Opinions on bar poker

Hi Folks, I have not been here in ages and thought I would check in and say hi.

I wanted to get some opinions from you guys on playing free bar poker. I like running multi-table tournies so I was thinking of approaching bars in my area to ask if they would like this as a service. ie. I charge them nominal amount to run free poker tournies and offer prizes such as poker coins and buildup of points that eventually lead to seat in a WPT tourny.

I know of a few leagues that do this already and they sem to be doing ok, WPT Amateur League and RHPT-Red Hot Poker Tour. These are points leagues and do not play for cash as it's illegal to do this in Canada.

Do any of you guys participate in these and what are your views.

Much thanks for your honest opinions.

As a consumer, it's something I'd like to participate in.

However it seems like a lot of work to run successfully. Assuming you hold 50 of these events, you need to pull in $200 per event for the $10k WSoP Main event, even with no extra $ for travel.

I guess you could give a $2,500 package, a $1,000 WSoP buy-in with $1,500 for expenses.

But you're going to have to give out other smaller prizes to keep people interested, so there's more money you need to charge the bars, and the more money the less they'll want to participate.

I'd be afraid of offering a big prize a the end, then have participation drop so the bars start canceling, so then you wind up short of funds at the end and have to cover out-of-pocket.

Its more common to offer a bar tab for a set amount as the prize because the bar in question can offer you this at a discount. So a bar might offer you a $50 bar tab for $40 (to be used as a prize) Its just better business for you that way.

They are unlikely to pay you for the service.

You get what you make from charging people to play.

They get bar sales.

If no one turns up.. they don't part with any money.

If the taxman turns up.. its nothing to do with them.. you handled all of the cash!

If you dont advertise it correctly.. its you who pays for all the ads anyway.

Once they pay for the service, they get tied into the admin side of things.. which they just want to avoid

We actually have A LOT of that going on in my area. I have no idea how much the establishments pay the "host" if you will, but it has to be decent, or they wouldn't do it.

We have several sports bars and a few topless... er... I mean... Gentlemen's... clubs which use this service.

However, since poker is illegal in Texas still, the game must be free for all entrants, and only prizes (such as gift cards) are awarded, no cash exchanges hands between the establishment and/or the players.

I don't wanna be a downer, but my experience (having dealt for a company that does exactly this) is that these kind of events are usually a nightmare to run.

If you strike it really lucky and get a venue where there's loads of punters who want to come and play then you can do OK. Keep in mind though that most venues will want you to run the games midweek when they're normally quiet so you'll have to think about how you're going to promote the events, how much that is going to cost you...

Savage has a point about the prizes too, I maybe wouldn't aim that high until you're sure of the amount you're pulling in. Bar tabs are a pretty common prize here too.

The ones that work really well here are the ones that have a big operation backing them up - they're running maybe a hundred events a week in different venues (some all around the country) which means they've got the resources to do proper promotion and offer big prizes.

An alternative is ignoring bars altogether and setting yourself up to do private events like bucks nights.

played in league called series 7, was fun played for points,they gave away a wsop seat once a year in a big tourney, small prize tourneys every so often, still play once in a while to get out of house, but running one can be a big headache, unruly players, players not buying anything in bar(peeps going to car at breaks to eat,drink), demanding bar owners, not trying to deter you but its not all fun and games

Around here in NJ, they have the World Poker Tavern and it’s very popular. If a player cant make the hour drive to Atlantic City or the 2-hour drive to Foxwoods, it’s a nice way to get your need to play live poker in cheaply. I play at times as an excuse to meet some mates and have a drink outside the house. The prizes are a $15-$20 Gift Certificate to the attached restaurant for 1st and a tee shirt for 2nd. After a few wins you bring the fam down for breakfast.

When I was living in Colorado there was a bar that had poker every week. I don't think that the person who ran it got money for it, but I never asked. I think the guy worked for the bar tho. The prizes were like a 50$ bar tab or something like that. I think there was a points system or something tho, that might have had a top prize but I can't really remember anymore. Or they had a couple special tourneys with bigger prize packages sometimes, not too sure tho....it was before I started playing poker alot, wish I would have played lol. Never got a chance too

oh it was free to play also....i forgot to mention

Bar poker is for drunks...people who hate their 9 to 5, and synthetic opiate addicts. If you want to buy or sell pharmaceuticals then have fun. Can also be a place to play all night for nothing except a bar tab. Not very good EV IMHO.

IMO, your an idiot

I play in the catering room of our Outback Steakhouse, Its a great game with quality people. most of which are commuters to Manhattan who work on Wall Street or in the Garment Dist. Its like Yuppie central, a far cry from your obviously limited perspective.

Not my experience either.

And the EV can vary greatly depending on the game - ones that offer big prizes at the end of the season can be greatly +EV, especially if they were free to enter in the first place.

They're like any other game, you assess what it's going to cost you, what the potential rewards are and take it from there.

I think, when it comes to bar poker, you also asses what "fun" equals in (person) EV. You could 1) got to a bar a drink, or 2) go to a bar and drink AND play a free game of poker, which may also award you a prize... looks like #2 is the winner. I'm not a bar-fly myself, but if I were, I would gravitate towards the bars which offer free poker.

3.) will be given additional chips with every drink bought.

people would go to the bar to play poker and not even drink anything.....if you win someting for a free game of poker, than how is that -ev? or even going to be not fun? The group I would see play wasn't full of opiate addicts as far as I know ROFL....

I would absolutely do this -- however, I live in NYC and I don't think bars here do this. Hell, when I moved here, dancing wasn't legal in bars.

A friend who lives in the middle of the country has a regular bar where he plays.

I was of course being sarcastic. I guess for me it looks like -EV...but that's cuz it's too easy to take ppl's money at home on the internet. Good luck with bar poker-

Ok. I am starting a tourny in a bar next week every Wed.

For anyone in my neck of the woods (Canada/North end of Toronto) here is the info to sign up..

http://poker.meetup.com/1408/calendar/11380116/

The bar coughed up $100 Gift Certif plus I got some poker card protectors (Coins) I am giving away.

Should be a fun nite of poker..

If you can find a bar that will let you do this, this is how it's is done in most places.

The bar puts up the prize pool. The patrons put up nothing, but here's the catch. The patron MUST buy a food voucher for $10-$15-$20 and then there is a buffet, for all to eat. Buffets are cheap, especially if you use alot of pastas. You can feed 50-100 people for like $2-$3 a piece. That would leave plenty of money for the prize pool.

"The patron puts up nothing" those are the key words that the law wants to know. Everyone in advance must be on the same page on how this works. You can't be telling people that the money from the buffet goes to the prize pool. The bar HAS to put the money up for this to be legal.

There are a few bar leagues near me but I tend to stay away from them. The bars run them for obvious reasons to sell drinks. I have seen too many problems which develop through the drink. I have no problem with drinking but I do not think it mixes ell with poker when emotions can get a bit high.

Entry : Free to everyone
When: Every Wednesday Night - registering at 7:15PM
Starting Chips: 10,000
Blinds: Raise every 15 minutes
Extra Chips: +500 chips for each $5 food/drink purchase
Prizes: ZIO Meal Gift certificate[$100.00 ZIO Certificate 1st Prize], Brass coin

There are a couple of bar poker places where I live- I have only played once, but have observed a few times. When it comes down to it, I would rather play on-line, at home tournaments with friends or take a trip down to Tunica.

At the bars near me, the nightly games are played tournament style and players are given points for where they finish. At the end of the monthm there's a tournament and the top 10 get cash prizes, gift certificates, etc. Play is free, but players are strongly encouraged to tip the wait staff, buy beverages (there are always specials), etc.

The quality of play and the efficiency of the operation tends to vary from night to night. Sometimes you have inexperienced dealers and the people forget to increase the blinds because they haven't been paying attention to the tournament clock. Sometimes there's too much going on in the bar for the defacto tournament director to pay attention to what's going on. And I have seen a couple of instances where string bets are allowed and the dealer misreads the winning hand(s).

It's a nice way to get some live experience for free in if you don't have a casino near-by, but caveat emptor.

I played one last night. It was a different place that I've played before.

The guy running it would splash people's stacks if he walked up in the first blind and you had a drink with you.

Quality of play varied widely as everybody says. Lots of limping and trapping. First three blinds were easy pickings, then the all-in shovefest started. I played tight and won huge pots with KK, QQ. At the end of the first hour I had a nice big stack.

Final table was strange. Players were all fairly competent, but the play was still really weak. Three hands stood out to me:

I was in the cutoff, Blinds 2K/4K. Guy that ran the tournament had been throwing bluffs at me for three hands in a row prior. I had Kh8h and he limped in front of me. Short-stack to my left prematurely ejaculated As4s shove before I could act. I was getting tired, drunk and stupid, and pushed all-in for about 20K. Tournament guy called for 90% of his stack. He turned over 66, I hit a King on the turn, and cleaned up. Guy two to my left starts telling me I made a bad play. I just shrugged and mumbled something about being on tilt because of all the bluffing.

Not much later, it was heads up between me and the poker critic. I had him well covered. He won three all-in's against me with various hands, and then I was short-stack. Blinds were 5K/10K I looked down on the button and saw Js8s... I called the blind, he checked, flop was Q, 10, 8 rainbow. Check/check, turn Ks, and I shoved for 42K. He immediately went into the tank and started TALKING... I leaned back in my chair and just smiled. He kept saying "I think I have you" "Your 10 is no good"... It was all I could do to not just bust out laughing. I told him that he was talking himself into calling. He asked if I would show, I said yes. He folded...

I ended up taking most of his chips the next hand on a bottom straight draw, (Q7 me QJ him, all-in preflop by both, 7-10 rivered straight) and almost mucked my hand before the spectators saved me... Poker critic was pissed... but in the end admitted he was wrong. Ended up winning the whole thing on the next hand all-in blind and was delt QQ. Poker critic had to catch up with me afterwards and tell me how much poker he plays and why he should have won... blah, blah, blah.

Drunk, tired, and winner... I had a blast. Just play it like the OFC freeroll or any 1/2NL cash table, and you will be fine.

I thought I would update you on my progress with Bar Poker. I started a league called ZPT Poker Tour. I now have 4 nights in 3 different bars. We have membership of 69 now and highest players is 34 so far.

It seems this is a profitable venture so far and seems it will grow very large in time. I am also offering ZPT franchises so that others can use my infrastructure, and guidance to profit from this themselves if they like to run poker.

Cheers
http://poker.meetup.com/1408

These events are a gas!
It gives a great opportunity for new and old poker players to fine tune their game, with zero risk and a big prize at the end of the year keeps it very competitive.
Good on you for setting one up

In Massachusetts and Rhode Island there is a group called Eastern poker tour. It is bigger in Rhode Island and southeast Massachusetts, but reaches as far west as Worsester, Ma.
They run tournaments every evening at a different Pub on the different days of the week. These are free to play in, all that is asked is you purchase the buffet from the pub.
They have excellent prizes, including trips to WSOP in Vegas. I am a member but have yet to participate in any of the games. Waiting for them to get a little closer to my hometown in Ct. I do follow the results of the games online and through the newsletters. There are some games with about 20 participants and then some with 40-50.
I suggest anyone in the vicinity of Worcester, Ma. to Providence, RI, and to the Cape check it out at easternpokertour.com
They also have some excellent charity events, cash buy ins, the newest is $10,000 guarantee.
Really worth a looksee

Illegal to set up tournaments playing for cash in Canada? Actually you can set up touranemtns.... but there are alot of restrictions/guidelines (there's a book you can get for it).
My nextdoor neighbour sets up tournaments in the small town I live in, and we get 100+ entrants twice a month with between $55 & $75 buyin. He's been running these for a long time and knows all the details. If you have questions (ie. where to obtain the guidelines/restrictions from) I could go nextdoor & ask him. He also holds some other tournaments here (aside from these regular ones)...ie. putting one on for the local hockey team as a fund raiser.... buyin was $100 and had over 150 entrants (a percentage of the prizepool has to go towards the hockey team... knowing him it's the bare minimum, lol).
Kinda cool having a neighbour in his 60's who's been playing poker for longer than I have (45+ yrs. for him), having put on numerous tournaments all over the place and having worked previously as a cardroom mgr. He's an online freak now as well... plays on a 50" plasma, kicked back on the couch. Also cool to have someone close by to bash around poker ideas... HH's, etc.

I'm sure you get something going as far as tournaments go in Canada... just some loopholes & hoops to jump through (ie. another one is.. you have to have dealers for each table, it's against the law to have the players deal at the table). We're lucky enough to have over a dozen who will volunteer here, although some of them have had to be schooled along the way.

With running a tournament league with a big prize as the main deal. I think you could run into problems if there's a couple of players who get way ahead of the rest in the pts. standings and could result in interest dropping off for the others. Maybe you can do a combination of prizes.... some being a bar tab or $$'s... and part going into a prizepool for final league prize??

What area are you in? Umm.... are you my neighbour??

Off topic.. OP..what is tigergaming because one of my email addresses is receiving emails from them... without my consent or request. Wondering where they originated from.....