A Donks view

#1 2nd May 2007, 3:24 AM

I thought I would write on how I play multi table sng's. I play a very different style than pretty much everyone else I have ever met.

Early stages:

Always look for a double up obviously it is all you need for the final table. Here I play AQ up and pps, nothing else. I dont fritter chips away with marginal hands, it is useless to do so. You always want to be at a chip stack where a double up gives you at least 2500 if 1500 starting chips.

Post early stages:

This is the point where blinds reach 50 100. I start to loosen up at exactly this point with rersaise steals and such become more profitable at this blind level. At this point I will start to play more agressivly. I never call after this point. For the rest of the sng I always am original raiser or reraising, I do this for 2 reasons;

1- it gives you an image as a maniac later on which you can use to your advantage.

2- I always want to build a stack to as high as it can be so that when I reach the final table I will have throwing around chips. They are esential for my style and I usually have them.

After the previous level you should be on or near the final table depending on how many players there are. If not at the final table I continue above till I get there.

The Final Table:

This is my massive strength. My play here is very good.
My advice here relies on the fact you are not shortstacked but if you are it is pretty standard stealing and trying to double up. But with decent chip stacks I always go into maniac mode.

Maniac mode:

Every orbit I will steal at least 3 times if cards are not hitting me. If the blinds go up always raise so you don't lose out when the blinds hit
you. Never pick on small stacks unless you have a huge chip lead. If not always pick on bigger medium stacks they will fold more easily and don't want to take risks till they are in the money. This all means you have to have a read on them all very important. If you think you have any advantage preflop and it is raised to you, move all in. They will fold a lot giving you dead money or they will call with worse hands which sometimes you win sometimes you dont. Doesn't matter, you will hold up and
force a fold often enuff to make this profitable.

If you have the monster stack always raise at least 50% of hands per orbit. You need the stolen blinds to cover silly calls later. Otherwise just call raise everything and everyone till you either run em over or lose back to a point where you can be busted. Cards are unimportant in this situation. It is all about pure agression.

Bubble time.

If you have an average or up stack you go crazy. Any raisese by a smaller stack you go all in unless you have a read that says they not scared of bubbling.

80% of players will let you get away with it so they can cash. You might run into hands but this is why only reraise shorter stacks. Raise 50% of hands again so you make good chip stack for afterwards.

In the money:

I just go into donk mode. I will bully everyone regardless of chip stacks. I dont care if I lose any more I only care about winning at this point. If I have a big stack will call any all in with any live cards. If not will steal so much it's stupid, and by playing like this I get heads up or bust. Heads up being the more likely.

This is a very rough idea of how iIplay and whatever it may look like it does take a lot of skill although it requires a lot of luck too. I have a good
ability to read when I am ahead which is why I can play this way. It took me 2-3 months to get myself to the skill level to play what looks to be the donkish way to play but is very profitable at lower than $20 sngs, turbo or not. Not many people can play this way as it is an alien concept to them rsing all in frm the button with k2, but next time you see the maniac making crazy plays and being ahead most of the time dont write it off to luck. There is a very good profit in playing this way as you will get heads up more than you finish any other positions if you can do it well.

I am a self confessed donk but I donk better than most and make good profits doing it. I used to be TAG and poker bored me playing that way and small profits don't interest me. I have found a way to play that excites me and also give me a good roi. I make good money now that I couldn't make as TAG. Everyone plays tag online and I know I will never be best at that so I found another way to play which makes me a anomily to normal players they dont know how to play it.

this is my firs long post on cc so forgive its rambling and general tardiness i cant spell and dont know punctuation but there it is

#2 2nd May 2007, 3:40 AM

Nice post Stef.

#3 2nd May 2007, 6:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefanicov

it is an alien concept to thm

...but not to me...

#4 2nd May 2007, 8:31 AM

maniacal poker style was the hardest for me to learn how to play. takes a lot of balls. after learning it, i cannot stress enough how much you should be bluffing TAG players. if 2-3 hands per multi hour session you do not fire a 3rd bullet with nothing into a huge pot and take it down you could be missing out on a lot of money.

#5 2nd May 2007, 12:46 PM

Good post Steve. I know that when some people see your style of play they assume there is no game plan but I have played enough with you to know better. Some people would like to believe that this would not work long term - but I see it work for you over and over. Sure you get lucky a lot - and sometimes get caught and busted out - but overall you win money.

The 27 player sng we played last night was a perfect example of that. I played my TAG style and barely made it to the money but did get 5th. I lost count of how many of my blinds you stole lol. But you got to the final table as the chip leader and could push us all around. You must have lost half of your stack 4 or 5 times and came back every time. Trust me - it is hard to play with you on that final table lol. But I knew if I could try to stay out of your way you would bust out all the smaller stacks and I could get to 5th at least. And it worked.

And of course you got first lol.

Good job and thanks for the game and the post.

#6 2nd May 2007, 2:57 PM

Yes, quite interesting play!

Although you could end up loosing a-lot of chips if you misjudge it!

I find in online tournaments that its best to lie low until the first couple of people are out - as these are usually the ones that play stupidly!! Then when you have said bye to the shit players, you can start using your tight rep to win bluffs!
Sitting back also allows you to get a read on others play

- Im a good player, not amazing - so that might be the difference between us

#7 3rd May 2007, 5:24 AM

Interesting post Steve, I always wondered all this time how you played...lots have said you lucky and I have to say after watching you play a few games, that is sometimes the case. I also have witnessed you taking down tourney after tourney....including the one a Costa, you cashed out over a grand. lol I was in so much shock!

Good Luck in your future endeavours!!!

#8 10th May 2007, 9:13 PM

how do u play on draws? what percentage of the pot do u usually bet ? i really like this style of play. I hate playing TAG

#9 10th May 2007, 9:15 PM

also, do u play like this in cash games?

#10 12th May 2007, 5:47 PM

draws i push a lot in cash i am whatever i am feeling at the time i either stack or get stacked i dont grind out cash one weakness oamong many i have

#11 13th May 2007, 12:03 PM

If your on a straight draw then don't make that obvious because striaght draws dont usually come through I find!

Flush draw, (on the assumption you hold 2/4 suited cards) then be careful, because you dont want the opponent to realize thats what your hoping for - as if it falls through you still want a chance of steeling the pot.
If low cards come on the flop and you hit flush draw, I would probably check, then if a high card appeared, bet small amount (e.g. on 25/50 blinds 2000 chip start bet 75 or 100).

#12 23rd May 2007, 9:21 AM

i like this post describes how i play im a maniac highly aggressive but then i tend to mellow out and then go back into maniac mode. but one question i have always wondered how to distinguish maniac players from donks in the beginning? and of course some do make it to the half so its hard to read donks from maniacs from those who got there from strategy or from luck or loose calls? ive noticed this quite a bit which confuses me sometimes when i start reading players. of course im not as advanced as most on this site but in real life i m pretty good but real to online is a different matter im still trying to grasp the reads tells bets and strategies of online play. and all in all is it best be a maniac or sit back?

#13 23rd May 2007, 5:52 PM

I found this post so important that I had to eliminate the little things that distracted me from understanding it. Stef, I hope you approve of my edit. If I got it wrong, please request a mod to delete my reply.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefanicov

I thought I would write on how I play multi table sng's. I play a very different style than pretty much everyone else I have ever met.

Early stages:

Always look for a double up obviously it is all you need for the final table. Here I play AQ up and pps, nothing else. I dont fritter chips away with marginal hands, it is useless to do so. You always want to be at a chip stack where a double up gives you at least 2500 if 1500 starting chips.

Post early stages:

This is the point where blinds reach 50 100. I start to loosen up at exactly this point with rersaise steals and such become more profitable at this blind level. At this point I will start to play more agressivly. I never call after this point. For the rest of the sng I always am original raiser or reraising, I do this for 2 reasons;

1- it gives you an image as a maniac later on which you can use to your advantage.

2- I always want to build a stack to as high as it can be so that when I reach the final table I will have throwing around chips. They are esential for my style and I usually have them.

After the previous level you should be on or near the final table depending on how many players there are. If not at the final table I continue above till I get there.

The Final Table:

This is my massive strength. My play here is very good.
My advice here relies on the fact you are not shortstacked but if you are it is pretty standard stealing and trying to double up. But with decent chip stacks I always go into maniac mode.

Maniac mode:

Every orbit I will steal at least 3 times if cards are not hitting me. If the blinds go up always raise so you don't lose out when the blinds hit
you. Never pick on small stacks unless you have a huge chip lead. If not always pick on bigger medium stacks they will fold more easily and don't want to take risks till they are in the money. This all means you have to have a read on them all very important. If you think you have any advantage preflop and it is raised to you, move all in. They will fold a lot giving you dead money or they will call with worse hands which sometimes you win sometimes you dont. Doesn't matter, you will hold up and
force a fold often enuff to make this profitable.

If you have the monster stack always raise at least 50% of hands per orbit. You need the stolen blinds to cover silly calls later. Otherwise just call raise everything and everyone till you either run em over or lose back to a point where you can be busted. Cards are unimportant in this situation. It is all about pure agression.

Bubble time.

If you have an average or up stack you go crazy. Any raisese by a smaller stack you go all in unless you have a read that says they not scared of bubbling.

80% of players will let you get away with it so they can cash. You might run into hands but this is why only reraise shorter stacks. Raise 50% of hands again so you make good chip stack for afterwards.

In the money:

I just go into donk mode. I will bully everyone regardless of chip stacks. I dont care if I lose any more I only care about winning at this point. If I have a big stack will call any all in with any live cards. If not will steal so much it's stupid, and by playing like this I get heads up or bust. Heads up being the more likely.

This is a very rough idea of how iIplay and whatever it may look like it does take a lot of skill although it requires a lot of luck too. I have a good
ability to read when I am ahead which is why I can play this way. It took me 2-3 months to get myself to the skill level to play what looks to be the donkish way to play but is very profitable at lower than $20 sngs, turbo or not. Not many people can play this way as it is an alien concept to them rsing all in frm the button with k2, but next time you see the maniac making crazy plays and being ahead most of the time dont write it off to luck. There is a very good profit in playing this way as you will get heads up more than you finish any other positions if you can do it well.

I am a self confessed donk but I donk better than most and make good profits doing it. I used to be TAG and poker bored me playing that way and small profits don't interest me. I have found a way to play that excites me and also give me a good roi. I make good money now that I couldn't make as TAG. Everyone plays tag online and I know I will never be best at that so I found another way to play which makes me a anomily to normal players they dont know how to play it.

this is my firs long post on cc so forgive its rambling and general tardiness i cant spell and dont know punctuation but there it is

#14 25th May 2007, 11:24 PM

I have to get past my fear of putting a lot of chips in the pot. I tend to be too conservative in tournaments. Sometimes you need to be a maniac in tournaments. If you dont get chips quick, you will end up shortstacked towards the end.

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