Hey people,
Just got knocked out a tourney bluffing at a pair on board.
If I'm in the BB and get a look at a free flop with three limpers, and the flop comes 3 6 3-when is it alright to bluff at the threes and how do you go about it? I've tried betting on the flop and also check raising on the flop. I've tried calling a bet on the flop and checking the turn then betting the river after he checks the turn in fear. I only really practice these moves when the blinds and antes make it profitable, but still get called with a mid pair and lose my stack.
Someone who knows how to do it effectively please assist.
Thanks

Originally Posted by 8Michael3

Hey people,
Just got knocked out a tourney bluffing at a pair on board.
If I'm in the BB and get a look at a free flop with three limpers, and the flop comes 3 6 3-when is it alright to bluff at the threes and how do you go about it? I've tried betting on the flop and also check raising on the flop. I've tried calling a bet on the flop and checking the turn then betting the river after he checks the turn in fear. I only really practice these moves when the blinds and antes make it profitable, but still get called with a mid pair and lose my stack.
Someone who knows how to do it effectively please assist.
Thanks

More info would be awesome. What buyins do you play, very low? If so save

your chips and value bet. when there is 3 other guys in the pot with you dont

run a bare bluff too risky even on a scary board. Save your well timed bluffs

until you make it to HU. Search the threads there are some really good posts

regarding bluffs. Check them out and GL.

A paired-flop is a good place for a micro-bluff, a smallish bet like you're looking for callers. But not from early position, and not really from the button either. On the button, it looks like a position bet, and you're likely to get called. But when you make it from middle position, it looks like you're not afraid to get called, and it's scarier.

I think the don't bluff strategy sounds good if you getting a few decent hands. When I'm having a good tourney then yes I agree with that. Unfortunately I see AA, KK, or QQ once in two hours in most tourneys so I have gotten used to making a few bluffs here and there. The pair on board idea came from Phil Gordons little green book, but he doesnt explain how to do it besides just being the first one to bet into a paired board.
However thanks for your advice because its a good reminder to be very selective on starting hands and bluffing situations.

My most common note on players is LAPOB(4/4)...translated means loves a pair on board, and in brackets, given the opportunity to bet first, how often he has bet, which I update over time.... I once had a guy on (23/23)!!

Yes there is a time and a place for this type of play, a known LAPOB player generally gets raised 3 x his bet by me, and this generally works, if he reraises allin GET OUT.

Don't bluff into 3 people when any pair will call you. With no raises, the pot is small and there isn't much to be won. If you are going to bluff into this pot, you need to make big bets and OOP, this is terrible risk/reward.

A couple general rules of thumb:
-The more people in a pot, the less you should be bluffing -> more likely that someone likes their hand enough to continue.
-The smaller the pot, the less you should be bluffing -> bad risk/reward.
-The worse your position, the less you should be bluffing -> higher chance of putting yourself in the awful situation of playing a big pot OOP with a weak hand.
-Bluffing is VERY read dependent. If you want to LAG it up, you need to be able to hand read.

If the cards don't come, just learn to properly start push folding.

With 3 others in the pot, I dont want to take a shot at a bluff on this board. Do you know how many people think their A, rag is golden hand and will play. I'd be sure someone hit their hand with A, 3 rag hand. If you are going to bluff at the pot, dont risk your stack or your tourney life. Overbets are many times an indication of weakness online.

If you want to bluff a pair on board, you have to be willing to bet more than half the pot on a bluff as to give most pairs improper odds to call.
I rarely bluff but when I do, it's always about 3/4 of the pot or more depending on my stack size and the reads I have on opponents.

Why are you bluffing in ways where you end up losing your stack when you're caught? And what kinds of bluffs? Are you single-barrelling your entire stack? Double-barrelling? Triple? No matter what, there are probably better ways to play than leading out into multiple limpers.

Thanks guys,
Some Solid advice here. I need to be in a great postion with Fewer and preferably weaker players involved.
Now that I think about it the returns have never been that good on the play. Will think long and hard before I play it again. Sweet!

Originally Posted by 8Michael3

I'm in the BB and get a look at a free flop with three limpers,

I didn't have to read any more. Limped pots are horrible to bluff any board as oponents ranges are very wide, also the more players in the pot the more likely someone hit something. Situations like this are a perfect example were the risk is not worth the reward.

Ya I don't think its worth it with so many limpers. get yourself in more trouble down the line then worth winning a small pot of limps. If anything make sure the 1-2 ppl in the pot with you are tight players =)

Little invested. Little lost. Don't bluff.. whats the point.

Your out of postion betting into a crowd.

Micro stakes rules tend to lean towards betting when you hit, and get out when you don't.

they say poker is 90% skill 10% luck .. but do you think some people are luckier than others .. the reason im asking is .. daniel negreanu .. he went twice all in .. he was behind ..and caught runner runner ..twice .. it seems some of these players get the luck at the right times .. what do some of you think ?

Stop bluffing the calling stations.

Lovin the wisdom people. Good to know that your actions have solid reasoning. Thnx

Originally Posted by c9h13no3

Stop bluffing the calling stations.

Yeah it don't work.... Unless your table image, is great then you can get the calling stations to fold. But you have to pick the right cards, to do so.

Originally Posted by 8Michael3

Hey people,
Just got knocked out a tourney bluffing at a pair on board.
If I'm in the BB and get a look at a free flop with three limpers, and the flop comes 3 6 3-when is it alright to bluff at the threes and how do you go about it? I've tried betting on the flop and also check raising on the flop. I've tried calling a bet on the flop and checking the turn then betting the river after he checks the turn in fear. I only really practice these moves when the blinds and antes make it profitable, but still get called with a mid pair and lose my stack.
Someone who knows how to do it effectively please assist.
Thanks

Works better when there are less opponents, with 3 limpers in an unraised pot I wouldn't try to bluff representing the pair on board. With less opponents give it a shot, but this is one of the most common bluffs out there. Even HU it's possible that a good player will raise thinking you're bluffing, then you can reraise and in essence say 'yeah I really have the 3' and then he might reraise again thinking you're lying and a raising war ensues. But for the most part if you try it with few opponents most of the time they'll fold. Of course it depends on how they perceive you, if you've been showing down a lot of good hands and have been running good the likelihood of success goes up.