Is this true?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/n...ling-laws.html

So you mean pokerstars and fulltilt have been found by the united states government to be doing illegal activity ? I thought everyone supported these sites here on cardschat>

Everyone here even the respected members here that I respect and have learned allot from said these sites are to be trusted and they would have to much to loose from doing something illegal. I can't believe this. It's like a slap in the face to all of us.

maybe search around a bit more on internet & you'll see why they were doing what they were doing?? (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time).

How would this reflect on CC members saying these sites are to be trusted? (pretty sure people have known for a long time that US has been trying to shutdown online pokerzz for quite some time)

They found ways around a dumbass law that no thinking person supports anyway. Illegal ? Not in the countries where they are based, nor in any place where common sense still holds sway.

I understand what your saying . So they where money laundering because why ? Money laundering is suspicious illegal activity to me. I will keep reading more to understand this money laundering . Thanks for your reply.

I'm surprised at all the players that are looking at those charges and not understanding the story behind them.

Did they break the law-allegedly, and a hypocritical, exemption-ridden, passed in the middle of the night as a rider to the Safe Port Act law at that. But if they didn't, no US players would have been able to deposit or withdraw.

Calling it fraud and money-laundering just makes it sound awful. As does saying illegal internet gambling.

I don't consider playing poker, gambling, it's a risk, no different than investing. I do consider those grannies on social security legally buying lottery tickets online "internet gambling" tho.

Give me time to understand . I am reading still and posting this up so i can understand. I am not hot nor cold on this. So I am luke warm which gives me patience and a open mind. Thanks for your one sided post. keep them coming.

This statement you made, " (pretty sure all the peeps who were able to deposit & withdraw funds all this time.. many making a good living playing online poker, weren't too upset about getting money all this time)." has nothing to do about the article I posted. nothing at all

Wow it is going to be so interesting to hear what Chad Elie , John Campos and others will tell about more details of these sites and how they are operating.

We might get some real juicy inside stuff !!!!

What's one-sided about it? The UIGEA made it illegal for U.S. Financial Institutions to transfer money to and from "illegal internet gambling sites". Because the poker sites used 3rd party poker payment processors for deposits and withdrawals, they are saying that was "fraud" and "money-laundering" because the banks didn't know they were originating with poker sites.

While there allegedly were also issues with unscrupulous payment processors, that is a separate issue and not why the U.S. Government is going after the major sites.

Take a breather geez. Your all over everyone on this site calm down please.

I think PO was dead on relevant on what you posted. And, BTW it is all very relevant to the article you posted. Take PO's advice use Google and read a little.

I guess being clueless does allow one to be neutral.

Since UIGEA its been illegal to handle any payments for poker in the US. So in order for US players to play, someone had to be breaking the law because UIGEA is the law preventing the anyone for handling these payments.

Money laundering, fraud etc etc.. but not even one customer has been defrauded.

The money laundering and fraud all centres around how they got US money from US banks onto the the pokersite.

Usually for a fraud to take place, someone has to lose out. However in this case everyone involved got exactly what they expected.

Had UIGEA not been passed, there would have been no need to commit fraud.

The timing of this whole thing is ridiculous. They have decided to crack down on the sites just as states are beginning the process of legalising online poker. The second it became legal, all of the fraud would have stopped!

This is my thread and I wanted peoples opinions on my link I posted . Thanks for your time.

Thanks for your time and input on my thread. So what is your speculation of this ill timed aggression on the sites ? I agree that would be stupid to do that at this time ! Maybe their is another reason for doing this ? maybe the goverment knows something we don't . Could you consider that?

He was right to tell me to read a little . But I was not talking about that statement. Also i told you please when replying to my thread or anyones it's respectful to talk about what the OP is asking. In this case its your thoughts on the article . Thanks

I dont really know.

There are a few theories floating around.

All Ill say is that outside the US its business as normal. I was on FT earlier this evening, its like nothing has happened.

yeah, sorry US guys, but as Stu said, its business as usual at FT/PS and UB for the rest of the world. been playing all evening on all three, everything's fine for me. traffic is down, 52000 players currently at FT, thats way low, right, for this time of week? PS has 172000, are all the US on the play money tables?

Are all the players on play money ahahahaha. Thanks for the laugh. I actually sell about 90 bucks a week from play money chips . Now i guess I have to do it through paypal. Maybe I should shut down completely.

I can't wait to see some good media stories after the arrested get interviewed . Man its going to be so interesting .

My understanding of it so far is that, because US banks wouldn't accept cheques or transfers from online gambling sites the payouts had to be made through a third party. These third parties were set up to make sure players could get their funds. The players were receiving there funds, if they weren't there would have been all sorts of posts across the internet. So while not sticking to the letter of the law PS and FT were not defrauding their players.

The bit I have trouble understanding was this bit.

The only thing I can put this down to is that the US government think they are owed this amount in unpaid tax.

Thanks for your input

Nevada Gov. Brian Sandoval said the allegations made by federal prosecutors against the three companies were of "grave concern." But he added that he remained committed to the possibility that federal legislation will eventually permit Internet gambling in a way that matches the same rigorous standards that apply to traditional gaming institutions.

ohhh the sites would be regulated by the US ... That would be very good for us players .

Only if you like paying US taxes.

Very many of the world`s poker sites are based in the UK or UK dependant territories and therefore already operate in a regulated environment. One suspects that the only reason that doesn`t suit the US is because they don`t make money from it.

So pokerstars is working from in the UK Dependant territories? Cool I all ways thought it was from some island far from laws lol.. Thanks for your info. So they get regulated to! Like Las vegas casino's get regulated. Thats awesome ! Thanks man for this. I all ways thought that strict regulations didn't exist like that.

So because pokerstars gets regulated so well , you think the people who regulate pokerstars had something to do with The United states gov finding these illegal activities.

Thanks again.

A Thread is is a stream of conversation that is driven by an original poster's post. Interaction and conversation between members of a forum. Not everything posted in a thread has to directly be about the original post.

But. thanks for telling me how I may respond to a thread Scarecrow.

+1. I lold.

One would assume that this crackdown by DoJ will be bad for the 'playchip sales' & that competition on the playchip tables will go up considerably.

I wonder how all this will affect the sales of playchips. I mean there's prolly gonna be a flood of them in the marketplace which would lead me to assume that sales could drop off considerably. Any thoughts on this OP? Any speculation?
sidenote (sorry if this doesn't relate to your orig. post... but seeing as it was in one of 'your' posts on here I figured it'd be okay with ya??)
Would be cool to see a statement with $90/wk. comin' from playchip sales.... maybe in bragpost/badbeat section or somethin'... prolly a record of sorts

Again , I wanted to know your thoughts about the story I put up. But your just acting childish now. Please stop

Hahaha 90.00 bucks a week from play money is not bragging lol.. people sit at plo play money with 1 million chips and get to 50 bucks in one session sometimes a few hands . hahaha so 90 bucks in one week is hardly bragging. Nice try kid.

Could you explain how this play money thing works please

The whole reason this issue has come to light is because the US is not seeing any money from the poker sites (other than TV ads etc.)
The US (and the Vegas casinos) want to regulate and tax the poker community and once they do legalize it they have said they will license companies to operate in the US market. France did the same thing not long ago.

They have said that their plan is to have both US and international companies apply for licenses but there will be a 6 month waiting period for non US companies to receive their licenses and of course any company suspected of fraud or illegal operations (PS and FTP) might not get permission.

I have no problem playing at a licensed (and taxed) US website as long as I don't get raped with fees and rakes.
This is still up in the air and we won't know till they pass the law.

Meanwhile we have funds from US players being held up by the sites because they can't issue refunds without compiling their guilt in the eyes of the DOJ.

Maybe we should write to our representatives and let them know we want our money back

Check out this blog, he has a good idea
http://thchassomethingtosay.blogspot.com/

I will be writing to let my views be heard, I suggest any other US players that want to continue playing online poker check it out for themselves.

Thanks for your post. It was very easy to understand. One thing though. Now I understand why the ill timed aggression from the FBI. Makes sense. One thing though is maybe the FBI by doing this they might find out more information on the operations of these sites and uncover more stuff that the players would benefit from knowing. Hope they don't uncover anything that would upset me about online poker. But if they do then I will be happy that they did all this, even if it was for greedy reasons.

You can do a search of play money on here. But in short you sell your play money to people that play on the bigger play money tables that run out of play money. They don't want to start out with only 1,000 play chips and sit at the small tables for weeks or months to get back to their friends at the big tables.
So they sit at a table with me and transfer pokerstars real money to my pokerstars account while where at the same table. People also Like to play the biggest play money buy in 1 table sit n go's which is 200,000 play chips so they run out quickly. And then you have people that buy play chips from me because they have a idiot that would buy from them for much more ! . People have sites where you can buy from them but you get very little for your chips. You have to make friends with people that buy from which is hard because the rules of the sites are that you cannot talk about selling your play chips in the chat box. So I have made friends with people over a period of time (genuine friends I might add) and we talk on facebook .

But now with this FBI thing you have to do it through pay pal.

The sites where you can sell and buy chips are doing it through pay pal also.

Just google buy and selling of pokerstar play chips and you'll hit some sites.

~nexus6

Some would think it is the other way around.

You been following me and trying to get back at me after we talked on the mega rigged thread . You where their sitting and waiting for the rigged people to post up something so you can make fun of them and feel good about yourself.

I posted on their about how I was happy weather it's rigged or not ! And you jumped the gun and looked really stupid and I pointed it out to you and your pissed about it. Now you follow me every where.

Here is how it went down.


Nexus6
CardsChat Regular

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Rancho cucamonga ,CALIFORNIA
Plays at: ultimatebet
Game: HOLDEM
Posts: 428
I could careless if its rigged I love playing online poker and I could careless if I loose or win I sell my play money for pokerstar cash all the time . Then I go play sit n go's and I practice passive aggressive style or ultra tight or ultra loose. All while I collect data about players. All for free weeeee!!

I will say this , When I play sit n go's I notice all most every time someone is very short stack and the short stack player go's all in showing kings preflop the caller which calls because their in the big blind and its only a few more chips has 5 2 off suit sure enough the big stack catches the amazing win.. Happens so much . I used to say something like theirs time management software at its finest and everyone would laugh. Thats the only reason I would say it just to make everyone laugh

I am proud to say I play stress free with out a care in the world when I am playing poker online.

I can't wait tell they pass the law so that our government can check out this random card generator if thats all possible..

But no hurry I am playing for free
__________________
and here is your childish response,



"You've definitely posted in the right thread."

And here is me using humor to point out how childish you are because I read on all your other posts making fun of peoples opinions on the rigged thread,




Yeah its hilarious to see people that keep replying to every new post on this thread lol after saying this is a stupid thread etc etc but yet they keep coming back and following up on every new post. So funny lol..

Like a 12 year old little brat would do on a school play ground

Only reason that these people are so upset at this is because people are putting their own money in online poker sites with out even being sure that on line poker is not rigged.

Which is reasonable ! I mean If I put money into online poker and I was a small winning player or break even player or loosing player I would get upset at some saying ," Look fool its rigged !" lol...

But I'm no suckar I play for free

Hey keep up the good work on this thread I'll see you back in class when the bell rings.

And here is you replying and trying to make fun of me by saying I should be playing for real money blah blah blah . When I never bragged . Playing for play money we all know is entirely Different. lol and my reply to this also as follows


Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Rancho cucamonga ,CALIFORNIA
Plays at: ultimatebet
Game: HOLDEM
Posts: 428
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poker Orifice
Pretty cool to hear the assumptions you've made as to what others 'must' be thinking on here. That's f'n awesome. I seriously think you're wasting your obv. talents by farting around with pennies when you could obv. be raking in shitloads... whether it be rigged or not (there'd be nothing to risk... I could see alot of folks racing to stake someone with your uncanny abilities).

Nexus6 reply
I did not assume anything I just saw people stalking this thread for any new posts so they can reply to them and tell them their piece of mind.

Just like a little wanna be bully would do at a elementary school play ground looking to pick on people he didn't like lol.. Yes its hilarious

Who told you I had talent/uncanny abilities IN POKER to rake, what did you say? Oh shitloads...

Nexus6
You like many people talk with a double edged tongue. (hiss hiss like a snake)

Don't go making me believe that. I hate ugly thoughts on people,, Makes me sad But if you continue talking to me with a double edged tongue than I must drop our conversation. Cause I promised my self I would stay away from soulless people. I still believe in you though...
__________________
So poker orifice,

Bottom line your the one who was watching the mega rigged thread to make fun of people and I came up and posted about being safe by playing play money and making a little cash to learn the game.

So your the childish one , your the weak one. You have allot of growing up to do and if you ever want to be a noble person you better work on it like you work on your poker game.

Nexus6