Did I play this hand correctly? (pissed off pro)

Ok, so I'm using the term "pro" loosely since I haven't reached that level yet, but I consider myself pretty good which is why I was extremely pissed off at what happened.

Here's the scenario: 4 of us playing, me the "seasoned pro" so to speak, my wife, my friend and his wife. We each start off with 2,000 chips. We play several hands and I'm having nothing but bad luck - from one missed flop to another, to chasing the flush 3-4 times and missing it each time (mind you, I'm talking 4 spades or 4 clubs after hitting the flop and getting nothing on the Turn and the River).

What really pissed me off was that my friend's wife continually asked to see his cards and was giving him advice in another language. Like every hand that she folded. I didn't say anything since it was a friendly game but it still annoyed me.

So "the hand" came:

I flopped second highest pair on the board. Not that great, really. There was a Jack sitting there and I knew someone might have it. The two women had folded and it was down to me and my friend. The River hit, and he looked pretty unsure with a LOT of money in the middle - I'd say at least 700 chip. He still had about 850 chips, and I had 1,400.

Let me say right off the bat he had the Jack while I had a 10. He had the highest pair - but that's it, he had one pair on a very dangerous board. He unsurely threw in 200 more and I immediately went "all in" and gave him the stare. If he played, he would be out of the game.

He thought about it for an uneasy 20-30 seconds, and I could tell, no, I KNEW he was going to fold. Even top pair could be beat by a measly 2-pair, or a straight which was a possibility.

Then his wife said "let me look at your cards" and started going off in another language about how he should play - and he still didn't want to play.

Then I saw it in his eye, and knew he was going to play. If this were a cash game, mind you, it would have been an insta-fold. Top pair on a landmine board? But there was no real money involved, it was just a play game with no real stake. His wife said a few more things that pretty much translated to "play it!" and he went all in.

I knew it. I KNEW IT and I sat there so pissed off in my head I didn't know what to say. I flipped my pair of 10's and knew he was flipping over a pair of Jacks. Sure enough, he did and won almost all my money.

I bluffed. I bluffed well. Did I bluff perfectly? I'd say "hell yes!" except for the fact that he called. Did I make a mistake? Or is the only mistake that it wasn't a cash game so losing had no consequences?

God, I'm still pissed and it happened the other night.

isn't there a famous quote about only being able to bluff a good player? i think, yes, you made a mistake trying to bluff in a no stakes or freeroll game when you were pretty sure opponent had top pair. I agree that showing cards or table talk when not in hand is inappropriate in any poker game, friendly or not.

If he had 850 in chips and threw in 200 of them he was left with only 650.The pot has 700 before this and 900 after.

Now you went all in which really puts him all in.So if I see it correctly he only has to put in 650 more to win 1650.That's like 2.5 to 1 pot odds and if he took the hand this far why not call for the rest of your chips?

In retrospect,we have know idea what the blinds are,your position,his position,and other important info.

To answer the OP I would have to say no,you did not play it correctly(given the info we have).Why would you go so far with a middle pair?Why would you sink so much money into the pot if the other guy keeps calling?Are the people you are playing so unskilled they will call a hand like top pair down to the river then just say"oops,I must be beat"only to fold after dumping half their stack into the pot?

I understand this isn't real money,which sounds like a good thing considering.I am in no way trying to belittle you or put you down.All I am saying is if you really want to be a "pro" or even a decent poker player,it sounds like you have a long way to go.

This forum is full of very good info and is a good place to start.Just read,read,read,and keep playing.Soon you will be able to run all over this table no matter who's wife is helping who.

Anyway,good luck and welcome to the forum.

Perhaps I didn't explain myself clearly enough - He didn't dump half his stack into the pot. He had already gone down to that amount through previous hands. He committed a lot in this hand as well but this was not all of his money. If he folded he would have still had 700 out of 2000 (so he had 900 by the River and put in those 200) that isn't a bad stack when you're betting on losing and being knocked out of the game when all you have is one pair.

Also, the flop and the turn saw only 300ish chips going in from both sides before he threw in an additional 200-300 on the River. I knew he didn't have a good hand (and a single pair is not a good hand on a board that could deliver a straight) and like I said, I knew he was going to fold.

The fact that he didn't because of his wife's insistence and the fact the game didn't have any real money involved is what really got me.

If you still feel that I'm an amateur because I actually bluffed in poker, I can't really comment. But I suppose you're right that I can't prove myself, but I knew he was going to fold. That's what got my goat.

I'm really just saying if you want an honest answer you have to give more info,that's all.

Here's your answer. Great thread by the way.

Sorry, it's just tough to remember everything in the hand since it was one hand out of many in a night of Poker. Can't recall the exact chip stack but I know more-or-less how it played out. Anyway, I guess I shouldn't have posted if I didn't know the exact play-by-play, chip count, etc. but I didn't really have time to write everything down :P

But how much did you lose ? Answer, zero so don't feel bad for trying to bluff someone who is unbluffable.

Yeah, but the kibitzing kinda bugs me too.

-

Oh yeah. This just screams 'PRO'.
Its all sig worthy.

Also, next time set some ground rules before the game starts. Namely: One person per hand. They can talk all they want after the hand ends, but if someone is in they shouldnt be able to give advice.

Bluffing a calling station in a play money game isn't big, isn't smart or isn't clever, and certainly not worth calling yourself a pro over..............

LOL nice

__________________
He unsurely threw in 200 more and I immediately went "all in" and gave him the stare.
-Hovhannes, Seasoned "Pro"

I wrote to ask a question, and I'm being pretty much attacked. Can't I write with a little bit of flair when I'm typing? There are a lot of players (pro and amateur) who stare during a game. Thanks guys for the warm replies on this forum, means a lot. Not very friendly replies at all, and probably will keep me from posting a question in the future. I guess that's what you wanted, so congrats.

Looks to me like you believed , deep in your soul, this was gonna end up being a strip poker night.

Because it really isn't a poker question, it's a "I'm good and they all suck but I lost, please give me sympathy" question. You asked for a response and the answers were:

1. Give more info if you want better responses
2. From the info you did give they had ~2.5:1 to call
3. You start out saying that they're not very good, then you try to bluff them off of top pair, that's not smart

If you want everyone to tell you how great you are and how it's not your fault they all suck, you're right, this isn't the place for you.

i think his wife read caro's book of tells and knew that "the stare" was a bluff.

Post of the day goes to philthy

Dude, I'm just having a little fun. No one is attacking anyone. You gave us a scenario, we gave you what advice we could with the info you provided. You didnt give us a lot to work with, so we could only give you the pretty basic strats. What more do you want?

It was a friendly game of poker. Obviously no one set any rules (like 1 player per hand) but thats cool. No biggie. You're the better player there, you tried to bluff another player, it wasnt successful, and you lost.
It happens. Get over it. You dont see other pros posting in their blogs about how their bluff wasnt successful.

And to top it off, it was a free game!

Also, read Mike Caro's 'Book of Tells' and you'll find out why I made the joke about the 'giving him the stare' comment.

what does it say in the book about the stare. I wanna know dammit

I saw that guys book in Barnes & Nobles and the cover turned me off lol - Caro looked like he was stepping out of one of those infomercials you see on TV lol

But its a good book?

Basically: strong means weak, and weak means strong.

See, the last few replies have been what was needed. Intelligent posts in reply to my initial post, not making jabs because I dared to use the work "pro" or said that I "gave the stare"

Thanks, that is a very interesting read, I might pick up the book despite the cover

You could have said one player to a hand. But since you didn't call that and let her play his hand then the only complaint should be is a lack of rules set.

should have played a bigger hand

I don't get the whole "set ground rules" thing. I thought one player per hand(except for when in a lesson, and they're not even at the table), went without saying.

I also don't get how it was a friendly game. That "lady" wasn't friendly. I'm not so sure that what she was doing wasn't just downright rude! That whole "Lemme see your cards" then telling him what to do in a different language(and isn't that more grating than if she had just whispered in his ear?) is rude. It's especially rude in a social situation. Rude because it made you, and maybe even your wife uncomfortable. An adult should know better.

I'm sorry I read the thread. Now I just wanna pull that woman's hair and start a good old fashioned girl-fight! I haven't even met her and wanna kick her ass.

Now I ask you, is that a good way for me to react/feel? Heck no! But yeah, I wanna beat her up.

Bright side, I think I like Phil Laak better now.

This is true, but the problem is that in previous earlier situations the offending parties were not called on it. To then point out that they are now in violation necessarily gives away something about your hand in this situation, namely that you are weak. Prior enforcement, or at least comment, would have allowed for another comment here without displaying weakness.

Anyway, I recommend that anyone having a home game hire a professional dealer to run their game, in which case this situation would never have come up.

Let see...you're playing in a home game with friends and play chips and your upset over what???????????

Already said - friend was ready to fold. He was going to fold since he only had one pair and his wife told him to play after looking at his cards. He pushed his chips in totally thinking he was going to lose but because she told him to.

"Just for fun" or not, that ain't right.

true, one player to a hand, but...

should have called the earlier on it (when you wanted the call w the better kicker?)--- or hire that pro dealer.

Seriously, it is supposed to be ONE PLAYER TO A HAND (http://www.cardschat.com/f51/anatomy-failed-bluff-95375/), but in this case, not much recourse, and really, thus not much reason to be upset, as previous inaction should have indicated to you that this would happen again at a critical time...
[no comment necessary on the "pro" trying to bluff the donk off top pair in a freeroll...]

yea whats up with that , they messed up a very funny thread.

Wow! A little pent up aggression huh? Can't tell if I'm disturbed or turned on by the girl on girl violence. Probably the latter.

Wait, so it's just friends together playing for no money, and they should spend money on a dealer? I do agree that if breaking that rule mattered he would have mentioned it earlier. If you're just playing for play chips and didn't care that much this wouldn't really matter, but I think any game where a loss would get you upset enough to post it on a poker forum should be one in which all players know and follow the rules. I guess a pro dealer would work but having people understand the rules is the first step.

Our school had a ton of free events with prizes for winners (so although it was free, still an incentive to win). It got really frustrating when someone would re-raise a 50 chip raise by putting 10 on top and the dealer wouldn't know the rules, or when the dealers would negotiate with the players not to bet because it would be too hard to make side pots. Luckily our independent real-money game is run smoothly, we're all pretty good friends but still play to win and understand the rules. It's a lot more fun that way.

So while I certainly understand the frustration of the OP, just realize that it was just for fun with no money at stake and that people will call with a lot more when a loss doesn't mean they lose money anyway. Also if enforcing the rules matters to you, make sure they are enforced from the beginning, and not only when they impact a big hand you're involved in.

Yeah, this makes the most sense out of everything. They do matter to me but sometimes I just don't like to make an issue of something that I thought wouldn't be necessary to even bring up.