 bet to 5.5. He goes all in with about 100, I call. I'm ok with this play. This is a pretty ine xplicable raise and my experience has been people that over-raise like this usually have something like a smaller pocket pair they dont want to have to play post flop. I expected to see something like Ax or a smaller PP. This was against a 21/11% player. I can understand the argument for folding though. I won't tell you what he had, let me know what you think his range is and if you would have made the call...
Seeing that he's only raising about 11% of his hands, I'd put him on a fairly tight range, something like 88+,KJs+. However, even though JJ is ahead of a lot of that range, I don't like the fact that he min raises then goes all in to the 3bet. That's on obvious sign of strength, as he has to be pretty confident in his hand to do that. Leads me to think he's got at minimum AKs, but most likely it's KK or AA. Folding this everytime, as it's not worth the amount of BB's to hope he's trying to be sneaky with some smaller pair.

Hand 8- KK- I raise and re-raise to an allin prefop. about a 20/10 player. he flips aces.

I most likely would have played this the same way. Everyone wants to get KK in preflop because it's almost always a favorite. What happens? That 4% chance that the opponent has AA. That's poker. 24/25 times you'll be a favorite to win, so don't sweat it.
These are my 8 biggest losing hands and account for about 1000 BB loses..... Appreciate any insight. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!
No problem, hope the insight helped! Let me know if you have any other questions, happy to help.
 
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gnarus

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Thanks Justin. I like the way you play! I have a couple specific questions.

Hand 2- do you like the flop call? I was thinking maybe a min flop 3 bet would be better to see how he handled it. If he 4 bet I would fold, and if he called and check the tun maybe 8 bb bet?


Hand 3- Do you think the flop call was correct? Also preflop should have raised more?
 
blueskies

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There's nothing you can do with those KK vs. AA coolers. The hand with TT, going all in is fine depending on the type of opponent you are against. Against a relatively strong opponent I would just fold an allin or call a 3 bet since you are very likely no better than a coinflip (AQ, AK) or dominated (JJ+). Against the ones you know with a wider shoving range: who'll shove with A5 suited, JT suited etc.

Raise bigger preflop. 2.75 BB is inviting all kinds of crap in with you.
 
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Justinawe12

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Thanks Justin. I like the way you play! I have a couple specific questions.

Hand 2- do you like the flop call? I was thinking maybe a min flop 3 bet would be better to see how he handled it. If he 4 bet I would fold, and if he called and check the tun maybe 8 bb bet?
Flop call is fine. For all we know he's making a Cbet trying to take the pot down right there. If you felt like he was trying to just buy the pot there, a 3bet would have been fine. Like I said though, he was super aggressive on the turn, meaning he has some kind of monster.


Hand 3- Do you think the flop call was correct? Also preflop should have raised more?
Definitely would have raised more preflop, as you have the 2nd best starting hand, and most likely the best hand at the table. Make your opponents pay to see the flop. 4x would have been fine, but maybe even 5x or 6x depending on the number of limpers. As for the call, I would have folded as soon as he made the checkraise. He's projecting a big hand, and knows that you have something yourself, so he wants to grow the pot quickly and get stacks in. Hard to put him on a set, but it's most likely he's got an overpair beat.
Thanks, I just hope this helps you out. Feel free to ask if you have anything else you need advice on.
 
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GWU73

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Bet and raise more, especially with good hands.
You want to build a big pot early with hands like KK. 2.5bb opens are better suited to tournament play where you want to steal many small pots. In cash games you are just looking to get maximum value for your good hands while losing less with your bad hands. I usually open for 3 to 3.5bb, but with bigger hands, I tend to open for 4-5bb and still get callers. The side benefit for raising bigger is your hand gets easier to play. ie.. you raise 5bb pre flop with KK pre flop, get one caller with a 60bb stack, the pot is 11.5 bb. flop xxx with no ace. You can profitably get all in 100% of the time (spr 5) . If you had raised 2.5bb the pot would be only 6.5bb, or you would have more opponents. Either way, getting all in would be a bad play because your 1 pair hand is too weak to play for stacks with a stack to pot ratio of nearly 9 or against multiple opponents with speculative hands.

Maybe reading up on Stack to Pot Ratios would help you understand better than my explanation. It is a crittical concept for cash game play.
 
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gnarus

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Thanks GW- so if you bet big with premium hands doesn't that kill your payout when people notice that & get out of the way. Do you recommend polarizing bet sizes?
 
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PoopFlinger

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10k hands os too small of a sample to determine anything. at least a 100k sample is a heathly sample.
 
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gnarus

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Well, I'm collecting hands every day poop :) I just wanted to try and right the ship as I sail along rather then lose for 100k hands then figure out what went wrong. I understand what you are saying though.

Anyway I started raising more preflop with premium hands and it's been working nicely. I also cut back on the number of tables and really looked more closely at the stats. It's interesting how telling the fold to 3 bet stats. There are some players that have very high pfr and almost always fold to 3 bet and others that will never fold.

I am up about 250 BB in the last 2000 hands.
 
Yoshimiii

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Thanks GW- so if you bet big with premium hands doesn't that kill your payout when people notice that & get out of the way. Do you recommend polarizing bet sizes?
Most players at these micro limits aren't even paying attention, bet big with the premium hands and these fish will call you down with anything trying to hit a miracle card. Fish like this guy who was getting every card will eventually run bad and lose everything, just wait until a good opportunity and isolate him when hands that dominate his such as K/J+, e.g. when he limps just raise him and when he raises pre-flop just 3 bet him. Don't bluff though, if u miss the board just get out of the way as he will just call down with anything.
 
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gnarus

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Yoshimii- when you're right you're right! I just looked up his stats and it was something like -17 BB at 4NL. The only part of his graph that ticked up was the day I saw him play. LOL
 
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