Ace Ragz - let me know if you agree

Ace rags is a term in poker describing when a person is holding an Ace (high card) and a small card (9 or lower) in Texas Hold em’. This combination of cards can be tricky to play. Reason being, whenever an Ace is dealt to a player most people keep them and play them. If you are dealt Ace Ragz and keep it, chances are that another player is dealt an Ace with a bigger kicker. This means if you don’t get Aces up (two pair) or a flush (when you rag is same suit) then you’ll probably be out kicked by the other player.

The tendency when we have aces is most people tend to bet a lot and if you’ve been out kicked then you stand to lose a lot of chips. To keep this from happening there are a few things I like to do to keep my Ace Ragz winning.

1) Position – Only limp in on lower limit blinds if you’re in early position and if you’re raised too high then fold. This can prevent you from getting caught with the low card and being out kicked. If you’re in early position and the blinds are high I always fold. Nothing’s worse than losing your blind when you didn’t have to when someone else raises because they have pocket pairs or Ace king or something like that.
In late position call or raise depends on the number of previous callers and their betting habits. If there is one tight caller or raiser then just call, but if a few loose players call or raise, then raise.

2) Suit – If your Ace Ragz cards are suited then you have a few more options. If the blinds are low then you should most likely limp in early. If you’re raised by someone later on in the game, whether you stay in depends on the player that raised. Fold if he’s tight and call if he’s loose and raise if there are two or more loose ones calling. Either they’ll call you with krap or they’ll fold, either way you would tend to fair better against them because not only do you have an Ace you have the potential to pop a flush too.

These are just a couple of tips and pointers that I use when I come across Ace Ragz in poker play. So if you keep this stuff in mind maybe when Ace Ragz falls into your hands you’ll do better. Good luck at the tables!!

Brian “boopy” Miller

About the lowest Arag cards I like to keep are A9. Anything lower than that and I'm making tough decisions through the whole hand. I will keep about any Arag though if I'm in c/o or button and it's folded to me, but I'm not raising it unless the blinds are really really tight.

I usually keep any suited Ax in late position.

Sometimes I limp A2o-A5o on the button (although limping is -EV I guess)

I don't like A6o, A7o (they don't connect to a straigh obv).

... A8,A9o mmm thinking about it I don't like them either.

Generally we would rather like to see two high cards instead -

If you hit the A your kicker is crappy.
If you hit the x will it be any good?
If no one hits are you leading ?

I will trail in with A-x suited seeing if I can get a flush or flush draw out of it. If an A hits the board I will check/fold. Not even going to fool with that.

If someone raises I'd fold. This is a speculative hand that I will play for cheap.

I'm not sure, but is A2-A5 considered as Arag?

This wil work imo - don't forget A2-5 straight possibilities.

i play em few and far between. only for cheap, position bets, etc
they are more valuable, obviously, when there are fewer people at the table.
too many people overplay their hands. IMO

I think a lot depends on your style of play.

I would probably not limp with Ace rag unless there were a lot of people in the pot and I was in late position. I would guess I would fold alot in early position when the blinds are low.

Later in tourny I would raise lots with ace rag - then see what happens.

I like to play Arag suited most of the time, but again no different to what I have already said.

In FR generally i stay away, my worst hand... ugly possibilities at every turn lol. give me connectors instead please.

yes. Though they are more playable than A6-A9. A6 is the worse A, even suited imo.

I tend away from playing any raggy A, can get you in a lot of trouble. But SO many others just luv any A, get a read if possible. I like big Aces, suited if possible, and can get away from the hand easily, when I miss the board.

Anyway, I cream a lot of ace luvvers, when they have "kicker issues". Bottom line, if you fold your ace-rag, you'll probably be better off.

Having said that, T2 has been the winning hand in the WSOP, twice, and even 74o, has won, so what do I know. Headsup is a little different...

This is a really interesting thread. I am always confused on whether or not I should play my A 4 (or and Arags, which I now know is the name for this card combination). I normally play pretty tight, and will fold Arags if I get them, but, after reading this and seeing to many straight, flush, Flopped aces or flopped 2 pair missed because I felt this hand was too weak to consider. I'm going to start limping more in early position and, if I hit suited, raise 3-4bb pre-flop and see what I can make of some Arags.

This is good advise and all players would do well to follow it. The number of guys I play against who play ARag is incredible. When they hit the pair with the Rag they then want to hang in there hoping for trips or 2 pair and invariably end up losing. Occasionally they win and this is the hand they always remember which is what draws them back the next time they get an ARag.

ace rags are horrible. they're hands that are likely to lose you money. Aces are only good during heads up.

I only play ace rag if I am in good position. On the buuton or right before the button. It also depends on how many players behind you fold.

A lot of people are over valuing position right now. Playing Arag doesn't have much to do with position. The issue with the hand is that you have to make tons of tough decisions, because you are often out kicked. Even in position, you are going to be frequently out kicked, and even if someone bets into you, it's very hard to get away from the hand if an ace hits the board. With regards to Arag, position doesn't really mean much.

i never raise with ace rag in general even if im the button i dont see the point ive seen alot of players who dont raise with ace 10 and up these are mostly tight players and unless i hit aces up i usually dont call after the flop if a ace hits anyways unless im the chip leader and kno i got the best hand i limit myself with ace rag unless there suited anyways nice post tho

To me, position does count. You may start bleeding too many chips if you play them early pos and have to keep folding to raises around. Know your table. In late pos, you already have an idea where the hand will stand, barring raise actions by the btn and blinds.

If I can see a flop cheap, I'm always interested in seeing if a suited A,rag will hit the flush or good fl draw. Then it's decision time. Anytime just A hits the board, you always know you're in a trouble spot with a bad kicker.

For me, it's not that hard to get away from a flopped Ace. I'm only looking for a flopped str8, flush or two pair. Anything less, a fold is easy. But that's just nitty ol' me ...

I'm not saying to play them OOP, I'm saying not to play them regardless of position. That being said, if you can get away from your ace when you're beat, kudos, but at the same time, you can't fold it every time you don't make 2 pair or better, because people will pick up on that and start bluffing you to death. Anyway, my point is, over the long run, playing ace/rag (IMO of course) generally is not a profitable play from any position (this coming from someone who is routinely willing to play 45s on the button).

I try to stay away from these hands when raised but it depends depends on position and my stack and wheter they r suited

Whether or not it's suited shouldn't really make a difference. The odds of flopping a flush with 2 suited cards are 0.842%.

these are cars that have and will always be trouble for all pker players if played at all i normally will not call anything but the bb with any ace rag and that depends on how large the blinds are and how deep into the tourney i am. why would ya want to take a risk at losing your life in a tourney for such a contraversial hand where most times you are crossing your fingers at every turn. play only what you can get away from easily and hands that give you an edge on winning the pot.
the secret (in my opinion) to winning tournies is to fold 70 percent of your hands for instance out of 130 hands you should only play about 27 or so unless you have a good run of course but that is rare. ARAG many people have lost their tournies to these hands dont be one of them.

depends on my stack and blinds, If I can limp in with ace rag I will, because sometimes you will flop 2 pair or a set with the rag and have the best kicker, but if there is a raise i usually fold ,poker can be brutal...smiling good luck at the tables. Tina

This is incorrect. If you have A6 or better, there is more chance that somebody will NOT have an ace with a higher kicker. With A6 ten handed, the probability that someone will have an ace with a higher kicker is less than 48.5%. In 9 handed, which is usually a full table online, with A5, the chances that someone has an ace with a higher kicker is 49%. If you have A9, nine handed, there is less than 29% chance that somebody has an ace with a higher kicker.

Thanks for the math GDRileyx. Now i might call a flop with an A9 A8 if i spike my ace. I would throw away to reraise to easily dominated.

Thanks for your strategy ... hopefully you won't mind a little counterpoint to your post.

Actually the chances of this are kinda remote. However a top pair weak kicker type of hand to the river is rarely good in a typical hand of Hold'em.



I guess we're talking tournament strategy then? I don't remember you posting whether this was a universal theory or just for cash/tournament play. Anyways, I disagree with this for either. A good player in late position will simply isolate-raise you, cbet the flop, and win your money. Fold your ace-rag from EP 100% of the time.

In late position such as the button or cutoff, you should be stealing with Ace-anything darn near everytime. Like 99% of the time in a cash game especially. Limp/Calling with Ax offsuit anytime ever is just a bad idea. There are some very remote exceptions.

Quote:

Suit – If your Ace Ragz cards are suited then you have a few more options. If the blinds are low then you should most likely limp in early.

Again I respectfully disagree. Same reason above.

Quote:

If you’re raised by someone later on in the game, whether you stay in depends on the player that raised. Fold if he’s tight and call if he’s loose and raise if there are two or more loose ones calling. Either they’ll call you with krap or they’ll fold, either way you would tend to fair better against them because not only do you have an Ace you have the potential to pop a flush too.

I think either way you're basically flush-mining and that's a terrible idea. The odds of flopping just a flush draw are 1 in 11 roughly. The odds of flopping a flush are less than 1%. How is this a good idea? With more people in the hand the less likely your Ax hand will be good for top pair even. Again, I respectfully disagree.

Your math is right, but that doesn't make it a profitable play. Your implied odds with Arag are horrible. If you hit your ace and your pair with a weak kicker is good, you probably won't win much anyway, because any hand you are beating has mid pair at best. Therefore, they won't bet much or call much anyway.

You might be surprised at how often A7, A8 or A9 stacks somebody with a smaller ace who is trying to represent a better hand. Especially in live cards. A lot of donkeys have trouble laying down an ace preflop, and even more trouble laying down if one or two aces hit the board.

This doesn't even mention the payoff you get from AK or AQ, on a flop like A79, when you played A7 or A9.

I hardly ever play A6 and lower, but those three middle-size aces (A7-A9) are severely underestimated. I think it's a big mistake to lump them in with other hands in the category of ace-rag.

I'm not saying to play them in pots that are raised preflop, or even to limp with them in early position. But, in late position they are very playable. They can pay off big, and they are real easy to get away from when they miss the flop, or get raised behind.

What icemonkey said is spot on imo

In early position i'm only playing AQ+ and thats pushing it, i sometimes even throw away AQ utg, because i absolutely hate playing it out of position, suppose you raise to 4bb's utg and a regular 15/10 player 3bets you, what do you do there, 4bettings a bit crazy because your then starting to play for stacks with AQ, you could already be behind to AK for all you know?? Say you flat call and the flop comes Q high are you really going to be comfortable getting it all in with tptk?? It might be too nitty but i think AQ can give you a lot of problems in a hand and as with all the other ace rag hands against good players your either going to win a small pot or lose a big one.

I'm surprised that nobody's mentioned A10 here as that was a hand i had a lot of problems with when i was first starting out, you kinda get the feeling its a good hand because you don't instantly class it as ace rag but i've changed how i play it completely, in ep i insta-fold it, mp i might stick out a raise but if i get any resistance i'm chucking it, in lp if a couple of fish have limped in ep then i might put out a raise to isolate them or even just take down the dead money, depending on how the blinds play.

Tournament strategy is different but now that ive moved to cash games i'm very wary when playing even AK or AQ, they just have a tendency to hit tptk or tpgk and i see a lot of players playing for big pots with those hands when a lot of experienced guys will tell you your better off not playing for stacks without at least a set.

I still play them aggressively and obviously dont mind getting them lol but if i meet any strong resistance then i'm still at the stage where i'm finding it hard to fold tptk so it's best for me to avoid them.

Just my 2c's worth

Position is more important than your cards, so yeah it matters. button or CO should be nearly always a raise if folded to. With Arag there are many less combinations of 3bet hands since an A is gone so in that sense its better than others to raise.

Big problem with Arag is that if you hit your ace most people wont pay you off with worse so its hard to get money unless you get 2 pair plus. But on the button its a good hand to steal with.

These are easy folds in EP however, again, people dont put much money in the pot of an A high board if they cant beat Arag and you cant really call a raise OOP with it.

I DONT KNOW ABOUT U GUYS BUT I HAVE FOUND I PRESSERVE MORE CHIPS DURING A TOURNEY ESPECIALLY 1000 PLUS ENTRANT MTT BY FOLDING THE MAJORITY OF MY ACES I EVEN FOLD ACE JACK AND ACE TEN ALOT OF THE TIME ESPECIALLY IF THERE IS A RAISER IN FRONT OF ME. ....IVE BEEN DOIN BETTER BY DOIN THIS I HAVE BEEN CASHING MORE OFTEN IN THE FT 2700 100 DOLLAR FR'S....SCINCE IVE BEEN DOIN THIS

I generally completely agree about position (to the extent that I'll play hands like 68 from the button if there's no raise), but IMO this is the exception. Arag is a hand that is easily and often dominated. If an ace hits, it's very hard to get someone off of a better ace than yours, and if it doesn't hit then you don't really have a hand. Regardless of position, Arag is a hand where you stand little to gain and a lot to lose, so you're better off folding it at a full table. If you're short handed, then maybe you can play it because people in general will play looser, but at a full table, unless the table is very tight, I'd just fold it regardless of position or suit.

You mentioned that you only call in early when the blinds are low, but that is usually irrelevant. When you play a hand when the blinds are lower, you either win lower or lose lower, and when the blinds are higher you either win higher or lose higher, so statistically you would be winning or losing to the same ratio in relation to the size of the blinds. Ofcourse if you have 500 chips and the blinds are 300 150 you dont have much of a choice and this might be your only chance back so in those cases the call would be acceptable. About the suited Arag... that is the usuall bad excuse for many poker players: "ohh i was playing that hand cause it was suited!!".. the suits only give a small upgrade to your hand, and it should not be the soul purpose of a call instead of a fold.
So anyway good luck and have a good day at the tables .